Poll: Better 1,2, punch. Tatum, Sabonis or Brown, Tatum

[Moranis]

Brown>Sabonis but if I had to make a trade ( Say Jaylen wasn't going to resign here...) I'd do Jaylen for Sabonis, Davion Mitchell, and Keegan Murray plus picks. Works in trade machine.

that is a ridiculous trade.  That is the type of package you get for Tatum, not Brown.

Sabonis shoots better than Brown from not just 2 but also 3 (they are about even from the line).  He is a significantly better rebounder and may actually be a better passer.  He turns the ball over at basically the same rate.  Brown is certainly a better defender, but Brown has been getting worse defensively for years and isn't the elite defender he once was (I think some of that is an increased workload offensively has zapped some of his defensive energy).  By virtually every metric Sabonis is a better player and he doesn't play the same position as Boston's best player.  If Sacramento was offering Sabonis for Brown, I think Boston should do that, especially since another player would have to go to Boston to make the dollars work and the worst contract Sacto has is Holmes (who I'd be fine with as a guy in the Griffin type role even with him being overpaid).  So Sabonis and Holmes for Brown (maybe you include Gallo since he wouldn't play much).  I'd trade to get a 1st from them, but I'd be fine without it as I think Sabonis would work quite well with Tatum.

While I think there’s an argument to be made here either way, particularly given our guard depth, I know you just didn’t compare a guy who shoots 1.3 threes a game to a 7.3 threes a game player and say the former is the better shooter due to a slightly higher three point percentage haha That’s nonsense.

Outside of that, I generally agree with most of what you said. But Brown is by far the better shooter and overall scorer, particularly being a true 3 level scorer where Sabonis is a 1 level and tops 2 level scorer at best.

I’d only really consider such a trade if JB indicates he wants a bigger role and focus elsewhere, but I’d try other avenues first. For example, I think we’ll see Embiid ask out this year with another early exit from the playoffs, and I think I’d rather pursue using JB as the centerpiece in a package like that than go straight for Sabonis.

Brown is shooting 33.3% this year.  Obviously it is on way more attempts, but he is enough worse that to me that matters.  A solid 3% worse on the year.  That stuff matters.  Sabonis also shoots better from 16 feet to the 3 point line (and there they are much closer in the same amount of attempts).  Smart shoots a lot more 3 pointers than Sabonis also, but I don't think anyone would call him a better 3 point shooter than Sabonis. 

[jpotter33]

Brown>Sabonis but if I had to make a trade ( Say Jaylen wasn't going to resign here...) I'd do Jaylen for Sabonis, Davion Mitchell, and Keegan Murray plus picks. Works in trade machine.

that is a ridiculous trade.  That is the type of package you get for Tatum, not Brown.

Sabonis shoots better than Brown from not just 2 but also 3 (they are about even from the line).  He is a significantly better rebounder and may actually be a better passer.  He turns the ball over at basically the same rate.  Brown is certainly a better defender, but Brown has been getting worse defensively for years and isn't the elite defender he once was (I think some of that is an increased workload offensively has zapped some of his defensive energy).  By virtually every metric Sabonis is a better player and he doesn't play the same position as Boston's best player.  If Sacramento was offering Sabonis for Brown, I think Boston should do that, especially since another player would have to go to Boston to make the dollars work and the worst contract Sacto has is Holmes (who I'd be fine with as a guy in the Griffin type role even with him being overpaid).  So Sabonis and Holmes for Brown (maybe you include Gallo since he wouldn't play much).  I'd trade to get a 1st from them, but I'd be fine without it as I think Sabonis would work quite well with Tatum.

While I think there’s an argument to be made here either way, particularly given our guard depth, I know you just didn’t compare a guy who shoots 1.3 threes a game to a 7.3 threes a game player and say the former is the better shooter due to a slightly higher three point percentage haha That’s nonsense.

Outside of that, I generally agree with most of what you said. But Brown is by far the better shooter and overall scorer, particularly being a true 3 level scorer where Sabonis is a 1 level and tops 2 level scorer at best.

I’d only really consider such a trade if JB indicates he wants a bigger role and focus elsewhere, but I’d try other avenues first. For example, I think we’ll see Embiid ask out this year with another early exit from the playoffs, and I think I’d rather pursue using JB as the centerpiece in a package like that than go straight for Sabonis.

Brown is shooting 33.3% this year.  Obviously it is on way more attempts, but he is enough worse that to me that matters.  A solid 3% worse on the year.  That stuff matters.  Sabonis also shoots better from 16 feet to the 3 point line (and there they are much closer in the same amount of attempts).  Smart shoots a lot more 3 pointers than Sabonis also, but I don't think anyone would call him a better 3 point shooter than Sabonis.

Oh, come on, Mo. This is some serious cherry picking lol Beyond the clear discrepancy in volume this year, you’re focusing on this year because there’s not even an argument when looking at career numbers or any other year.

Sabonis has only had three seasons where’s he’s shot at least 2 threes per game, and his highest percentage in those years is 32%, which also happens to be his overall career number from three on 1.3 attempts per game. JB’s career number is 37% on over 5 attempts per game. In fact, the only other years beyond this year where Sabonis has shot at at least an average clip is 18 and 19, when he shot a whopping .5 and .2 three point attempts per game!

Also, regarding midrange shots I’m not sure what you’re looking at, but NBA.com has JB shooting more than 3x as many midrange jumpers (3.2 vs 1.0) as Sabonis while shooting a higher percentage (49.4 vs. 48.4). https://www.nba.com/stats/players/shooting?DistanceRange=By+Zone.

There’s just no rational argument that Sabonis is a better shooter than Brown. It’s hokum, and this is why attempts and context matter.

[gouki88]

Brown>Sabonis but if I had to make a trade ( Say Jaylen wasn't going to resign here...) I'd do Jaylen for Sabonis, Davion Mitchell, and Keegan Murray plus picks. Works in trade machine.

that is a ridiculous trade.  That is the type of package you get for Tatum, not Brown.

Sabonis shoots better than Brown from not just 2 but also 3 (they are about even from the line).  He is a significantly better rebounder and may actually be a better passer.  He turns the ball over at basically the same rate.  Brown is certainly a better defender, but Brown has been getting worse defensively for years and isn't the elite defender he once was (I think some of that is an increased workload offensively has zapped some of his defensive energy).  By virtually every metric Sabonis is a better player and he doesn't play the same position as Boston's best player.  If Sacramento was offering Sabonis for Brown, I think Boston should do that, especially since another player would have to go to Boston to make the dollars work and the worst contract Sacto has is Holmes (who I'd be fine with as a guy in the Griffin type role even with him being overpaid).  So Sabonis and Holmes for Brown (maybe you include Gallo since he wouldn't play much).  I'd trade to get a 1st from them, but I'd be fine without it as I think Sabonis would work quite well with Tatum.

That's what it would take for me to trade Jaylen. I only want a trade that makes us better.

Sabonis makes us better.

Except on defence, where we'd be worse

[Vermont Green]

When you compare Sabonis and Brown, it is hard to compare their defense.  The better question when considering Sabonis is to compare him to say Horford.  That is who Sabonis would replace, or RWill (very different style player).  If we traded Brown for Sabonis and whatever, Brown would be replaced by some other guard.

Sabonis would be a nice big to add.  No, he doesn't hit the 3 and he can't alley oop dunk like RWill, but he puts up 20 pts and 12 rebs pretty consistently.  He is also a very good passer, ball mover.  He is an all star level big, nothing to sneeze at.

In many ways, a skilled big suits our team better than a scoring wing.  We have Tatum, perhaps the best scoring wing in the game.  But the overall value we get still would have to match the high value that we have in Brown.  To me, Sabonis on his own does not have quite enough value.

I don't think we are trading Brown.  Maybe if we could get Towns.  I can't think of too many others.  And I don't think we would trade Brown for a hodgepodge of lesser players and picks.

[KG Living Legend]

When you compare Sabonis and Brown, it is hard to compare their defense.  The better question when considering Sabonis is to compare him to say Horford.  That is who Sabonis would replace, or RWill (very different style player).  If we traded Brown for Sabonis and whatever, Brown would be replaced by some other guard.

Sabonis would be a nice big to add.  No, he doesn't hit the 3 and he can't alley oop dunk like RWill, but he puts up 20 pts and 12 rebs pretty consistently.  He is also a very good passer, ball mover.  He is an all star level big, nothing to sneeze at.

In many ways, a skilled big suits our team better than a scoring wing.  We have Tatum, perhaps the best scoring wing in the game.  But the overall value we get still would have to match the high value that we have in Brown.  To me, Sabonis on his own does not have quite enough value.

I don't think we are trading Brown.  Maybe if we could get Towns.  I can't think of too many others.  And I don't think we would trade Brown for a hodgepodge of lesser players and picks.

 Its not even about that.  Ww could have drafted Sabonis, but people said you can't take hill at #3 , just to high.

[LilRip]

I dont have enough eye-test data on Sabonis but his stats have always been great. If we don’t win it all, maybe that shake up would be interesting, especially if Al starts looking old out there (he hasn’t). I just worry about the defense. Individual defense aside, is Sabonis a decent enough team defender?

Brown gives us another dynamic scorer to put beside Tatum. It’s hard to find players who can create their own shot.

On the other hand, Sabonis seems to make other players better and can help further unlock an already talented set of role players.

Tough call

[#1P4P]

Give me the pairing that has led the Celtics into deep playoff runs thrice… before their prime. A feat that has been achieved by a select few pairings in the history of the NBA.

This season, they’re the best scoring duo, top defenders at their position, and are leading the team that is top 4 on offense and defense and have all the signs of title contenders.