Are we waiting for a version of Kemba that doesn’t exist?

[Tr1boy]

I find it amazing that Donavon Mitchell and Kemba Walker are both 6’0” tall. Mitchell plays like he is 6’5” and is not intimidated by anyone. However, Kemba plays like he knows he’s small and doesn’t know how to play amongst the trees.

I can’t see Kemba accepting a role off the bench, or Brad even suggesting it. I would suggest making Kemba the shooting guard and playing off the ball. Help set screens for him, so he can get open/clean looks. He is not as explosive as he once was, and can’t get to his spots like he used to. He needs to adjust his game accordingly. No one is taking on his contract, so the Celtics have to figure out how to make this work.

Mitchell is about 6'3

He is about the same height/build/wingspan as Marcus Smart. Maybe a smidge shorter if anything

Walker is 5'11-6'0. Slender player

[Vermont Green]

First time poster, but been lurking for a while.  I'm not sure why this is the thread that has triggered me to post, but I just want to say that the overreaction in threads like this is... difficult to understand.  It's clear that the best version of this Celtics team will be to get Kemba playing like he did before the All-Star break last year, when he was a deserving starter averaging 22 points and 5 assists a game with an efficient (given his volume) 58 TS%.  We saw a bit of that Kemba through the first bit of the playoffs last year, but the overtime game against Toronto seemed to drain him, as through those first 7 games he average 23 and 4.5 with similar efficiency, before dropping to 17 points at far worse shooting percentages for the rest of the postseason.

It's clear Kemba was significantly injured for the end of last season, and that it recurred in the playoffs, given his offseason operation and delayed start to this year.  Certainly the Celtics should try to help Kemba return to that version, which we saw for three months barely a year ago, for a lot longer than 10 or so games.  This is especially true when 7 of them have been played on the road, which likely impacts the level of conditioning and off-day work Kemba can do, since the players pretty much aren't supposed to leave the hotel when they travel any more.

Will some facsimile of last year's Kemba ultimately return?  That's an open question, but there is zero reason to take any drastic measures at this juncture, such as trading him for role players or moving him to the bench.  Let him get his personal rhythm, let him get a rhythm with this improved version of the J's.  No one even knows the schedule beyond the next 11 games -- what is the hurry with posters here?

Good first post.  I will give you your first TP.

In another post, it was suggested that we could trade Kemba plus maybe Teague for Al Horford and George Hill.  How about that?  And leave it to OKC to get Kemba back?

[Celtics2021]

First time poster, but been lurking for a while.  I'm not sure why this is the thread that has triggered me to post, but I just want to say that the overreaction in threads like this is... difficult to understand.  It's clear that the best version of this Celtics team will be to get Kemba playing like he did before the All-Star break last year, when he was a deserving starter averaging 22 points and 5 assists a game with an efficient (given his volume) 58 TS%.  We saw a bit of that Kemba through the first bit of the playoffs last year, but the overtime game against Toronto seemed to drain him, as through those first 7 games he average 23 and 4.5 with similar efficiency, before dropping to 17 points at far worse shooting percentages for the rest of the postseason.

It's clear Kemba was significantly injured for the end of last season, and that it recurred in the playoffs, given his offseason operation and delayed start to this year.  Certainly the Celtics should try to help Kemba return to that version, which we saw for three months barely a year ago, for a lot longer than 10 or so games.  This is especially true when 7 of them have been played on the road, which likely impacts the level of conditioning and off-day work Kemba can do, since the players pretty much aren't supposed to leave the hotel when they travel any more.

Will some facsimile of last year's Kemba ultimately return?  That's an open question, but there is zero reason to take any drastic measures at this juncture, such as trading him for role players or moving him to the bench.  Let him get his personal rhythm, let him get a rhythm with this improved version of the J's.  No one even knows the schedule beyond the next 11 games -- what is the hurry with posters here?

Good first post.  I will give you your first TP.

In another post, it was suggested that we could trade Kemba plus maybe Teague for Al Horford and George Hill.  How about that?  And leave it to OKC to get Kemba back?

Isn't Hill out for at least the next month with a hand injury?  I don't see how making a panic trade for someone who literally can't play is superior to trying to let Kemba get his rhythm back.

Thank you for the TP.

[drooldaddy]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

[jambr380]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

This was most evident last night, but I think this has more to do with Utah's suffocating defense than Kemba losing a step. As others have mentioned, Kemba's body and movement actually look good; seems it is a matter of gaining back his confidence, acclimating to the speed of the NBA once again, and learning how to play as the 3rd option.

It is way too early to sell Kemba down the river. We have zero chance of contending unless he is pre-All-Star Kemba again, so it is better to try and let him work it out than bench him. If - at the end of the season - it is just not working out, then we can look to possibly deal him to a team that strikes out in FA. And just look around the league - nobody is untradable.

[Tr1boy]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

The "electricity" is not there

It looked promising the 1st game he returned from injury/stem cell injection.  But since that game, he has progressively looked slower.   It might be a mental matter,  but I doubt it.  Walker has always been known as a player with the "you can't stop me" mentality.  Counterpunch when team needs it.   

Either his knee is worn down to the point he just has adequate nba quickness.  Or he is in pain and can't push himself.  But won't disclose to anybody

In some ways I feel bad for the little guy.   Its like someone who has been an avid runner all their life.  And after a certain age, is unable to do so.  Its not easy to deal with

[Uncle_Stingfinger]

No. Lift.   Dude is toast.

[PhoSita]

As much as it sucks to have to watch another guy making >$30 million a year work his way through his struggles shooting and regaining confidence, I think it's really that simple.

Gotta push through the rough spots and have faith that he'll be back to being a valuable starting point guard by the time the playoffs roll around.

[colincb]

We have no choice, but to wait. He's not tradeable as-is unless you're willing to attach a boatload of picks.

[td450]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

This was most evident last night, but I think this has more to do with Utah's suffocating defense than Kemba losing a step. As others have mentioned, Kemba's body and movement actually look good; seems it is a matter of gaining back his confidence, acclimating to the speed of the NBA once again, and learning how to play as the 3rd option.

It is way too early to sell Kemba down the river. We have zero chance of contending unless he is pre-All-Star Kemba again, so it is better to try and let him work it out than bench him. If - at the end of the season - it is just not working out, then we can look to possibly deal him to a team that strikes out in FA. And just look around the league - nobody is untradable.

Ten games have gone by. He is not trending up. Prior to that, he had a long rehab stint, followed by playoffs, followed by long rehab stint.

What has me really down on him is his complete and total lack of any adjustment whatsoever. As you get older, you have to learn to play differently, and he isn't.

Look at his stats. If he doesn't improve, those stats won't even keep him in the league.

[PhoSita]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

This was most evident last night, but I think this has more to do with Utah's suffocating defense than Kemba losing a step. As others have mentioned, Kemba's body and movement actually look good; seems it is a matter of gaining back his confidence, acclimating to the speed of the NBA once again, and learning how to play as the 3rd option.

It is way too early to sell Kemba down the river. We have zero chance of contending unless he is pre-All-Star Kemba again, so it is better to try and let him work it out than bench him. If - at the end of the season - it is just not working out, then we can look to possibly deal him to a team that strikes out in FA. And just look around the league - nobody is untradable.

Ten games have gone by. He is not trending up. Prior to that, he had a long rehab stint, followed by playoffs, followed by long rehab stint.

What has me really down on him is his complete and total lack of any adjustment whatsoever. As you get older, you have to learn to play differently, and he isn't.

Look at his stats. If he doesn't improve, those stats won't even keep him in the league.

Guy made the All-Star team 4 years straight, put up 20-5-5 in the playoffs against three straight elite defensive teams, then had to miss some time for his knee and you give him 10 games before writing him off?

[td450]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

This was most evident last night, but I think this has more to do with Utah's suffocating defense than Kemba losing a step. As others have mentioned, Kemba's body and movement actually look good; seems it is a matter of gaining back his confidence, acclimating to the speed of the NBA once again, and learning how to play as the 3rd option.

It is way too early to sell Kemba down the river. We have zero chance of contending unless he is pre-All-Star Kemba again, so it is better to try and let him work it out than bench him. If - at the end of the season - it is just not working out, then we can look to possibly deal him to a team that strikes out in FA. And just look around the league - nobody is untradable.

Ten games have gone by. He is not trending up. Prior to that, he had a long rehab stint, followed by playoffs, followed by long rehab stint.

What has me really down on him is his complete and total lack of any adjustment whatsoever. As you get older, you have to learn to play differently, and he isn't.

Look at his stats. If he doesn't improve, those stats won't even keep him in the league.

Guy made the All-Star team 4 years straight, put up 20-5-5 in the playoffs against three straight elite defensive teams, then had to miss some time for his knee and you give him 10 games before writing him off?

No, I believe he can still be a productive player and can help the team compete for a title. But to do that, he must adjust his game. He cannot play exactly like he did before, but that is what he keeps trying to do. That wouldn't have made sense even if he was healthy because of Tatum and Brown, but now, it's the only option he has.

He is not a normal player. Those vicious stop and shoot moves are something only about 10 guys in the league can even pull off. They are a young man's move. It only takes a slight change in athleticism for those moves to become unusable.

[NKY fan]

I find it interesting that Kemba is getting so many shots blocked. Is this a by product of the injury or is he hesitating looking to  pass a split second too long before shooting?
We do seem to have horrible luck recently with our star acquisitions.

This was most evident last night, but I think this has more to do with Utah's suffocating defense than Kemba losing a step. As others have mentioned, Kemba's body and movement actually look good; seems it is a matter of gaining back his confidence, acclimating to the speed of the NBA once again, and learning how to play as the 3rd option.

It is way too early to sell Kemba down the river. We have zero chance of contending unless he is pre-All-Star Kemba again, so it is better to try and let him work it out than bench him. If - at the end of the season - it is just not working out, then we can look to possibly deal him to a team that strikes out in FA. And just look around the league - nobody is untradable.

Ten games have gone by. He is not trending up. Prior to that, he had a long rehab stint, followed by playoffs, followed by long rehab stint.

What has me really down on him is his complete and total lack of any adjustment whatsoever. As you get older, you have to learn to play differently, and he isn't.

Look at his stats. If he doesn't improve, those stats won't even keep him in the league.

Guy made the All-Star team 4 years straight, put up 20-5-5 in the playoffs against three straight elite defensive teams, then had to miss some time for his knee and you give him 10 games before writing him off?

No, I believe he can still be a productive player and can help the team compete for a title. But to do that, he must adjust his game. He cannot play exactly like he did before, but that is what he keeps trying to do. That wouldn't have made sense even if he was healthy because of Tatum and Brown, but now, it's the only option he has.

He is not a normal player. Those vicious stop and shoot moves are something only about 10 guys in the league can even pull off. They are a young man's move. It only takes a slight change in athleticism for those moves to become unusable.

For all that say he has to adjust his game... what adjustments he has to make? He’s never been an efficient scorer. Can he increase his efficiency and passing on top of his most productive % wise years?

[johnnygreen]

I find it amazing that Donavon Mitchell and Kemba Walker are both 6’0” tall. Mitchell plays like he is 6’5” and is not intimidated by anyone. However, Kemba plays like he knows he’s small and doesn’t know how to play amongst the trees.

I can’t see Kemba accepting a role off the bench, or Brad even suggesting it. I would suggest making Kemba the shooting guard and playing off the ball. Help set screens for him, so he can get open/clean looks. He is not as explosive as he once was, and can’t get to his spots like he used to. He needs to adjust his game accordingly. No one is taking on his contract, so the Celtics have to figure out how to make this work.

Donovan's official height is 6'1" but you make a great point. It goes to show you how much Kemba has been hampered since the knee.

Mitchell is known for having a wingspan (6'10'') that is much greater than average for someone his height. Kemba's wingspan is only 6'4''. Mitchell is also has a much bigger body compared to Kemba (216 lbs vs. 184 lbs), making it easier for him to use his size to his advantage. You can't only look at height.

I understand there are other things to look at, such as wingspan and weight. My basic point was two players of similar height, and towards the low end for NBA standards, can have playing styles that are drastically different. Kemba plays like he knows he's small and can't figure out how to compensate for it. Given, it's the knee issue Kemba needs to learn how to play with now and adjust his game accordingly. Then again, I don't know if I can blame all of his passiveness on his knee. To me, this timidness started in the playoffs against Toronto. I don't think he's been the same since.

[PAOBoston]

Sometimes it just takes time for players to round into form. He’s been back for 10 games. No preseason. Limited practice. He hasn’t looked great but considering the circumstances, there isn’t much choice and he’ll have to play himself out of this funk during games that matter. It stinks to have to watch him struggle through it but it is what it is.

From a physical perspective, he doesn’t look bad from my viewpoint. During the playoffs last years, you could tel he was having issues with start/stop and trying to cross over step back. I don’t think he’s shown that so far. At this point l, it looks all mental.

The best possible outcome for the Cs for for Kemba to regain close to his old form. Trading him for pennies on the dollar for players with less upside when other teams know we are selling low will not result in anything of real value for the Cs. Two weeks ago, everyone claimed TT was washed. Since then he’s rounded into form and looks like the version of player the Cs wanted when the signed him. It took some time. It’s the same with Kemba.