How we match up with Cleveland (TLDR: pretty well)

[mmmmm]

I think we match up massively better than we have in the past, and I don't think it's because Love has moved to center and Thompson to the bench.

The simple addition of Hayward immediately and dramatically changed the equation on how teams can defend the Celtics.   They can no longer simply just double team Irving to keep the ball out of his hands and swarm him when he has it.  Because if they do, Horford will pass to a Gordon Hayward with an open look at the basket. 

Outside of Hayward, I also think our move to a wing-dominated roster as opposed to a smalls-dominated roster makes us much better designed to defend against Lebron.   

Losing Avery might hurt us in defending Thomas, if he comes back 100%, because conversely, we also won't be able to just double-team/swarm him (because, well, Lebron), but I hope we can make up for that lack of quick-on-ball D with overall improved length & athleticism.

Ultimately, I think an ECF series between these two teams, if it happens, will probably once again come down to health.   If CLE is 100% healthy (including Thomas) by then, they may still have just a bit too much firepower (and of course, The Lebron).    But if Thomas isn't healthy by then, (and we are) I think we have an excellent chance to finally push past them.

[SHAQATTACK]

Bron .....the NBA s golden hair  star owns the refs .....at least until he plays Curry ..LOL

I think we might have gained a few " star" calls with Irving and Hayward. 

on the ref front Celtics gained some on Team Bron


I think we are really close with regular season games .   But we know Bron slacks off alot .   The post season will tell the tale ..... when Bron plays at 100% energy and IT will be back.

[Celtics4ever]

Quote
Bron .....the NBA s golden hair  star owns the refs .....at least until he plays Curry ..LOL

I was wondering how Kyrie felt the other night to get typical Celtics calls rather than generous CAVs calls.

[Moranis]

I think Calderon gets cut.

No way. Thomas is on the shelf until at least January and Rose is always a hard sneeze away from the injured list.

If they can't trade someone like Shumpert, then I think they will let Jefferson go (maybe bring him back as a "coach") and will try to keep Felder (or Tavares) as the other 2 way contract (along with Holland).  So their 15 would be

PG - Thomas, Rose, Calderon
SG - Wade, Smith, Shumpert
SF - James, Korver, Osman
PF - Crowder, Thompson, Green
C - Love, Frye, Zizic

[CactusThomas]

I wonder why Lebron moved Love to center?

I guess when you're GM and coach nobody questions it.

[crimson_stallion]

Come on now, Irving is clearly the best PG on either team.  Love is better than Horford overall, but not a whole lot of separation.  Crowder and Morris are also fairly even.  James is still by far the best player on either team, but Hayward will at least make him work on both ends unlike last year.  Wade is better than Brown, but if Brown can take a jump he can close much of that gap.  Cleveland has a far superior bench, both in quality and depth. 

Cleveland is the better team.  The NBA GM's think so, Vegas thinks so, most NBA writers think so, etc.  Thus, I'm not taking some sort of weird or novel position.

They thought the Lakers were better then Boston in 2008 too.

Then they thought the Cavs were better then Boston when Lebron was down there in the early days. 

Then they said Dwight's Magic was better then Boston. 

Not sure if you recall - but in the Big 3 era pretty much every single season everybody predicted at least one team that would be better then Boston, who actually ended up getting beaten by Boston.

At the end of the day, it's impossible for anybody to know what will happen in a matchup between a Clevleand team that just lost it's second best (and one of it's longest tenured) player, versus a Celtics team that is pretty much brand new from the ground up and has yet to play a single game together.

But one thing hat I think is for sure, and that is we match up a LOT better with Cleveland then before.  I think Cleveland used to be a team that was better then the sum of it's parts.  I think now they are a team that is worse then the sum of it's parts, because I just don't see how a number of those parts will "fit" together.  The defence, the rebounding, the lack of floor spreading/shooters in the starting 5...a lot of question marks.

Boston has question marks too, not denying that.  I'm just not sure Clevleand is going to be any better then us this year, and there are a lot of CORE players on that Cavs roster who's bodies have taken a lot of beatings (Lebron, Wade, Rose, Love) so a lot is going to depend on their ability to actually stay healthy now that all of those guy are another year older.  And that's not even including Thomas, who's return from major injury is unpredictable.

[crimson_stallion]

Do you think maybe the Cavs are looking at this lineup as a way to beat the Warriors.  I do.  They beat the crap out of us last year they are looking at the Warriors and a rematch. Can we provide some stiff competition, I hope so but Lebron and the Cavs are still the big dog in the east.

I think they are looking at the lineup because they ultimately don't have any choice. 

In today's NBA, where thee point shooting and floor spacing are so critical, you just cannot build a starting lineup around Rose, Wade, Lebron and Tristan Thompson.  It's a disaster, and short of starting Channing Frye (good luck with that) starting Crowder at the four is really the only option they have. 

I think they are taking on this lineup by necessity, not because it's optimal. 

And I really cannot see how a starting frontcourt of Lebron/Crowder/Love is going to have any hope against Golden State front line. Especially when you also have Rose and Wade (or Thomas and Wade, either way) going up against Curry and Thompson.

I think this team matches up with Golden State significantly worse then last year's team did. 

[LilRip]

I'm not confident we beat Cleveland in the playoffs this year, but next year, I would think there's a pretty good chance we're the best team in the east. I do think we match up fairly well though and I think it'll be a very competitive 7-game series in the ECF.

Last year, it was no contest. We were on the Wiz's level and whoever won that 7 game series would've been demolished by Cleveland in the next round. We won one game thanks to Smart's improbable shooting.

[Beat LA]

Come on now, Irving is clearly the best PG on either team.  Love is better than Horford overall, but not a whole lot of separation.  Crowder and Morris are also fairly even.  James is still by far the best player on either team, but Hayward will at least make him work on both ends unlike last year.  Wade is better than Brown, but if Brown can take a jump he can close much of that gap.  Cleveland has a far superior bench, both in quality and depth. 

Cleveland is the better team.  The NBA GM's think so, Vegas thinks so, most NBA writers think so, etc.  Thus, I'm not taking some sort of weird or novel position.

I agree with almost all of this, big 'Mo.  But Kyrie is not clearly better than IT.  He has more weapons in Boston than IT ever did, but he hasn't proven that he can carry an offense just yet. 

TP for allowing me to call you big Mo moving forward.

I would also like to call you big Mo if you like this nickname

The USS Missouri?

[Celtics4ever]

Love is better than Horford overall, but not a whole lot of separation.

Not on defense.

We also have an edge in coaching.   

CLE is a one trick pony in that LeBron gets hurt they will be dead in the water, I am not hoping that.   I want us to beat them with him on the floor so I can see the scared little boy he gets when he loses.   We lose one of our guys we close ranks and march onward, it will still hurt us, but not the same extent.

I think we have the proverbial puncher's chance right now.   But CLE will likely break up at the end of this season when LeBron takes his talents elsewhere.   If not father time is going to start hurting him and the long term effects of PEDs.

[SHAQATTACK]

Love is better than Horford overall, but not a whole lot of separation.

Not on defense.

We also have an edge in coaching.   

CLE is a one trick pony in that LeBron gets hurt they will be dead in the water, I am not hoping that.   I want us to beat them with him on the floor so I can see the scared little boy he gets when he loses.   We lose one of our guys we close ranks and march onward, it will still hurt us, but not the same extent.

I think we have the proverbial puncher's chance right now.   But CLE will likely break up at the end of this season when LeBron takes his talents elsewhere.   If not father time is going to start hurting him and the long term effects of PEDs.

We have a huge edge in coaching .  Basically they have none , supposedly Lue can coach ...but he better not try ....we know what happens then. . Lebron thinks he is god and the coach , he forgets to coach and draw up plays while he is busy whining to the refs relentlessly during the game . Lue just needs to keep,his mouth shut and do as his boss Bronnie says  .  Free for all basketball.

[Roy H.]

It depends on how healthy IT is. Without him, I think we've got a fighting chance. With an IT who is around the level of 2014 or 2015 IT, I think we're in trouble. (I can't see IT replicating last season even if fully healthy).

[cman88]

It depends on how healthy IT is. Without him, I think we've got a fighting chance. With an IT who is around the level of 2014 or 2015 IT, I think we're in trouble. (I can't see IT replicating last season even if fully healthy).

Pretty much THIS. if IT is back to about 20ppg and healthy I think cavs have enough firepower to beat us probably in 6 games or so. if IT is not healthy or out, then they are relying on a bunch of old beatup players like rose/wade. In that case we might have enough of a fighting chance with defense to beat them.

Also depends on if we have a higher seed than the cavs.

[Moranis]

It depends on how healthy IT is. Without him, I think we've got a fighting chance. With an IT who is around the level of 2014 or 2015 IT, I think we're in trouble. (I can't see IT replicating last season even if fully healthy).

Pretty much THIS. if IT is back to about 20ppg and healthy I think cavs have enough firepower to beat us probably in 6 games or so. if IT is not healthy or out, then they are relying on a bunch of old beatup players like rose/wade. In that case we might have enough of a fighting chance with defense to beat them.

Also depends on if we have a higher seed than the cavs.

I feel pretty comfortable with Boston having a higher seed unless there is just a total lack of meshing early on.