Crowder and Smart: Good defenders but inefficient shooters

[tarheelsxxiii]

Not to make excuses for Smart . But he seemed to shoot better at the beginning of Summer League , he was quite hot ......

Until he fell on his fingers on his shooting hand .

I can't help but think those finger are still not really right .   He has them taped up .....I could not shot well with my fingers locked together .

It's just an observation ,  to me his release is altered by the way he holds the ball now .   

Seems he can't catch a break .    The ankle was stiff and bother him last year.   It's obvious he is cutting and jumping better .  But now I think he is dealing with the fingers still. 
Smart never would admit till near season end his ankle was bothering him .   I suspect he is not wanting to let his opponents know his finger s are not healed either .

Maybe by Xmas he ll get well again to knock down his shots more,consistent.

A couple summer league games aside, we have seen enough to support the idea that Smart is just a weak offensive player at this point in his career.  Maybe he develops eventually but it's probably more likely he ends up a defensive role player like tony Allen.  He didn't show much progress over the second half of the season, summer league or preseason.  I think he will he a bit better though.  I can see him ending up like Rodney stuckey.  Hopefully he breaks out into something even better.

Smart might become a better version of Tony Allen, one that can actually shoot.

Yeah smart might develop into a mediocre shooter.   Coming into the draft I thought his offensive floor was Tyreke Evans, but at this point I think calling Tyreke his ceiling might be a bit ambitious.  Here's hoping. How often do the rondo's and smart's of the world go from weak to good shooters?

Smart is a better shooter right now than your giving him credit for. Its not like his shot is broken and useless or anything. The kid shot like 34% on a high volume of 3's last year. That's pretty dang mediocre, but its not so bad that it suggests he can't shoot. Actually, his shooting is good enough to hit 40% from deep with time and effort, which I fully trust Smart to put in.

You seem to forget that if TA had a semblence of an offensive game he would be an all-star. Smart is already better at nearly all offensive attributes (Shooting, driving/generating FT's, passing, handles) than TA has ever been and is certainly good enough to reach his level defensively in the near future. His impact is so large on all the other phases of the game that he doesn't have to be a 20-8-5 kinda guy to be a cornerstone player.

Is that a reasonable long-term hope?  Tony Allen's defense with Rodney Stuckey's offense (with maybe a slightly better 3-point shot)?

A very ideal outcome. And I think it's definitely possible. He'll be fine... not really worried about Smart. Worried about landing superior offensive players to put around Smart though...

[Celtics18]

I love the fact that this team is largely being built around a couple of middle linebackers like Smart and Crowder.

I wish they could shoot better.   

[Rosco917]

If we're counting on Smart and Crowder to lead this team in scoring, we're in for a rude awakening. Both will get better, but both hang their hats on defense and intangibles. Bradley, (or another SG) needs to be much more consistent, we can't just ask IT to carry the scoring load every game, every minute.

The C's need some scoring from the bigs. Lee and Zeller both haven't shown much on either side of the ball.
I'm thinking, a change in the starting lineup. Kelly and Amir, or Sully and Amir. Use Amir as the best defensive presence we have, and Sully an KO to open up the paint, and provide some offensive out put.

 

[SHAQATTACK]

Smart has great ball anticipation , reads the passing lanes,  likes tuff and ruff basketball.

Give him a few months for fingers to heal up right and he'll shoot better .

Not worried about Smart.  He is in this league for the long haul.

Need to get play n time for Rozier who has many of Smarts skills and I think shoots better .....and Hunter too.

Turner is killing the team and progress.....he was a bust at Philly ,  still very poor player , cut our losses and let him go.

[BDeCosta26]

Not to make excuses for Smart . But he seemed to shoot better at the beginning of Summer League , he was quite hot ......

Until he fell on his fingers on his shooting hand .

I can't help but think those finger are still not really right .   He has them taped up .....I could not shot well with my fingers locked together .

It's just an observation ,  to me his release is altered by the way he holds the ball now .   

Seems he can't catch a break .    The ankle was stiff and bother him last year.   It's obvious he is cutting and jumping better .  But now I think he is dealing with the fingers still. 
Smart never would admit till near season end his ankle was bothering him .   I suspect he is not wanting to let his opponents know his finger s are not healed either .

Maybe by Xmas he ll get well again to knock down his shots more,consistent.

A couple summer league games aside, we have seen enough to support the idea that Smart is just a weak offensive player at this point in his career.  Maybe he develops eventually but it's probably more likely he ends up a defensive role player like tony Allen.  He didn't show much progress over the second half of the season, summer league or preseason.  I think he will he a bit better though.  I can see him ending up like Rodney stuckey.  Hopefully he breaks out into something even better.

Smart might become a better version of Tony Allen, one that can actually shoot.

Yeah smart might develop into a mediocre shooter.   Coming into the draft I thought his offensive floor was Tyreke Evans, but at this point I think calling Tyreke his ceiling might be a bit ambitious.  Here's hoping. How often do the rondo's and smart's of the world go from weak to good shooters?

Smart is a better shooter right now than your giving him credit for. Its not like his shot is broken and useless or anything. The kid shot like 34% on a high volume of 3's last year. That's pretty dang mediocre, but its not so bad that it suggests he can't shoot. Actually, his shooting is good enough to hit 40% from deep with time and effort, which I fully trust Smart to put in.

You seem to forget that if TA had a semblence of an offensive game he would be an all-star. Smart is already better at nearly all offensive attributes (Shooting, driving/generating FT's, passing, handles) than TA has ever been and is certainly good enough to reach his level defensively in the near future. His impact is so large on all the other phases of the game that he doesn't have to be a 20-8-5 kinda guy to be a cornerstone player.

I get it... it's brought up all the time.  I'm supposed to be impressed that Marcus Smart was 142nd in 3P% amongst players that shot at least 2 three pointers per game last season. 

Whoop-te-doo... he shot 34% from three (32% after the all-star break).  Yay.   

It's also supposedly a sign of his offensive competence that his TS% was 280th amongst players who played at least 15 minutes per game last season. 

He's not good offensively.  Maybe/hopefully he gets there some day.  Probably not.

I will say that he impressed me in game 1... he played within the system, had some nice outlet passes, hit a couple shots.   He should be a solid contributor for many years.   If his offensive game evolves, I think it's reasonable that he could end up on a prime Rodney Stuckey level offensively. 

Is that a reasonable long-term hope?  Tony Allen's defense with Rodney Stuckey's offense (with maybe a slightly better 3-point shot)?

Who said you have to be impressed? You said he was a Rondo level poor shooter. Like, broken jumper, leave alone on the 3 point arc bad and he's not. He's a decidedly mediocre long range shooter at this point, and that's a good thing considering everyone said he was a terrible shooter coming out of college and one of the biggest improvements he needed to make was his shooting.

His passing has been impressive. The kinds of passes he's making are "one step ahead" kind of passes that show he has good court vision. He will be able to be a primary ball handler in the prime of his career, which was another big question.

If Tony Allen could shoot 3's and be a lead ball-carrier, he would be an all-star. If Smart can become a more consistent version of Rodney Stuckey on offense with Tony Allen level defense, he'll be a really valuable player. It can't be understated just how good of a defender Smart really is.

[guava_wrench]

Not to make excuses for Smart . But he seemed to shoot better at the beginning of Summer League , he was quite hot ......

Until he fell on his fingers on his shooting hand .

I can't help but think those finger are still not really right .   He has them taped up .....I could not shot well with my fingers locked together .

It's just an observation ,  to me his release is altered by the way he holds the ball now .   

Seems he can't catch a break .    The ankle was stiff and bother him last year.   It's obvious he is cutting and jumping better .  But now I think he is dealing with the fingers still. 
Smart never would admit till near season end his ankle was bothering him .   I suspect he is not wanting to let his opponents know his finger s are not healed either .

Maybe by Xmas he ll get well again to knock down his shots more,consistent.

A couple summer league games aside, we have seen enough to support the idea that Smart is just a weak offensive player at this point in his career.  Maybe he develops eventually but it's probably more likely he ends up a defensive role player like tony Allen.  He didn't show much progress over the second half of the season, summer league or preseason.  I think he will he a bit better though.  I can see him ending up like Rodney stuckey.  Hopefully he breaks out into something even better.

Smart might become a better version of Tony Allen, one that can actually shoot.

Yeah smart might develop into a mediocre shooter.   Coming into the draft I thought his offensive floor was Tyreke Evans, but at this point I think calling Tyreke his ceiling might be a bit ambitious.  Here's hoping. How often do the rondo's and smart's of the world go from weak to good shooters?

Smart is a better shooter right now than your giving him credit for. Its not like his shot is broken and useless or anything. The kid shot like 34% on a high volume of 3's last year. That's pretty dang mediocre, but its not so bad that it suggests he can't shoot. Actually, his shooting is good enough to hit 40% from deep with time and effort, which I fully trust Smart to put in.

Those were mostly open 3s. Granted, guys like Smart usually only take open 3s. Regardless, 34% is respectable for a rookie.

[Celtics18]

Not to make excuses for Smart . But he seemed to shoot better at the beginning of Summer League , he was quite hot ......

Until he fell on his fingers on his shooting hand .

I can't help but think those finger are still not really right .   He has them taped up .....I could not shot well with my fingers locked together .

It's just an observation ,  to me his release is altered by the way he holds the ball now .   

Seems he can't catch a break .    The ankle was stiff and bother him last year.   It's obvious he is cutting and jumping better .  But now I think he is dealing with the fingers still. 
Smart never would admit till near season end his ankle was bothering him .   I suspect he is not wanting to let his opponents know his finger s are not healed either .

Maybe by Xmas he ll get well again to knock down his shots more,consistent.

A couple summer league games aside, we have seen enough to support the idea that Smart is just a weak offensive player at this point in his career.  Maybe he develops eventually but it's probably more likely he ends up a defensive role player like tony Allen.  He didn't show much progress over the second half of the season, summer league or preseason.  I think he will he a bit better though.  I can see him ending up like Rodney stuckey.  Hopefully he breaks out into something even better.

Smart might become a better version of Tony Allen, one that can actually shoot.

Yeah smart might develop into a mediocre shooter.   Coming into the draft I thought his offensive floor was Tyreke Evans, but at this point I think calling Tyreke his ceiling might be a bit ambitious.  Here's hoping. How often do the rondo's and smart's of the world go from weak to good shooters?

Smart is a better shooter right now than your giving him credit for. Its not like his shot is broken and useless or anything. The kid shot like 34% on a high volume of 3's last year. That's pretty dang mediocre, but its not so bad that it suggests he can't shoot. Actually, his shooting is good enough to hit 40% from deep with time and effort, which I fully trust Smart to put in.

You seem to forget that if TA had a semblence of an offensive game he would be an all-star. Smart is already better at nearly all offensive attributes (Shooting, driving/generating FT's, passing, handles) than TA has ever been and is certainly good enough to reach his level defensively in the near future. His impact is so large on all the other phases of the game that he doesn't have to be a 20-8-5 kinda guy to be a cornerstone player.

I get it... it's brought up all the time.  I'm supposed to be impressed that Marcus Smart was 142nd in 3P% amongst players that shot at least 2 three pointers per game last season. 

Whoop-te-doo... he shot 34% from three (32% after the all-star break).  Yay.   

It's also supposedly a sign of his offensive competence that his TS% was 280th amongst players who played at least 15 minutes per game last season. 

He's not good offensively.  Maybe/hopefully he gets there some day.  Probably not.

I will say that he impressed me in game 1... he played within the system, had some nice outlet passes, hit a couple shots.   He should be a solid contributor for many years.   If his offensive game evolves, I think it's reasonable that he could end up on a prime Rodney Stuckey level offensively. 

Is that a reasonable long-term hope?  Tony Allen's defense with Rodney Stuckey's offense (with maybe a slightly better 3-point shot)?

Who said you have to be impressed? You said he was a Rondo level poor shooter. Like, broken jumper, leave alone on the 3 point arc bad and he's not. He's a decidedly mediocre long range shooter at this point, and that's a good thing considering everyone said he was a terrible shooter coming out of college and one of the biggest improvements he needed to make was his shooting.

His passing has been impressive. The kinds of passes he's making are "one step ahead" kind of passes that show he has good court vision. He will be able to be a primary ball handler in the prime of his career, which was another big question.

If Tony Allen could shoot 3's and be a lead ball-carrier, he would be an all-star. If Smart can become a more consistent version of Rodney Stuckey on offense with Tony Allen level defense, he'll be a really valuable player. It can't be understated just how good of a defender Smart really is.

Very well put.  There's a theory out there that a guard can't be a major defensive difference maker.  I don't buy that theory; Marcus Smart already is a major difference maker.