Author Topic: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread  (Read 55477 times)

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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #300 on: May 14, 2024, 04:45:14 PM »

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Since the start of the 2022 postseason, the C's are 18-7 on the road. At home though in the same span? 14-14.

If they can just do a little bit better at home, they can win it all. Blowing a handful of home games is not a good recipe in the postseason. To their credit, at least so far this postseason they've rebounded from bad Game 2 losses. Last round they took care of business in home Game 5. Now they need to take care of business tomorrow, can't be letting this series go longer. Make it easier for yourself and take advantage of HCA.

Bill Simmons had a good theory on this recently. He thought that the Celtics home crowd was so tuned to their bad late game tendencies that when things start getting tight or going wrong the entire crowd sort of tenses up which sort of feeds into a feedback loop where the Celtics tense up and the execution gets even worse. I don't know if I buy it necessarily but I've been to one or two home games where you can certainly feel a tense "sphincter tightening" in the crowd when things start going wrong.

I'm not sure about that.  I think part of it is complacency and simply falling into a false security playing at home & taking this mindset that they'll simply roll.    Then they come out of the gate and either the shots aren't falling early or the other team is hot and the Celtics can't seem to overcome it.   A lot of that is mental and my largest concern with this team. We see this snowball effect where bad offense turns into bad defense and it just gets bad.

I was at Game 2.  The crowd was electric early.  Then the team starting bricking shots left & right which helped snowball into defensive lapses and the Cavs got hot on the offensive end.  Then the crowd turned. But that was out of anger & frustration.  Not tenseness. I don't think anyone was thinking about late game issues as this was transpiring. 

If it's a close game late in the 4th, then yeah, the tenseness in the crowd comes. But that's not unique to Celtics fans.



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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #301 on: May 15, 2024, 12:29:02 PM »

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Some interesting stats for the CLE series so far (at least interesting to me).  Tatum has taken 33 FTA (made 31/93.9%).  That is great.  It is what you see from Jimmy Butler usually.  Maybe Tatum has learned something after going up against Butler so much. CLE (and MIA before this) are making things hard on Tatum, by design.  But getting to the FT line is the best way to counter that.

The other extreme is Horford, Zero FTA in 4 games vs. CLE.  You don't expect him to get to the line a ton but ZERO?  He is probably sticking to the game plan but that tells me too much reliance on 3PAs.  In spite of that, Horford has the best +/- per game (+8), and that is in less minutes than all the other starters.  His replacement (Kornet) has the lowest +/- per game (-0.8), of the "regulars".  Kornet does have 11 ORebs in 4 games.

Brown is putting up 26.5 ppg with a slash of 61.2%/44.4%/80.0%.  That is impressive.  Somehow, that isn't translating into +/- (he is +0.3 per game), but he has been playing great from what I have seen.

Tatum + Brown together, -10.  Tatum no Brown, +20, Brown no Tatum, +11.  Try to explain that one?

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #302 on: May 15, 2024, 07:30:07 PM »

Offline tenn_smoothie

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Not that I have been optimistic in the past, but after watching these 2024 playoffs thus far, I hate it but I think Banner 18 is a long shot.

Reason is centered mostly around one area of the game, offensive execution ........

#1) Celtics are mediocre to bad, Denver is great.
#2) Jokic is very talented, very smart and a tough competitor. Tatum and Brown are talented, very dumb and questionable competitors.
#3) Joe Mazzulla is an idiot.

As much of a blow-hard contrarian as he is, Charles Barkley articulated our problem perfectly during the other night's edition of the NBA studio clown show. He talked about the Celtics stagnant, one-dimensional offense that relied so heavily on 3-point shooting and on the awful habit our two main stars, Tatum and Brown, have of going into isolation, one-on-one, fadeaway jump shot mode, especially in the 4th quarter of close games when great team execution is at a premium. He pointed out the Celtics overwhelming talent being good enough to beat most teams in spite of our offensive deficiencies, but not being enough to beat other elite teams. The question was asked, was the issue a player problem or a coaching problem ? He correctly stated that it was both.

I remain bewildered that our offensive execution issues are so widely recognized around the league and the media and yet, in two seasons under Mazzulla, nothing has changed. We are as bad now as ever, maybe worse at times. How do the players not see this, how does Mazzulla and his assistants not make changes, how does Brad Stevens brilliantly build a championship roster and sit idly by witnessing one lost opportunity after another and finally, how does ownership allow their efforts and their money to be wasted right in front of them ? If Stevens can't see beyond his own small-ball, 3-point obsession, then Wyc & Co. are going to be our only hope to save this current Celtics team from disaster.

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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #303 on: May 15, 2024, 09:35:17 PM »

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It might look like a small thing in the grand scheme of things, but I was VERY encouraged tonight. Last year's Game 5 vs. Atlanta without Murray was alarming when we lost, and we have played with our food a ton in playoff series in the past 2 seasons. It's made us doubt the C's ability to win the Finals, or doubt our ability to even reach it in 2023 (both things were true). But tonight, they were just on a mission and overwhelmed the Heat.

Sure, Game 2 wasn't great, but to come out and win the next three + blow them out in the elimination game is a very good sign. A sign this team might be locked in and truly on a mission. Maybe this isn't the same Celtics as previous years, which is a great sign going forward for a Finals run;D

How many times have we seen them blow pivotal Game 5s at home in recent years? Not only did they win today, but they absolutely blew them out as early as the 2nd quarter. Dominant.

And guess what, they did it again! Another home Game 5 up 3-1, and they took care of business. Tied 1-1? No problem, go out and win two road games.

We are way more dialed in than recent years and chasing something together  :)
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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #304 on: May 15, 2024, 10:51:00 PM »

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Not that I have been optimistic in the past, but after watching these 2024 playoffs thus far, I hate it but I think Banner 18 is a long shot.

Reason is centered mostly around one area of the game, offensive execution ........

#1) Celtics are mediocre to bad, Denver is great.
#2) Jokic is very talented, very smart and a tough competitor. Tatum and Brown are talented, very dumb and questionable competitors.
#3) Joe Mazzulla is an idiot.

As much of a blow-hard contrarian as he is, Charles Barkley articulated our problem perfectly during the other night's edition of the NBA studio clown show. He talked about the Celtics stagnant, one-dimensional offense that relied so heavily on 3-point shooting and on the awful habit our two main stars, Tatum and Brown, have of going into isolation, one-on-one, fadeaway jump shot mode, especially in the 4th quarter of close games when great team execution is at a premium. He pointed out the Celtics overwhelming talent being good enough to beat most teams in spite of our offensive deficiencies, but not being enough to beat other elite teams. The question was asked, was the issue a player problem or a coaching problem ? He correctly stated that it was both.

I remain bewildered that our offensive execution issues are so widely recognized around the league and the media and yet, in two seasons under Mazzulla, nothing has changed. We are as bad now as ever, maybe worse at times. How do the players not see this, how does Mazzulla and his assistants not make changes, how does Brad Stevens brilliantly build a championship roster and sit idly by witnessing one lost opportunity after another and finally, how does ownership allow their efforts and their money to be wasted right in front of them ? If Stevens can't see beyond his own small-ball, 3-point obsession, then Wyc & Co. are going to be our only hope to save this current Celtics team from disaster.

i am concerned as well but trying to stay positive
LET'S GO CELTICS!

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #305 on: May 15, 2024, 10:53:05 PM »

Offline CelticSooner

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This team needs to play someone that will knock them in the mouth. Playing against all these beat up average East teams is actually hurting them from a competition stand point. Iron sharpens iron and the Eastern Conference is not great. They need to wake up before Denver strangles them in their sleep.

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #306 on: May 15, 2024, 10:54:21 PM »

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Some interesting stats for the CLE series so far (at least interesting to me).  Tatum has taken 33 FTA (made 31/93.9%).  That is great.  It is what you see from Jimmy Butler usually.  Maybe Tatum has learned something after going up against Butler so much. CLE (and MIA before this) are making things hard on Tatum, by design.  But getting to the FT line is the best way to counter that.

The other extreme is Horford, Zero FTA in 4 games vs. CLE.  You don't expect him to get to the line a ton but ZERO?  He is probably sticking to the game plan but that tells me too much reliance on 3PAs.  In spite of that, Horford has the best +/- per game (+8), and that is in less minutes than all the other starters.  His replacement (Kornet) has the lowest +/- per game (-0.8), of the "regulars".  Kornet does have 11 ORebs in 4 games.

Brown is putting up 26.5 ppg with a slash of 61.2%/44.4%/80.0%.  That is impressive.  Somehow, that isn't translating into +/- (he is +0.3 per game), but he has been playing great from what I have seen.

Tatum + Brown together, -10.  Tatum no Brown, +20, Brown no Tatum, +11.  Try to explain that one?
As I've been saying for years, Tatum and Brown aren't a good compliment for each other.  They are very similar players that are at the best in the same positioning on the floor.  So when they are on the floor together, they get in each other's way and they both defer to the other a lot more than they defer to other players when the other isn't on the floor with them.  Tatum also basically does everything better than Brown, which is why the team is better with Tatum and no Brown than they are with Brown and no Tatum.
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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #307 on: May 15, 2024, 11:31:15 PM »

Offline Redz

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Man.  People are so flippin angry about the Celtics.  Iíve never seen such general joylessness over a playoff run.  Itís seriously bumming me out.  Not just here.  Everywhere.  And by Celtics ďfansĒ.
Yup

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #308 on: May 15, 2024, 11:50:06 PM »

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Man.  People are so flippin angry about the Celtics.  Iíve never seen such general joylessness over a playoff run.  Itís seriously bumming me out.  Not just here.  Everywhere.  And by Celtics ďfansĒ.

Itís everywhere, all the talk shows have the same narrative - Celtics are to nonchalant, no killer instinct, play to the level of the opponent, bad home team, etc etc. I really hope all these people are proven wrong.

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #309 on: May 15, 2024, 11:59:12 PM »

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Man.  People are so flippin angry about the Celtics.  Iíve never seen such general joylessness over a playoff run.  Itís seriously bumming me out.  Not just here.  Everywhere.  And by Celtics ďfansĒ.

More like boring. Beat two completely useless opponents. Itís not that impressive. Those teams had no chance, neither do the Knicks. If they were out west it would be totally different.
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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #310 on: May 16, 2024, 12:12:43 AM »

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Some interesting stats for the CLE series so far (at least interesting to me).  Tatum has taken 33 FTA (made 31/93.9%).  That is great.  It is what you see from Jimmy Butler usually.  Maybe Tatum has learned something after going up against Butler so much. CLE (and MIA before this) are making things hard on Tatum, by design.  But getting to the FT line is the best way to counter that.

The other extreme is Horford, Zero FTA in 4 games vs. CLE.  You don't expect him to get to the line a ton but ZERO?  He is probably sticking to the game plan but that tells me too much reliance on 3PAs.  In spite of that, Horford has the best +/- per game (+8), and that is in less minutes than all the other starters.  His replacement (Kornet) has the lowest +/- per game (-0.8), of the "regulars".  Kornet does have 11 ORebs in 4 games.

Brown is putting up 26.5 ppg with a slash of 61.2%/44.4%/80.0%.  That is impressive.  Somehow, that isn't translating into +/- (he is +0.3 per game), but he has been playing great from what I have seen.

Tatum + Brown together, -10.  Tatum no Brown, +20, Brown no Tatum, +11.  Try to explain that one?
As I've been saying for years, Tatum and Brown aren't a good compliment for each other.  They are very similar players that are at the best in the same positioning on the floor.  So when they are on the floor together, they get in each other's way and they both defer to the other a lot more than they defer to other players when the other isn't on the floor with them.  Tatum also basically does everything better than Brown, which is why the team is better with Tatum and no Brown than they are with Brown and no Tatum.

I just don't get why this idea continues to be a thing. Maybe they aren't perfect compliments but having two guys who do similar things is not a bad thing on the wing.

Having two wings who can guard multiple positions, both get out in transition, both attack closeouts, both spot up shoot, and both create some is just not an overlapping skill set. It's not perfectly complimentary offensively Jamaal Murray/Jokic are, but its also not a bad thing to have.  You need more than one shot creator on a team, you need more than one wing.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2024, 12:19:45 AM by keevsnick »

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #311 on: May 16, 2024, 12:14:28 AM »

Online keevsnick

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Some interesting stats for the CLE series so far (at least interesting to me).  Tatum has taken 33 FTA (made 31/93.9%).  That is great.  It is what you see from Jimmy Butler usually.  Maybe Tatum has learned something after going up against Butler so much. CLE (and MIA before this) are making things hard on Tatum, by design.  But getting to the FT line is the best way to counter that.

The other extreme is Horford, Zero FTA in 4 games vs. CLE.  You don't expect him to get to the line a ton but ZERO?  He is probably sticking to the game plan but that tells me too much reliance on 3PAs.  In spite of that, Horford has the best +/- per game (+8), and that is in less minutes than all the other starters.  His replacement (Kornet) has the lowest +/- per game (-0.8), of the "regulars".  Kornet does have 11 ORebs in 4 games.

Brown is putting up 26.5 ppg with a slash of 61.2%/44.4%/80.0%.  That is impressive.  Somehow, that isn't translating into +/- (he is +0.3 per game), but he has been playing great from what I have seen.

Tatum + Brown together, -10.  Tatum no Brown, +20, Brown no Tatum, +11.  Try to explain that one?

Its not really that complicated. When both are out there they are playing starters. When one is out there they are playing more backup heavy units. Against an injured opponent the backups will be terrible, so Tatum or Brown alone are enough to kill those units.

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #312 on: May 16, 2024, 12:29:45 AM »

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Man.  People are so flippin angry about the Celtics.  Iíve never seen such general joylessness over a playoff run.  Itís seriously bumming me out.  Not just here.  Everywhere.  And by Celtics ďfansĒ.

More like boring. Beat two completely useless opponents. Itís not that impressive. Those teams had no chance, neither do the Knicks. If they were out west it would be totally different.

That is where I am. I am not that engaged in this playoff run because the opponents have been such low quality. This playoff run has lacked any excitement. There has been no jeopardy. No risk. Everything is easy. And the next round will be the same.

It won't be until the Finals that we meet a real opponent. And that won't even feel like a playoff run. More like a single series.

It is not even that the team has been that great. It is more the opponents have sucked so badly. It = I mean, the cakewalk. It = The difference between the two sides.

It is not like they are putting on some masterclass. Some dominant beatdown. They are cruising along in 2nd gear with no need to even go into 3rd.

Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #313 on: May 16, 2024, 12:52:12 AM »

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Man.  People are so flippin angry about the Celtics.  Iíve never seen such general joylessness over a playoff run.  Itís seriously bumming me out.  Not just here.  Everywhere.  And by Celtics ďfansĒ.

More like boring. Beat two completely useless opponents. Itís not that impressive. Those teams had no chance, neither do the Knicks. If they were out west it would be totally different.

That is where I am. I am not that engaged in this playoff run because the opponents have been such low quality. This playoff run has lacked any excitement. There has been no jeopardy. No risk. Everything is easy. And the next round will be the same.

It won't be until the Finals that we meet a real opponent. And that won't even feel like a playoff run. More like a single series.

It is not even that the team has been that great. It is more the opponents have sucked so badly. It = I mean, the cakewalk. It = The difference between the two sides.

It is not like they are putting on some masterclass. Some dominant beatdown. They are cruising along in 2nd gear with no need to even go into 3rd.

I guess this year's run is less stressful than the last two year so maybe that's the upside.

ECSF and ECF were Game 7 trillers in 2022. ECSF was another thriller in 2023. The ECF was not how I expected the C's to come out against the Heat, down 0-3 and all.

But all in all, they should at least get an opponent in the East that will play smashmouth basketball with them.


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Re: Celtics 2024 Playoff Run Thread
« Reply #314 on: May 16, 2024, 12:57:41 AM »

Online keevsnick

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Man.  People are so flippin angry about the Celtics.  Iíve never seen such general joylessness over a playoff run.  Itís seriously bumming me out.  Not just here.  Everywhere.  And by Celtics ďfansĒ.

More like boring. Beat two completely useless opponents. Itís not that impressive. Those teams had no chance, neither do the Knicks. If they were out west it would be totally different.

That is where I am. I am not that engaged in this playoff run because the opponents have been such low quality. This playoff run has lacked any excitement. There has been no jeopardy. No risk. Everything is easy. And the next round will be the same.

It won't be until the Finals that we meet a real opponent. And that won't even feel like a playoff run. More like a single series.

It is not even that the team has been that great. It is more the opponents have sucked so badly. It = I mean, the cakewalk. It = The difference between the two sides.

It is not like they are putting on some masterclass. Some dominant beatdown. They are cruising along in 2nd gear with no need to even go into 3rd.

I guess this year's run is less stressful than the last two year so maybe that's the upside.

ECSF and ECF were Game 7 trillers in 2022. ECSF was another thriller in 2023. The ECF was not how I expected the C's to come out against the Heat, down 0-3 and all.

But all in all, they should at least get an opponent in the East that will play smashmouth basketball with them.

I think they are likely to crush either the Pacer or the Knicks with just shear talent, even if Kp were to miss most or all the series.

Like the Knicks may very well start a lineup with 4 guys 6'4 or below. And the c's would have, by far the best defensive personnel for Brunson. If that team were healthy it would be an interesting series, but they aren't.