Author Topic: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page 10  (Read 20188 times)

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Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #45 on: May 12, 2019, 08:45:56 PM »

Online jpotter33

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https://nesn.com/2019/05/nba-rumors-heres-how-celtics-can-sign-al-horford-to-team-friendly-deal/

Quote
While many are bracing for Kyrie Irving’s departure from the Celtics, Boston also has another important player that can hit free agency this offseason: Al Horford.

The big man has an opt-out clause in his contract, meaning he can elect free agency this summer in pursuit of a new deal. The 32-year-old is set to make $29 million next season, but in opting out of his contract he can sign a deal that would give him some more long-term security.

According to The Boston Herald’s Steve Bulpett, extra years are exactly what Horford is looking for. Bulpett indicated that Horford would be willing to re-sign with the Celtics on a team-friendly number if they’re willing to give him some length on the deal.

“The Celts still have to find out what Al Horford wants to do,” Bulpett wrote. “The veteran can opt out of the approximately $29 million he has coming next year, and, according to a league source, Horford would like to stay. The source added that he’d take a more team-friendly number for next season if he can get two more years tacked on.

“As of now, however, the Celtics have yet to engage in any talks with Horford or his representation.”

Keeping Horford would be important for a Celtics team that could see its roster significantly change over the next few seasons.

Didn't see this posted anywhere, so figured I would post this. This would be big for the efforts to trade for AD, as Al trading in a higher final year of his salary for more long-term security at a lower annual number would definitely help facilitate the ease of an AD trade and Boston' overall cap situation.

I wonder what he would be willing to take? Maybe something like 4 years/$80M with the final year being a team option?
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Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #46 on: May 12, 2019, 08:46:44 PM »

Offline Phantom255x

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3 to 4 years in the 18-20M range. Get it done!
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Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #47 on: May 12, 2019, 08:54:57 PM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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Great news for BOS...

Please bring this talented Big back.

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Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #48 on: May 12, 2019, 09:16:30 PM »

Offline gpap

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3 to 4 years in the 18-20M range. Get it done!

Wouldn't mind that.

3/60 deal.

However, we would need to upgrade at center to give Al more support in the front court.

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #49 on: May 13, 2019, 06:18:23 PM »

Offline zeitgeist49

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Horford ain't leaving. He's not the mercenary type, like Irving is. Horford, I believe, appreciates the Celtics investing so much money with him. Also, I believe, Horford has enjoyed his role and time in Boston. If we get a productive center next year, possibly Williams or a FA, Horford will enjoy this team even more.

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #50 on: May 13, 2019, 07:10:03 PM »

Online celticsclay

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https://nesn.com/2019/05/nba-rumors-heres-how-celtics-can-sign-al-horford-to-team-friendly-deal/

Quote
While many are bracing for Kyrie Irving’s departure from the Celtics, Boston also has another important player that can hit free agency this offseason: Al Horford.

The big man has an opt-out clause in his contract, meaning he can elect free agency this summer in pursuit of a new deal. The 32-year-old is set to make $29 million next season, but in opting out of his contract he can sign a deal that would give him some more long-term security.

According to The Boston Herald’s Steve Bulpett, extra years are exactly what Horford is looking for. Bulpett indicated that Horford would be willing to re-sign with the Celtics on a team-friendly number if they’re willing to give him some length on the deal.

“The Celts still have to find out what Al Horford wants to do,” Bulpett wrote. “The veteran can opt out of the approximately $29 million he has coming next year, and, according to a league source, Horford would like to stay. The source added that he’d take a more team-friendly number for next season if he can get two more years tacked on.

“As of now, however, the Celtics have yet to engage in any talks with Horford or his representation.”

Keeping Horford would be important for a Celtics team that could see its roster significantly change over the next few seasons.

Didn't see this posted anywhere, so figured I would post this. This would be big for the efforts to trade for AD, as Al trading in a higher final year of his salary for more long-term security at a lower annual number would definitely help facilitate the ease of an AD trade and Boston' overall cap situation.

I wonder what he would be willing to take? Maybe something like 4 years/$80M with the final year being a team option?

This seems like great news. If get 9 million dollars of his deal next year, do we get any wiggle room for free agents if kyrie leaves too?

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #51 on: May 17, 2019, 05:58:53 PM »

Offline Irish Stew

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I'm going to ramble a bit.

Rumors that Horford could opt out of his 30 mil and take 3 years making 20 mil per year.  I also saw something that said Horford could potentially take a 5 year deal starting at 17 mil.

Before you scoff at 5 years...  FWIW, Al Horford will be 33 years old next season.   Horford is often called Tim Duncan-lite because of his style of play.  If he ages similar to Duncan, the final year of his 5 year contract would put him at the same age Duncan was at (37) when he contributed to the Spurs 2014 championship (Duncan was great in that championship run).

For the sake or argument, let's just pencil in trading Marcus Smart (12.5 mil) + Jaylen Brown (6.5mil) + Tatum (7.8 mil) + picks (27 mil outgoing) for Anthony Davis (27 mil incoming).

That would leave you with:

- Horford - 17 mil
- Davis - 27 mil
- Hayward - 32.7 mil
- Baynes - 5.4 mil (if he opts in to his final year)
- Yabu - 3.1 mil
- Williams - 1.9 mi

For this exercise, we are letting Rozier, Morris, Theis, Semi and Wanamaker walk.

That's a total of 87 mil on the books with a salary cap set at 109 mil.

My preference is absolutely to keep Kyrie Irving.  Obviously, using his bird rights to extend him pushes us over the salary cap.  But for fun, let's just say the fans successfully drive him out of town and Kyrie decides to leave.   

Technically, you could be looking at around 22 mil in cap space here to try to sign a replacement.  Probably not enough to get a guy like Kemba Walker, right?  But say you could find some teams to absorb the salaries of Yabu and Baynes (freeing up another 8.5 mil)... technically that could leave you with around 30 mil in cap space to find a star free agent to pair with Davis, Horford and Hayward.   

The other interesting path here is... the team could consider salary dumping Hayward on a team like the Cavs.  Cleveland was rumored to have some interest.  I'm not going to get into a debate about whether we'd need to include picks to salary dump Hayward, but Cleveland might be able to absorb some or all of his salary.  They have the non-guaranteed JR Smith deal they can trade.   Shedding some/all of Hayward's salary could technically put Boston in position to add a free agent star to pair with Davis/Horford if Kyrie leaves.  Meaning, you could make a pitch to someone like Kawhi to try and pair him with Davis.

One more semi-unrelated thing worth keeping in mind.  If ultimately Kyrie decides he's leaving, it will be in our best interest to work a sign-and-trade.  Say, for instance, he decides to go to the Knicks.  Even if the Knicks have the cap space, it's in our best interest to convince them to do a sign-and-trade.  New York doesn't have to give us any assets... we just need to get back a fat trade exception.    Say we end up with a 35 mil trade exception, we then don't have to worry about letting guys like Rozier and Morris walk.  If there's any picks left over after the Davis trade, we could try to trade the fat 35 mil trade exception + picks for a player like Mike Conley (on the books for 32.5 mil next season for the rebuilding Grizzlies). 


 

i'm unclear as to the Knicks and KI's incentive to do a s & t that would help their rival? Are we giving them picks?

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #52 on: May 17, 2019, 06:26:10 PM »

Offline Monkhouse

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I'm going to ramble a bit.

Rumors that Horford could opt out of his 30 mil and take 3 years making 20 mil per year.  I also saw something that said Horford could potentially take a 5 year deal starting at 17 mil.

Before you scoff at 5 years...  FWIW, Al Horford will be 33 years old next season.   Horford is often called Tim Duncan-lite because of his style of play.  If he ages similar to Duncan, the final year of his 5 year contract would put him at the same age Duncan was at (37) when he contributed to the Spurs 2014 championship (Duncan was great in that championship run).

For the sake or argument, let's just pencil in trading Marcus Smart (12.5 mil) + Jaylen Brown (6.5mil) + Tatum (7.8 mil) + picks (27 mil outgoing) for Anthony Davis (27 mil incoming).

That would leave you with:

- Horford - 17 mil
- Davis - 27 mil
- Hayward - 32.7 mil
- Baynes - 5.4 mil (if he opts in to his final year)
- Yabu - 3.1 mil
- Williams - 1.9 mi

For this exercise, we are letting Rozier, Morris, Theis, Semi and Wanamaker walk.

That's a total of 87 mil on the books with a salary cap set at 109 mil.

My preference is absolutely to keep Kyrie Irving.  Obviously, using his bird rights to extend him pushes us over the salary cap.  But for fun, let's just say the fans successfully drive him out of town and Kyrie decides to leave.   

Technically, you could be looking at around 22 mil in cap space here to try to sign a replacement.  Probably not enough to get a guy like Kemba Walker, right?  But say you could find some teams to absorb the salaries of Yabu and Baynes (freeing up another 8.5 mil)... technically that could leave you with around 30 mil in cap space to find a star free agent to pair with Davis, Horford and Hayward.   

The other interesting path here is... the team could consider salary dumping Hayward on a team like the Cavs.  Cleveland was rumored to have some interest.  I'm not going to get into a debate about whether we'd need to include picks to salary dump Hayward, but Cleveland might be able to absorb some or all of his salary.  They have the non-guaranteed JR Smith deal they can trade.   Shedding some/all of Hayward's salary could technically put Boston in position to add a free agent star to pair with Davis/Horford if Kyrie leaves.  Meaning, you could make a pitch to someone like Kawhi to try and pair him with Davis.

One more semi-unrelated thing worth keeping in mind.  If ultimately Kyrie decides he's leaving, it will be in our best interest to work a sign-and-trade.  Say, for instance, he decides to go to the Knicks.  Even if the Knicks have the cap space, it's in our best interest to convince them to do a sign-and-trade.  New York doesn't have to give us any assets... we just need to get back a fat trade exception.    Say we end up with a 35 mil trade exception, we then don't have to worry about letting guys like Rozier and Morris walk.  If there's any picks left over after the Davis trade, we could try to trade the fat 35 mil trade exception + picks for a player like Mike Conley (on the books for 32.5 mil next season for the rebuilding Grizzlies). 



I don't understand why you think Davis would be interested in playing with an aging Conley/Horford, and Hayward who had a terrible year. I'm not giving up Smart & Brown + Tatum + picks for Davis alone.

Plus, I think your math might be slightly wrong. Are we including all the picks? Your proposed trade would add up to around $35.2.

Knicks wouldn't benefit from anything by giving us a S&T.

If that was the case, and Irving left, I would just say screw it, and go young from there.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2019, 06:35:11 PM by Monkhouse »
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Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #53 on: May 27, 2019, 03:14:46 PM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

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If Horford opts-out & re-signs, what is the lowest dollar amount he can receive in 2019-2020 while still getting huge dollars in 2020-2021 and 2021-2022 (i.e., to maximize cap space in 2019-2020, what can his contract look like)?

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #54 on: May 27, 2019, 03:24:54 PM »

Online RazzelnoDazzel

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If Horford opts-out & re-signs, what is the lowest dollar amount he can receive in 2019-2020 while still getting huge dollars in 2020-2021 and 2021-2022 (i.e., to maximize cap space in 2019-2020, what can his contract look like)?

What I “BELIEVE” is his main goal would be to make more in total than what he can make in just this year. So he would need a 3 or 4 year deal. With that assumption if he made a flat rate of 15M year on a 4 year deal he would be doubling his earnings. So 4-year (60M), this is 💯 a guess don’t quote me on this.

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #55 on: May 27, 2019, 03:51:21 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Horford's raises or decreases would be limited to just 8% a year since they now have his Bird right's. Contracts that attempt massive salary increases or decreases are illegal. So, you can't have a Horford contract pay him $5 million in year 1 and $20 million for each of the next 3 years on a 4 year deal.

One contract re-sign I thought about is a 4 year $70.4 million deal but structured as such:

1st year: $20 million
2nd year: $18.4 million
3rd year: $16.8 million
4th year: $15.2 million.

Such a contract would make an aging star more valuable if the team would need to move on from Big Al.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2019, 06:40:55 PM by nickagneta »

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #56 on: May 27, 2019, 05:58:05 PM »

Offline keevsnick

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Adding two years? Sure. More than that makes me nervous. Ge will be 33 next year so you are starting to get into serious pre-prime decline phase. So much of his value is his ability to move his feet on defense, a slight decline in athleticism could really hurt him.

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #57 on: May 27, 2019, 06:03:35 PM »

Offline BringToughnessBack

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Maybe he should explore free agency and try and get an 80m-100m deal for four years. We should be prepared he could leave if we try and lowball him. Whether he loves Boston or not will be irrelevant if we insult what he feels his value is. I am also not comfortable at 80 plus million either for him.

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #58 on: May 27, 2019, 06:05:35 PM »

Online RazzelnoDazzel

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Maybe he should explore free agency and try and get an 80m-100m deal for four years. We should be prepared he could leave if we try and lowball him. Whether he loves Boston or not will be irrelevant if we insult what he feels his value is. I am also not comfortable at 80 plus million either for him.

This is also true. I wouldn’t lowball him I’d ask him what he wanted to be honest.

Re: Horford free agency thread: Possibly leaving: Page
« Reply #59 on: May 28, 2019, 09:42:30 AM »

Offline Kuberski33

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Maybe he should explore free agency and try and get an 80m-100m deal for four years. We should be prepared he could leave if we try and lowball him. Whether he loves Boston or not will be irrelevant if we insult what he feels his value is. I am also not comfortable at 80 plus million either for him.
If he leaves you might as well rebuild the team. I think he wants to stay but you have to give him an offer that approximates his market value. And I don't think they'll mess around.  This ownership has always been pretty savvy when it comes to the business end of things.

 

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