Author Topic: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.  (Read 6021 times)

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Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« on: April 02, 2019, 12:29:47 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump
 Everybody agrees that ObamaCare doesn’t work. Premiums & deductibles are far too high - Really bad HealthCare! Even the Dems want to replace it, but with Medicare for all, which would cause 180 million Americans to lose their beloved private health insurance. The Republicans.....



Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump
 ....are developing a really great HealthCare Plan with far lower premiums (cost) & deductibles than ObamaCare. In other words it will be far less expensive & much more usable than ObamaCare. Vote will be taken right after the Election when Republicans hold the Senate & win......


Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump
 ....back the House. It will be truly great HealthCare that will work for America. Also, Republicans will always support Pre-Existing Conditions. The Republican Party will be known as the Party of Great HealtCare. Meantime, the USA is doing better than ever & is respected again!


The Democrats won the House with their main platform item being healthcare. Trump's answer is let's get rid of Obamacare and after the election the Republicans will push through the best healthcare plan ever. Is this the same plan Republicans have been telling the country they will be putting in place of Obamacare for 9-10 years but have never told us the details of?

Almost 10 years later and Republicans have no alternative to Obamacare and now Trump is saying he is going to kill Obamacare but won't reveal his plan for two years and only when Republicans win back the House. But the Republicans lost the House because they didn't have a healthcare plan.

This is going to hurt Trump and Republicans. Moderate Americans that want better, more affordable healthcare don't want to wait until Republicans hold majorities in the House and Senate and the presidency to find out what their solutions to the problem are. Trump is deciding to push the entire subject under the rug until he has that complete control of Congress again.

Big mistake, IMO.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2019, 12:39:31 PM »

Offline Sophomore

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Trump's motivations are always hard to discern, but he seems to have a compulsive need to destroy anything his predecessor did. Does it matter to him that he has no healthcare plan, that the last time the Rs tried to come up with a plan it was a house-on-fire disaster, that raising this issue distracted from his message on the Mueller report? Apparently not.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2019, 12:44:32 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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You can't have protections for pre-existing conditions without a mandate.  Otherwise, EVERYONE will wait to buy insurance until they are sick.  It is a pretty simple concept.

So if you don't have insurance and you end up in a coma from a car crash, what happens when you get to the hospital?  Either the hospital treats you and passes the costs on to someone (rate payers or the government or maybe Mexico after they pay for the wall) or they refuse you and let you die.  Again, very simple.

There is no secret republican plan that is going to fix either of these problems.  There are no free market principles that apply.  The reality is that health care is really expensive and everyone needs it eventually.  You can have higher deductibles or lower ones but the cost of the actual care is going to be the same.

You can't say to a cancer patient, OK, for your budget, I can only offer you treatment that will keep you alive for a month.  Sorry, but you can't afford the treatment that can cure your cancer.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2019, 01:10:34 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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...It is a pretty simple concept.
....
45 doesn't understand even simple concepts, much less something as complex as health care.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2019, 02:12:19 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Quote
Big mistake, IMO.

You think so? 

I think it's smart politics.  He can criticize Obama's bill, while blaming Democrats for refusing to fix it.  Meanwhile, he doesn't have to get into the details of solving the problem, which will ultimately leave some constituency upset.

Campaigning against Obamacare and the Democrats has been a winning strategy.  It was only in 2018 -- when Trump couldn't blame Democrats, because Republicans controlled everything -- that it was a losing issue.

Once a CrotoNat, always a CrotoNat. CelticsBlog Draft Champions, 2009 & 2012.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2019, 02:22:42 PM »

Offline GetLucky

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You can't have protections for pre-existing conditions without a mandate.  Otherwise, EVERYONE will wait to buy insurance until they are sick.  It is a pretty simple concept.

So if you don't have insurance and you end up in a coma from a car crash, what happens when you get to the hospital?  Either the hospital treats you and passes the costs on to someone (rate payers or the government or maybe Mexico after they pay for the wall) or they refuse you and let you die.  Again, very simple.

There is no secret republican plan that is going to fix either of these problems.  There are no free market principles that apply.  The reality is that health care is really expensive and everyone needs it eventually.  You can have higher deductibles or lower ones but the cost of the actual care is going to be the same.

You can't say to a cancer patient, OK, for your budget, I can only offer you treatment that will keep you alive for a month.  Sorry, but you can't afford the treatment that can cure your cancer.

I still don't see the problem with grandfathering out social security and making that portion of the payroll tax into the public health fund for emergency and pre-existing medical treatment. That way, people could buy insurance for a truly cheap cost or stay off of it altogether, and people would be able to save the difference to account for the lack of social security. I honestly think people would have no problem giving up a few hundred dollars every two weeks if it guaranteed that everyone they know and love would die with dignity in comfort.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2019, 02:30:09 PM »

Offline Sophomore

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Quote
Big mistake, IMO.

You think so? 

I think it's smart politics.  He can criticize Obama's bill, while blaming Democrats for refusing to fix it.  Meanwhile, he doesn't have to get into the details of solving the problem, which will ultimately leave some constituency upset.

Campaigning against Obamacare and the Democrats has been a winning strategy.  It was only in 2018 -- when Trump couldn't blame Democrats, because Republicans controlled everything -- that it was a losing issue.

I agree that this new position (kicking the can down the road) is clearly better for him than his first position (in which he vowed to come up with a plan this term). He doesn't have a plan and neither does any R leader. When he was reminded of how badly it went last time he climbed down.

This climbdown is not as disastrous as his opening bid, but I'm not sure it's good politics for him, net, to be calling attention to this issue. After what happened in 2017, saying "put us in office and we'll do something great" isn't going to persuade anybody. Bashing Ds will always activate the R base, so there's that. But if he actually wanted to get to 51% of the electorate he would need to abandon the mindless attacks on ACA and actually try to get a bill through. Something that never would have been easy but is essentially unthinkable now.



 

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2019, 02:36:05 PM »

Offline liam

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You can't have protections for pre-existing conditions without a mandate.  Otherwise, EVERYONE will wait to buy insurance until they are sick.  It is a pretty simple concept.

So if you don't have insurance and you end up in a coma from a car crash, what happens when you get to the hospital?  Either the hospital treats you and passes the costs on to someone (rate payers or the government or maybe Mexico after they pay for the wall) or they refuse you and let you die.  Again, very simple.

There is no secret republican plan that is going to fix either of these problems.  There are no free market principles that apply.  The reality is that health care is really expensive and everyone needs it eventually.  You can have higher deductibles or lower ones but the cost of the actual care is going to be the same.

You can't say to a cancer patient, OK, for your budget, I can only offer you treatment that will keep you alive for a month.  Sorry, but you can't afford the treatment that can cure your cancer.

I still don't see the problem with grandfathering out social security and making that portion of the payroll tax into the public health fund for emergency and pre-existing medical treatment. That way, people could buy insurance for a truly cheap cost or stay off of it altogether, and people would be able to save the difference to account for the lack of social security. I honestly think people would have no problem giving up a few hundred dollars every two weeks if it guaranteed that everyone they know and love would die with dignity in comfort.

Social Security is the ultimate safety net. Messing with it is one of the worse things done in the last 3o years. That money should always be kept in it's own fund and should be made untouchable. It's not the Government's money, it's ours.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2019, 02:43:09 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Quote
Big mistake, IMO.

You think so? 

I think it's smart politics.  He can criticize Obama's bill, while blaming Democrats for refusing to fix it.  Meanwhile, he doesn't have to get into the details of solving the problem, which will ultimately leave some constituency upset.

Campaigning against Obamacare and the Democrats has been a winning strategy.  It was only in 2018 -- when Trump couldn't blame Democrats, because Republicans controlled everything -- that it was a losing issue.
I think it's smart politics to secure his base but if Trump is to win, he needs one of two things to happen.

1. He attracts more of moderate America than he did last election or

2. Hope the Democratic base is turned off of their candidate again and doesn't go to the polls.

I happen to think the Dems will come to the polls in this election to support their own. I think a lot of people on the left have learned their lesson that not voting because you don't like your candidate can be a giant mistake.

So since option 2 isn't available, Trump isn't doing himself any favors with moderate America by not coming up with an alternative solution.

2016 was 2016. Times have changed. The mid terms set the tone that healthcare and it's costs are what America is most concerned with. Republicans lost 40 seats in the House based on Healthcare.

I think it will be a mistake just to continue to criticize Obamacare without giving an alternative for the 10th and 11th straight year. Sure Republicans who have already decided they are voting again for Trump will eat up the "Repeal and Replace" rhetoric but not addressing this issue will severely hurt Trump with undecideds and or blue collar voters that went his way in 2016 but could go Dem due to unfulfilled promises to them and because their health insurance still sucks and is expensive

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2019, 02:56:58 PM »

Offline heyvik

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i kinda wish that the Republicans would just come out and say "We don't like the ACA (because of the 'Obama' in Obamacare) and we have no good replacement".....that's really what they are saying.

We've been down this road already...

 

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2019, 03:10:17 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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...It is a pretty simple concept.
....
45 doesn't understand even simple concepts, much less something as complex as health care.

Who knew?

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2019, 03:10:21 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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Republicans will regret the day they demagogued the ACA by naming it Obamacare...it was a partisan attempt to impugn the law by naming it after a president they dislike. Now they have given that president a legacy money cannot buy. Universal health will always have its genesis in Obamacare that is if it is not forever known as Obamacare.

The american peope are not going to fall for this latest attempt to kick the can down the road unless the idiot Democrats screw up the politics.

For those who say the Republicans do not have a plan, WRONG. They do or did, it was called Romneycare now it is called OBAMACARE. There is an old adage 'use it or lose it' Dems stole ACA from Republicans, that is why the Repubs dont have a plan.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2019, 03:27:28 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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The big scare tactic that the republicans are using is that democrats want to take away private insurance.  You can have single payer or the current Obamacare exchanges and still have an option for private insurance, either as a replacement or a supplement.

But to make any system work, you do need everyone to participate and you do need preexisting condition protection.  Yes, exactly like Romneycare.

And don't forget the main issue.  The issue isn't the cost of health care insurance.  The issue is the cost of the care itself, especially at the end of life.  This whole debate about the structure of insurance is just a political distraction.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2019, 03:39:47 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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Bingo....insurance is just used to obfuscate the real issue and insulate the real drivers of escalating healthcare cost... the providers. Isnt it interesting that a lot of hospitals are nonprofit yet the cost of care keeps going up.

Re: Trump punts healthcare down the road until after election.
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2019, 08:43:40 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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i kinda wish that the Republicans would just come out and say "We don't like the ACA (because of the 'Obama' in Obamacare) and we have no good replacement".....that's really what they are saying.

We've been down this road already...

Obamacare (ACA) is back in the news.  Do Republicans still really want to kill this?  It really is true that in polls, people say they hate Obamacare but like the ACA.  No mandate?  No assurance for pre-existing conditions?  How exactly is this supposed to work?

And now you are going to be able to get insurance in some states but not other states?

Quote
The 5th Circuit Court of Appeals said its decision to send the case back to District Court Judge Reed O'Connor was largely precipitated by the Trump administration switching legal positions in the case earlier this year. The Justice Department originally argued just the law's individual mandate and main insurance protections should be abolished. The department, under Attorney General William Barr, earlier this year expanded its legal assault on Obamacare to argue the entire law should be found unconstitutional only in the Republican-states challenging the law.

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/18/court-finds-obamacare-mandate-unconstitutional-sends-case-back-to-lower-court-087389