Author Topic: Once Zion is in the NBA...  (Read 1864 times)

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Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #30 on: March 15, 2019, 09:59:40 AM »

Offline td450

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I think he'll be playing bully ball a lot to start his career as he's likely going to be slotted at SF/PF, where more finesse forwards are playing.


Easier to do in college than in the pros.

No it isn't.

The college game typically favors guards and does not make it easy on players at the rim. Duke does not have great shooting, and defenses pack it in. The pros have much better spacing.

This guy is consistently shooting at a near 70% clip. Its hard to believe.

I think he's going to be dominant, because he's amazingly quick, both physically and mentally. He makes great decisions and has spectacular body control. I think his skill level is off the charts.


Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #31 on: March 15, 2019, 10:07:52 AM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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By the way, Zion is 70% from the field this season, but he is 73% since the beginning of January and 76% since the beginning of February.

His 3fg% is at 31% for the year, but he is 39% since January 1st (on more attempts per game).

That means that as the competition has gotten better, he has gotten more efficient.
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Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #32 on: March 15, 2019, 10:09:35 AM »

Offline manl_lui

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How will his game translate? Heís a man amongst boys in the NCAA right now, just bulls everyone over...It wonít be that simple once he gets to the NBA and other than his spectacular dunking ability, everything else seems raw. 3pt shooting 29%, FT 66%, Ast 2.2, Blk 1.8, Stl 2.2. Doesnít  have great ball handling skills. What do you think his ceiling/floor is?
I think ten years from now people are going to look back and think how silly they were for thinking Zion was the next transcendental talent. Not saying he won't be good or won't be able to carve out a nice career, but the next Lebron/Barkley he is not.

i think this is a fair comment, we don't know what will happen or how he will improve but labeling him the next LeBron might be overblown. I don't know why but for some reason it reminds me of Smart's draft where Wiggins and Parker went #1 and #2. Besides Embiid being a home run for the 76ers, I remember people were disappointed we didn't tank hard enough for Parker or Wiggins and fast forward a few years later, I think it's fair most people here are glad to have taken smart at 6 (myself included)

I remember the hype surrounding those players were so big that it was tank or nothing

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #33 on: March 15, 2019, 10:11:37 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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With his performance and physical ability it's more likely he'll be a superstar than not. The big questions are if he can develop a consistent 3, become a better passer/ball-handler in the NBA, and if his body is durable. He's not going to be able to bully through the post nearly as often in the NBA, so he'll need to get craftier and diversify his offense. But he will be athletically dominant, pretty much right away, and has good touch on the ball and feel for the game. That's not enough by itself but it's a huge head start.
I think he'll be playing bully ball a lot to start his career as he's likely going to be slotted at SF/PF, where more finesse forwards are playing.

I agree he'll try, and probably have some success, but teams will adjust to that by bringing help and challenge him to kick it out effectively - or won't, as post-type play isn't very efficient - or put him on the line til he becomes reliable there. He went 13-13 from the field and 2-9 from the line. Doesn't take an NBA coach's mind to figure out that math.

He's so incredibly athletic and polished enough around the rim that he will still be very good if that's the center of his game. Just saying to be a superstar, let alone a Giannis/Durant level of MVP-caliber wing, he'll need a broader range of threats.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #34 on: March 15, 2019, 12:47:57 PM »

Online Sophomore

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How will his game translate? He’s a man amongst boys in the NCAA right now, just bulls everyone over...It won’t be that simple once he gets to the NBA and other than his spectacular dunking ability, everything else seems raw. 3pt shooting 29%, FT 66%, Ast 2.2, Blk 1.8, Stl 2.2. Doesn’t  have great ball handling skills. What do you think his ceiling/floor is?
I think ten years from now people are going to look back and think how silly they were for thinking Zion was the next transcendental talent. Not saying he won't be good or won't be able to carve out a nice career, but the next Lebron/Barkley he is not.

That's how I feel.  Scottie Pippen said something along the lines of Zion being the biggest rookie prospect to hit the league since MJ.  It's crazy to me.

The guy is an insane athlete.  But, between his height and range, I don't think he's a lock to be a superstar.
I saw that Pippen video too and it confused me, because as someone who doesn't follow College ball at all I had been under the impression he wasn't even the best prospect at his own school. 

Should he be realistically seen as someone like Blake Griffin?

Addressed this above - ZW’s performance is much, much better than Griffin’s freshman year.

If you think he’s not considered the best prospect at Duke, I’m not sure where you’re reading that. Don’t think I’ve seen a single site rank Barret or Reddish ahead of him.
Barrett was ranked #1 on sites at the start of the season but that quickly changed.  Just watched a Youtube video arguing the Barrett is the better pro prospect albeit slightly.  For me, Barrett would need to be a lot better shooter to be in the conversation for #1.

I agree that before the season started, there were some who liked Barrett better. I think that is a decidedly minority view today. What the season is showing us is that Williamson’s athleticism and feel for the game do translate in division one. Last night, against Syracuse, he finished 13 out of 13 for 29 points, with 14 rebounds. On the season his TS% is .705 on volume shooting, with a PER over 42. This is video game stuff.

I was a real doubter before the season began; every highlight reel seemed to show uncontested dunks and domination of players in high school who were vastly inferior. That kind of thing never excites me. But he is still doing it against the best college players in the game, and I don’t see any reason to think he won’t keep playing extremely well at the next level. He’s not just a strong guy who can jump. He has a feel for the game, change of pace and direction.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #35 on: March 15, 2019, 01:04:58 PM »

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I still believe Barrett will have the better career.

Zion's game is so heavily based on athleticism and size that once that advantage declines, I dont know just what he will give you.
And the NBA has ALOT bigger and stronger dudes to get in front of Zion that what college ball can throw at him.

Also one needs to account that Zion is playing with 2 other top 5 picks for one of the greatest coaches of all time. in the NBA he is not going to have that level of talent around him, he will be double teamed relentlessly.

There is no denying that Barrett has NBA size, mentality and skillset and of all of those things, they will translate easily to the next level.
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Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #36 on: March 15, 2019, 02:41:25 PM »

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I still believe Barrett will have the better career.

Zion's game is so heavily based on athleticism and size that once that advantage declines, I dont know just what he will give you.
And the NBA has ALOT bigger and stronger dudes to get in front of Zion that what college ball can throw at him.

Also one needs to account that Zion is playing with 2 other top 5 picks for one of the greatest coaches of all time. in the NBA he is not going to have that level of talent around him, he will be double teamed relentlessly.

There is no denying that Barrett has NBA size, mentality and skillset and of all of those things, they will translate easily to the next level.

Barrett is definitely an intriguing player. He might be very good. Of course, he also benefits by playing next to two top-5 players...

With Williamson, my main concern is injury. If heís healthy I have a hard time seeing how he isnít an all star. People mentioned Blake Griffin. Williamson is a very rich manís Blake Griffin - stronger, faster, better feel for the game. Blake was an all star his first year in the league.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #37 on: March 15, 2019, 03:15:48 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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I still believe Barrett will have the better career.

Zion's game is so heavily based on athleticism and size that once that advantage declines, I dont know just what he will give you.
And the NBA has ALOT bigger and stronger dudes to get in front of Zion that what college ball can throw at him.

Also one needs to account that Zion is playing with 2 other top 5 picks for one of the greatest coaches of all time. in the NBA he is not going to have that level of talent around him, he will be double teamed relentlessly.

There is no denying that Barrett has NBA size, mentality and skillset and of all of those things, they will translate easily to the next level.

Barrett is definitely an intriguing player. He might be very good. Of course, he also benefits by playing next to two top-5 players...

With Williamson, my main concern is injury. If heís healthy I have a hard time seeing how he isnít an all star. People mentioned Blake Griffin. Williamson is a very rich manís Blake Griffin - stronger, faster, better feel for the game. Blake was an all star his first year in the league.

I definitely don't love the concerns about injury with Williamson. The amount of weight and the way he he puts pressure on his ligaments when he explodes off the floor is concerning. The way he jumps and changes direction reminds me a little of Brandon Roy or Derrick Rose.
Most talent in the league. We don't want or need AD.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #38 on: March 15, 2019, 03:27:35 PM »

Offline Smartacus

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Consider me in the camp that think that Zion is a special case.

His ceiling is a top 5 player

His likely outcome is a Top 20 Player

His floor is out of the league because his body couldn't hold up. -I don't see a world where a healthy Zion Williamson isn't a force in the NBA-

Zion has the potential to have the highest gravity since Shaq. We always hear about floor spacing shooters opening up the driving lanes for cutters. I remember however reading an article about how AD and Mavs era Tyson Chandler have a similar effect on opposing defenses but they instead draw attention from their gravity. The threat to lob opens up the shooting lanes around the basket any time the high grav player makes a hard cut or is in position for a put back. Zion Williamson has crushing gravity.

He's going to enter the league as the second heaviest player to Boban. I see a lot of people touting his use of 'Bully Ball' as if it's not going to work at the NBA level. Frankly I don't think bully ball is the right moniker for how he generates points and rebounds.

Zion Williamson is a high character kid coming from good parents, he doesn't fit the personality type of the typical guys that thrive off bullying smaller players. What he does do is exert his will and might on every situation that he's out there, he must always be accounted for or else your not far from a lob or athletic putback.

Bully Ball implies that he'll run into bigger players that will negate his presence. I'm saying from day one you'll be able to count on one hand the guys that can check him and I don't see one guy that will flat negate him save for maybe Embiid. He's too strong, too fast, too athletic. If he cant go around you, he'll go above you. If he cant go above you he'll go through you.

The final thing that I think separates Zion from the typical max contract player is that you don't need to run your offense through him for Zion to thrive. He's proven at Duke that he doesn't need the majority of the plays run for him or shots to be a force. Guys like Blake Griffin are fine players but they need their shots and in general the ball in their hand to create for themselves and others. Zion is more the type of guy you stick next to a Westbrook or a Harden type and let him find his points and rebounds while your high volume shooter eats up the possessions. 

I'm all in on Zion and have been since I thought there was a chance to grab him with the Sac Pick.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #39 on: March 15, 2019, 04:26:12 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I still believe Barrett will have the better career.

Zion's game is so heavily based on athleticism and size that once that advantage declines, I dont know just what he will give you.
And the NBA has ALOT bigger and stronger dudes to get in front of Zion that what college ball can throw at him.

Also one needs to account that Zion is playing with 2 other top 5 picks for one of the greatest coaches of all time. in the NBA he is not going to have that level of talent around him, he will be double teamed relentlessly.

There is no denying that Barrett has NBA size, mentality and skillset and of all of those things, they will translate easily to the next level.

Barrett is definitely an intriguing player. He might be very good. Of course, he also benefits by playing next to two top-5 players...

With Williamson, my main concern is injury. If heís healthy I have a hard time seeing how he isnít an all star. People mentioned Blake Griffin. Williamson is a very rich manís Blake Griffin - stronger, faster, better feel for the game. Blake was an all star his first year in the league.

I definitely don't love the concerns about injury with Williamson. The amount of weight and the way he he puts pressure on his ligaments when he explodes off the floor is concerning. The way he jumps and changes direction reminds me a little of Brandon Roy or Derrick Rose.
Yes, he is extremely violent in his change of direction moves. You see people like Durant, Kyrie and Curry that have such smooth change of direction moves and you know you never have to worry about what the wear and tear of those moves will have on them.

The Derrick Rose comparison is very apt when you compare the way both players plant and move to change direction. It's a very sudden and violent action as compared to the say the way Kyrie does things.

Hope he stays healthy forever but I can see where people might be worried about long term injury concerns, especially if he adds even more mass to that frame.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #40 on: March 15, 2019, 04:39:15 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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I still believe Barrett will have the better career.

Zion's game is so heavily based on athleticism and size that once that advantage declines, I dont know just what he will give you.
And the NBA has ALOT bigger and stronger dudes to get in front of Zion that what college ball can throw at him.

Also one needs to account that Zion is playing with 2 other top 5 picks for one of the greatest coaches of all time. in the NBA he is not going to have that level of talent around him, he will be double teamed relentlessly.

There is no denying that Barrett has NBA size, mentality and skillset and of all of those things, they will translate easily to the next level.

Barrett is definitely an intriguing player. He might be very good. Of course, he also benefits by playing next to two top-5 players...

With Williamson, my main concern is injury. If heís healthy I have a hard time seeing how he isnít an all star. People mentioned Blake Griffin. Williamson is a very rich manís Blake Griffin - stronger, faster, better feel for the game. Blake was an all star his first year in the league.

I definitely don't love the concerns about injury with Williamson. The amount of weight and the way he he puts pressure on his ligaments when he explodes off the floor is concerning. The way he jumps and changes direction reminds me a little of Brandon Roy or Derrick Rose.
Yes, he is extremely violent in his change of direction moves. You see people like Durant, Kyrie and Curry that have such smooth change of direction moves and you know you never have to worry about what the wear and tear of those moves will have on them.

The Derrick Rose comparison is very apt when you compare the way both players plant and move to change direction. It's a very sudden and violent action as compared to the say the way Kyrie does things.

Hope he stays healthy forever but I can see where people might be worried about long term injury concerns, especially if he adds even more mass to that frame.

Still, I will add that if he lost all his explosiveness, I think he could be a max player as a combination of Draymond Green/Julius Randle.
Most talent in the league. We don't want or need AD.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #41 on: March 15, 2019, 06:50:56 PM »

Offline Celtics17

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This guy is going to be a force in the league right away. His size alone would get him a ton of boards and points from put backs but Zion also has incredible physical skills to go with that. Barring injury he should be at least a career 20/10 guy and possibly more. I can't wait to see him matchup with Lebron.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #42 on: March 15, 2019, 07:58:32 PM »

Offline IDreamCeltics

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He's going to be an NBA center at 6'7.  I think it will be a rough transition from college to the pros.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #43 on: March 15, 2019, 08:08:48 PM »

Offline Who

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I still think of Willis Reed whenever I see Zion play. That combination of speed and strength as an undersized big man who can face people up and drive by them. Zion can be a special player but he needs a jump-shot to be that special player. Too hard otherwise as a 6-7 center.

Re: Once Zion is in the NBA...
« Reply #44 on: March 15, 2019, 10:08:43 PM »

Offline Goldstar88

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Itís a back to back, but he looks tired out there... hope he has a better second half to make this a game.

 

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