Author Topic: Celtics locker room issue  (Read 2409 times)

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Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2019, 08:34:15 PM »

Offline cman88

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also another thing that's been lost in all this stevens cluster-f!@#... 1st and 2nd yr. players don't typically carry a team to a conference finals. yeah bench one of those guys for a one legged guy...

They don't, but the east was pretty weak last year. Last years playoffs team likely doesn't make it past the first round this year.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2019, 08:34:26 PM »

Offline Fierce1

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Gary Washburn: The #Celtics locker room issues arenít that big of a surprise to some NBA folks I talked to today. The consensus is that the players arenít necessarily beefing but they arenít that close. Itís like they are trying to coexist politely, and itís not working. 1 hour ago Ė via Twitter GwashburnGlobe

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2019, 08:43:07 PM »

Offline GreenWarrior

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also another thing that's been lost in all this stevens cluster-f!@#... 1st and 2nd yr. players don't typically carry a team to a conference finals. yeah bench one of those guys for a one legged guy...

They don't, but the east was pretty weak last year. Last years playoffs team likely doesn't make it past the first round this year.

well let's just bring back Avery Bradley and Kelly Olynyk in favor of tatum and brown so our coach can coach.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2019, 08:45:10 PM »

Offline cman88

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also another thing that's been lost in all this stevens cluster-f!@#... 1st and 2nd yr. players don't typically carry a team to a conference finals. yeah bench one of those guys for a one legged guy...

They don't, but the east was pretty weak last year. Last years playoffs team likely doesn't make it past the first round this year.

well let's just bring back Avery Bradley and Kelly Olynyk in favor of tatum and brown so our coach can coach.

not saying to let Brad off the hook. Clearly the fact that he hasnt gotten this team to play together for a consistent stretch is proof that he is failing in that department this year.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2019, 08:49:50 PM »

Offline Fierce1

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You can't blame the coach if the players don't like each other.

Celtic fans wanted Doc Rivers fired before the 2007 trade that brought KG and Ray to Boston.
When the Celts had Pierce, KG, and Ray, Doc looked like a genius.

The problem with the Celtics right now is they don't have the right mix of players.

How can you have good chemistry when the players don't like each other?

It's looking like there's a silent war between the veterans and the young players.
Proof of this is Morris shoving Brown not so long ago.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2019, 10:12:12 PM »

Offline RJ87

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This is all BS. Winning cures all. Just play the guys that play to win every game. If Kyrie is 3-17 and Rozier has 17 points off the bench, play Rozier to finish the game. The next game Kyrie will make sure he plays better. Stevens hasn't even created competition from within the team...no one is worried about losing minutes.

This has legit happened one time this season. And no, the guy shooting 50% from the floor is not going to be in fear of losing minutes to the guy shooting 38% from the field.
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Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2019, 10:31:30 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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You can't blame the coach if the players don't like each other.

How can you have good chemistry when the players don't like each other?
And sometimes the GM can do their best to build a team and sometimes the coach can coach the ever living daylights out of a team and sometimes you can have all the talent in the world.

And then sometimes the players personalities clash and the players don't like each other and either you get what happened under the Billy Martin New York Yankees or you can get what is happening with the Celtics this year.

I am not saying this team has a bunch of guys that don't like each other but it is at least a good possibility of what is wrong with this team.

Me? I still think they can go all 1976-77 Yankees and win it all in spite of the fact they don't like each other.

And if all this is true, it will be interesting who Ainge decides to keep to pair along with Kyrie and Davis. Probably will be guys that get along with Kyrie.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2019, 11:03:25 PM »

Offline GreenWarrior

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You can't blame the coach if the players don't like each other.

Celtic fans wanted Doc Rivers fired before the 2007 trade that brought KG and Ray to Boston.
When the Celts had Pierce, KG, and Ray, Doc looked like a genius.

The problem with the Celtics right now is they don't have the right mix of players.

How can you have good chemistry when the players don't like each other?

It's looking like there's a silent war between the veterans and the young players.
Proof of this is Morris shoving Brown not so long ago.

the doc coached team is not a good example in your case. that whole team has admitted that ray allen was into his own thing and doc did what a good NBA coach does and got players who might not get along to play together.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2019, 02:06:07 AM »

Offline Fierce1

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You can't blame the coach if the players don't like each other.

Celtic fans wanted Doc Rivers fired before the 2007 trade that brought KG and Ray to Boston.
When the Celts had Pierce, KG, and Ray, Doc looked like a genius.

The problem with the Celtics right now is they don't have the right mix of players.

How can you have good chemistry when the players don't like each other?

It's looking like there's a silent war between the veterans and the young players.
Proof of this is Morris shoving Brown not so long ago.

the doc coached team is not a good example in your case. that whole team has admitted that ray allen was into his own thing and doc did what a good NBA coach does and got players who might not get along to play together.

It's not that simple.

If the problem is only one player then it's easier to manage.

But with the case of this year's Celtics, it's veterans vs. young players.

It's like the team is divided into two.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2019, 08:00:03 AM »

Offline Big333223

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Gary Washburn: The #Celtics locker room issues arenít that big of a surprise to some NBA folks I talked to today. The consensus is that the players arenít necessarily beefing but they arenít that close. Itís like they are trying to coexist politely, and itís not working. 1 hour ago Ė via Twitter GwashburnGlobe

The players not liking one another isn't a problem, per se. I don't think Bird particularly liked McHale. Scottie Pippen hated Dennis Rodman and they still got to 3 titles. Shaq and Kobe never liked one another but won 3 and made another Finals before it blew up.

If everyone has the same goal and feels like everyone else is pulling their weight, I don't think guys have to "like" one another. The question is: do they trust one another. And if not everyone trusts one another (to pull their weight, to have the correct mindset and goals) then we've got a real problem.
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Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2019, 09:43:49 AM »

Offline KGBirdBias

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I think when Stevens  immediately put Hayward back in the starting lineup to begin the season really destroyed the locker room. He could've eased in throughout the year. The players saw he wasn't ready in practice and it created animosity.

Time for Stevens to cut his minutes back and to 10-12 but not above 15. That's the reality and we all like Hayward but its go time and Brown has earned those minutes.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2019, 09:47:28 AM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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I think when Stevens  immediately put Hayward back in the starting lineup to begin the season really destroyed the locker room. He could've eased in throughout the year. The players saw he wasn't ready in practice and it created animosity.

Time for Stevens to cut his minutes back and to 10-12 but not above 15. That's the reality and we all like Hayward but its go time and Brown has earned those minutes.

We know you think that. You keep saying that in multiple threads.

Hayward's traditional stats might not be where anyone wants them yet, but his impact on the court is quantified with the Cs offensive rating and net rating with him out there, both of which are higher than Rozier's and Brown's.

It's not just CBS. The whole team needs and wants Hayward to get back in order to be successful.
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Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #27 on: February 11, 2019, 09:50:08 AM »

Offline Pvictor11

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I think when Stevens  immediately put Hayward back in the starting lineup to begin the season really destroyed the locker room. He could've eased in throughout the year. The players saw he wasn't ready in practice and it created animosity.

Time for Stevens to cut his minutes back and to 10-12 but not above 15. That's the reality and we all like Hayward but its go time and Brown has earned those minutes.
I agree with you about Hayward in the beginning of the year, but it is water under the bridge and nothing can be done to go back in time.
But CutTing Hayward minutes now that he is actually improving might be even worse because he will be needed in the playoffs and needs to keep improving his confidence. I would like to see Morris minutes get cut in favor of the young guys, especially brown.
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Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #28 on: February 11, 2019, 10:01:05 AM »

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You can't blame the coach if the players don't like each other.

Celtic fans wanted Doc Rivers fired before the 2007 trade that brought KG and Ray to Boston.
When the Celts had Pierce, KG, and Ray, Doc looked like a genius.

The problem with the Celtics right now is they don't have the right mix of players.

How can you have good chemistry when the players don't like each other?

It's looking like there's a silent war between the veterans and the young players.
Proof of this is Morris shoving Brown not so long ago.

the doc coached team is not a good example in your case. that whole team has admitted that ray allen was into his own thing and doc did what a good NBA coach does and got players who might not get along to play together.

Paul Pierce also said it probably wouldn't have worked if they were all younger.

Re: Celtics locker room issue
« Reply #29 on: February 11, 2019, 10:02:28 AM »

Offline ozgod

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probably the young guys vs. the veterans.

That's what I think it's happening. If it is, it needs to be solved asap. There is no way a team can win only with veterans nor only with youngsters. Everybody is needed

the problem is that the Young guys feel entitled since they lead the team to the ECF last year. At this point one would think they would be humbled. But nope...

Entitled for sure, but they're young, that's the thing with young people. They think they can achieve anything. Couple that with the fact that they are all trying to make names for themselves in the league and have their own personal goals, and get paid. If you make it in the NBA, you didn't get there by being a bench player or a support cast in high school, you were the Man. So they have that mentality. Remember when Kyrie said he called LeBum to apologize it was because as a young player he had his own goals and didn't appreciate being told to pull his head in for the good of the team. These guys haven't made it yet - they're still on their rookie contracts. They want to get paid, make All-Star teams, be the talk of the league.

Those are all reasonable goals. It's just that with the depth in the team sometimes the team goal conflicts with those individual goals. This is a very unusual situation where you have 3 young guys that had breakout seasons, led a team to the ECF against all expectations, and were a half away from making the Finals. Against all expectations. Most times young players, or players, play that well, the typical path of progression (the reward if you like) is more minutes, a more prominent role in the team, more touches, because well they earned it right?

But no, this season their reward was to actually get less minutes, less touches, because a couple of the big guns (who didn't contribute to playoff success last season) are back now, and we have to fit them in, and oh a couple of the bench guys are now going to start, so they are told to suck it up for the good of the team. And I think for the most part they try to, but when those goals aren't aligned then there's always the risk of players playing for themselves. How often do you see that in the NBA, or professional sports, where players are rewarded for success by being given lesser roles?

I don't really blame them for having individual goals, you have to if this is your career. This team is really a case study in goal alignment, you have young guys trying to show what they can do and be compensated, you have vets trying to get that big payday, you have a player trying to show he can come back from a career threatening injury and be worth the $30m he was paid before it, you have a star learning to be a leader...you have a lot of people pulling in a lot of directions. It's Brad and Danny's responsibility, along with Kyrie and Al as the "veteran leaders" of the team, to make sure everyone buys into this season's version of UBUNTU, and make sure that their individual goals are all aligned with team goals, and to get them all to buy in, consistently. That's what leaders have to do to lead successfully. And it's not easy, remember Doc saying it was easier for Paul, KG and Ray to accept it because they'd achieved their individual goals for the most part but it was harder for Rondo, Perk and the younger guys who were trying to show what they could do.

Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

 

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