Sincerely not trying to troll RE Ben Simmons Future. But...

[sawick48]

I just question if you can build a championship team around a Point guard who cant shoot or hit free throws and a big man with an injury history.

stranger things have happened, but its counter to what the current NBA is.

And before people say "Simmons can develop a jump shot and free throws" not every player can develop a consistent shot. I've been hearing that about Marcus smart for the last 5 years...and Prior to that Rondo each summer about how he would finally Develop a shot/hit free throws.

This is a point I totally agree with, and catch alot of flak for. "Learning" to shoot in the nba is such a tricky proposition. I'm of the mind that fundamentals can be tweaked, but a shot cannot be constructed from the ground up. If you have a good base to start with, it can be adjusted to make a decent shot over time (think Rozier)

But if you come into the league with a wonky shot and obscure fundamentals that go with it, and the answer is to start from scratch; I've yet to see that work in terms of creating an effective shooter from one who wasn't that already (ala Kidd-Gilchrist)

[SparzWizard]

Ben Simmons still hasn't beaten Jaylen Brown yet.

[colincb]

I just question if you can build a championship team around a Point guard who cant shoot or hit free throws and a big man with an injury history.

stranger things have happened, but its counter to what the current NBA is.

And before people say "Simmons can develop a jump shot and free throws" not every player can develop a consistent shot. I've been hearing that about Marcus smart for the last 5 years...and Prior to that Rondo each summer about how he would finally Develop a shot/hit free throws.

This is a point I totally agree with, and catch alot of flak for. "Learning" to shoot in the nba is such a tricky proposition. I'm of the mind that fundamentals can be tweaked, but a shot cannot be constructed from the ground up. If you have a good base to start with, it can be adjusted to make a decent shot over time (think Rozier)

But if you come into the league with a wonky shot and obscure fundamentals that go with it, and the answer is to start from scratch; I've yet to see that work in terms of creating an effective shooter from one who wasn't that already (ala Kidd-Gilchrist)

I'm always skeptical about players who cannot shoot from either distance AND from the FT line. They never seem to get markedly better and Simmons mechanics are as bad as any. I wouldn't knock his stats much though since he has elite playmaking ability and he'll get his dunks and boards. Rondo with height, but less defense. Will he be Playoff-Rondo-level overall (and playoff-Rondo is real)? Questionable. Rondo burns inside and is a very smart guy. Don't see the burn in Simmons myself and too far away to see how BB smart he is.

As for Embiid, his longevity/availability will always be in question, but his conditioning seems suspect. OTOH, he played a lot of minutes against 2 very good big man defenders last night. For 30+ minutes he can be a franchise player. However, he's not transcendent like Russell-Wilt-Magic-Bird-Jordan-Kobe-Duncan-Lebron even if he has a normal career.

[colincb]

Then I ran up against this story. Maybe there's hope.

Brett Brown relayed an important message to the Sixers before the playoffs began.

The regular season was an 82-game learning experience. The postseason, well, that would be a completely different kind of education.

"You're going to learn more about yourself in skill package, in spirit in the next few weeks than maybe you've learned your whole career," Brown told the Sixers. "That's what the playoffs do to you."

The Eastern Conference semifinals have been a crash course for Ben Simmons. The Rookie of the Year candidate has been intensely studied, strategized against and tested by the Celtics, who lead the series 3-0.

"[I have learned] that I've got a lot of growing to do," Simmons said following the Sixers' 101-98 overtime loss Saturday. "It's the first season I've played, the first time I've played in the playoffs. I'm learning a lot."

https://sports.yahoo.com/ben-simmons-learning-lot-growing-021138202.html

[hodgy03038]

I was listening to Tim Legler on NBA radio the other day stating at how BAD his shooting mechanics are and how he holds the ball and actually Legler volunteered to work with him (via the radio waves) and Legler stated it would take a minimum of two months just to try to correct one facet of his shooting and ball placement problems.

[footey]

I was listening to Tim Legler on NBA radio the other day stating at how BAD his shooting mechanics are and how he holds the ball and actually Legler volunteered to work with him (via the radio waves) and Legler stated it would take a minimum of two months just to try to correct one facet of his shooting and ball placement problems.

Yeah I said the same thing on this forum. Difficult to correct.

[hpantazo]

Then I ran up against this story. Maybe there's hope.

Brett Brown relayed an important message to the Sixers before the playoffs began.

The regular season was an 82-game learning experience. The postseason, well, that would be a completely different kind of education.

"You're going to learn more about yourself in skill package, in spirit in the next few weeks than maybe you've learned your whole career," Brown told the Sixers. "That's what the playoffs do to you."

The Eastern Conference semifinals have been a crash course for Ben Simmons. The Rookie of the Year candidate has been intensely studied, strategized against and tested by the Celtics, who lead the series 3-0.

"[I have learned] that I've got a lot of growing to do," Simmons said following the Sixers' 101-98 overtime loss Saturday. "It's the first season I've played, the first time I've played in the playoffs. I'm learning a lot."

https://sports.yahoo.com/ben-simmons-learning-lot-growing-021138202.html

Yeah, I mean, this is a great experience for the Sixers. Who expected them to make the playoffs, never mind make a legit ECF attempt, this year? This is the first playoff experience for Simmons and Embiid. I would have been shocked if they didn't struggle. They are going to be very tough in a few years once they gain some experience and maturity. Good thing we have Kyrie, Hayward, and a bunch of picks ourselves to be even better.

[Boris Badenov]

Yeah, I mean, this is a great experience for the Sixers. Who expected them to make the playoffs, never mind make a legit ECF attempt, this year? This is the first playoff experience for Simmons and Embiid. I would have been shocked if they didn't struggle.

Everything there applies to the Celtics and Tatum too. I guess they didn't get the message.

[hpantazo]

Yeah, I mean, this is a great experience for the Sixers. Who expected them to make the playoffs, never mind make a legit ECF attempt, this year? This is the first playoff experience for Simmons and Embiid. I would have been shocked if they didn't struggle.

Everything there applies to the Celtics and Tatum too. I guess they didn't get the message.

Rozier, Brown and Smart all went to ECF last year. Horford and Morris are playoff vets. Not quite the same thing overall.

[nickagneta]

I just question if you can build a championship team around a Point guard who cant shoot or hit free throws and a big man with an injury history.

stranger things have happened, but its counter to what the current NBA is.

And before people say "Simmons can develop a jump shot and free throws" not every player can develop a consistent shot. I've been hearing that about Marcus smart for the last 5 years...and Prior to that Rondo each summer about how he would finally Develop a shot/hit free throws.

This is a point I totally agree with, and catch alot of flak for. "Learning" to shoot in the nba is such a tricky proposition. I'm of the mind that fundamentals can be tweaked, but a shot cannot be constructed from the ground up. If you have a good base to start with, it can be adjusted to make a decent shot over time (think Rozier)

But if you come into the league with a wonky shot and obscure fundamentals that go with it, and the answer is to start from scratch; I've yet to see that work in terms of creating an effective shooter from one who wasn't that already (ala Kidd-Gilchrist)

Not to mention you also have to have a ton of confidence to shoot more and more even though you aren't good at it. You can try to tweak someone's form or rebuild a shot, but if that player doesn't have the confidence to use that tweaked or rebuilt form in games, in circumstances he doesn't feel comfirtable in and from distances he doesn't feel comfortable with, he is never going to develop that shot.

Right now Simmons has zero confidence to shoot anything outside the paint and doesn't force the issue inside to get the fouls and head to the line. If that doesn't change, he will NEVER reach the potential so many thinks he has.

[MVPPierceNoJoke]

I have not liked the guy since his first game when he said it felt like he was playing 2k out there. Take that how you want, but that is so arrogant imo. He is now using the rookie card as a shield from the criticism. The thing is Tatum is a rookie too and he is breaking playoff record. His skill set is elite, but he might have the Carmelo mentality.

[LarBrd33]

The Rivalry is BACK and it will be GUD for the next 5-10 years.

I hear this a lot....and I disagree.  I think the Sixers will be an obstacle for another year or so and with then fall apart pretty quickly (think last year's Bulls team).

Why?  Am I the only one that watches Embiid's game and thinks: this guy's body is moving like an old man's body?  There's just too much unnatural hitching in his movements...like when my old bones move in the morning after just waking up.  I noticed that when he went out of the game yesterday, he immediately laid down on the sidelines on his back.  He's only 24 years old, has already missed an entire year to injury and now prefers to lie on his back when he exits games?  I wouldn't say he's got an Oden body...but I think he's much closer to that than Hakeem's.  I fully expect his injury history to continue to pile up in the next couple of years and we continue to read stories about how the Sixers organization has to "adapt" to long stretches of the season without Embiid.

Agreed on Embiid.

He looks worse physically than he did last season. Worse lateral movement on the perimeter when switched onto guards. Slower help & recovery. Slower off the ground.

It is worrying to see how much he is struggling to maintain his athleticism so early in his career.

I imagine this opinion is based mainly on games you've watched Embiid play against Boston.

Ya'll realize that Horford has played Embiid better than arguably any player in the league, right?

Embiid averaged 23 points, 11 rebounds, 3.2 assists, 1.8 blocks with 48%/31%/77% shooting this season in 30mpg.

On October 20th, Horford held Embiid to 11 points on 4-16 shooting (25%) and 0-6 from three.   That was basically a season low.  On Jan 1st, Horfod held him to 15 points on 6-17 shooting (35%).  A week later, Embiid crushed us, but those two games were probably his worst of the entire season.

In this series, he's been frustrated by Horford in a big way.  It's also worth noting that he was struggling to adapt to that mask in Round 1 so the guy probably isn't at his best right now. 

If all you watched this season of Embiid were the games he played against Boston, you could probably come away thinking he was a chump.  Don't undersell Horford here.

Also despite the inefficiency, Embiid is still averaging 24 points, 15 rebounds and 4 assists in these past 3 games.  Pretty decent.