POLL:Who do you think wins this trade?

[jpotter33]

Right now, I think we solidly win this trade given IT's injury being more of a concern than we thought.

We'll have to wait until next summer with the draft and playoffs before making a final grade.

[Big333223]

Right now, I think we solidly win this trade given IT's injury being more of a concern than we thought.

We'll have to wait until next summer with the draft and playoffs before making a final grade.

Pretty much this.

At the end of the day, I think the Celtics came away with the best player. The Nets pick could, eventually, change how I feel about this but even if the Cavs get a great player out of it, turning injured IT and a couple of role players into someone I think can be an MVP candidate for the next 8 years is a good trade.

[Vermont Green]

I don't think anyone loses this trade.  Both teams seem to me to have moved in the direction of their differing goals. 

It is a good deal for the Cavs.  I feel they are better for this coming season with IT and Crowder.  They can make one more run with LeBron.  Plus they get a very valuable pick that they can use or trade depending on where the team goes after this season.  I think IT will be fine and will put up a courageous season and be better than everyone expects.  That is just the way he does things.

I like it for the Celtics too.  Kyrie will hopefully be with the team for a while where IT probably wasn't.  We convert one of our picks (actually two if you consider Zizic) into a really good player.  We still have a solid young core and one more lottery pick to work with.  I am not sure if we "win" the trade but I think we are better for it or at least moving in the right direction.

[ssspence]

Cleveland.

The difference between Kyrie and IT isn't Crowder, Zizic, the BRK pick, and a #2.

IT and Kyrie are similarly great, and similarly flawed. I'd ride or die with the guy who showed that he can carry a team.

So do you feel Kyrie has hit his ceiling?

In the important areas, yes.

What about playoffs? Do you see them as significantly differentiated,
only marginally so, or equal?

[Surferdad]

With the news that IT is out to start the season, it is obvious that Celtics won the trade.  A 2nd rounder doesn't really make up for a missing IT.  Glad I waited until today to vote. 

[Chris22]

Irving, Brown, Heyward, Tatum, and Horford.
This season is going to be amazing!

[mmmmm]

Right now, I think we solidly win this trade given IT's injury being more of a concern than we thought.

We'll have to wait until next summer with the draft and playoffs before making a final grade.

IF it is true and ends up that Thomas' hip is a bigger impairment to his career than we thought, then we probably won this deal.

The thing that concerns me is that, if that assumption is true, then why would CLE settle for just a 2020 second-rounder as the mitigation for that concern?

If Isaiah is now worthless, that means the Cavs basically got just BKN18, Jae & Zizic for Kyrie Irving.    That's not a good return for a 25-year old all-star.   And it would mean punting on this season and Lebron James completely.   Because they aren't going to be contending if a healthy Thomas isn't part of the mix and a 2020 2nd rounder isn't going to make IT any healthier.

I suspect that, no, the 'concerns over IT's hip' thing was, in the end, nothing more than a ploy by CLE to milk an extra asset out of the deal.   The finalized the deal because they _are_ ok with where Thomas is at and believe he likely will be back at some point this season and able to contribute to a playoff push.

Now, even if he is, that doesn't mean we won't still have won the trade.   It will depend on just how effective he is when he comes back.    And long term, it will depend on what the BKN18 pick and Zizic develop into (as well as whether they re-sign Thomas.

We probably won't really know who "won" this trade for quite a while.   The extreme possibilities on both ends are pretty far apart.

Best case for "winning the trade":   Irving develops into a player who can put up 2 or 3 All-NBA seasons like Isaiah just did, while Thomas ends up never able to recover, tragically ending his career too soon.  The Nets squeeze into the 8th seed of the playoffs.  Jae gets in a physical fight with a CLE fan and ends up in jail and Zizic decides to ask for a buyout and goes back to Europe.

Worst case for "losing the trade":  Irving just doesn't work out as a Celtic for whatever reason. Thomas recovers fully and posts a huge late-season push that helps the Cavs win the title.  Jae contributes steadily as a 6th man 3-and-D that helps give Lebron needed help on D.  Lebron agrees to stay on condition that Gilbert fork over the massive tax bill to sign IT4 long term, which he does.  Thomas goes on to produce at levels similar to what he's done the last couple of years, tapering off gracefully to the end of his next contract.  Zizic develops into a solid Steven Adams type big man.   The BKN18 pick turns into Bagley who turns into the next great transcendent star.  The 2020 pick turns into the next great 2nd round overlooked star.

Reality will obviously be somewhere in the middle.

[Roy H.]

With the news that IT is out to start the season, it is obvious that Celtics won the trade.  A 2nd rounder doesn't really make up for a missing IT.  Glad I waited until today to vote. 

Regular season wins don't mean a whole lot. If IT is still limited in the playoffs then I'd be more inclined to agree.

[guava_wrench]

I find voting on winners pointless. Cavs got what they needed and Celtics got what they needed.

[mmmmm]

I find voting on winners pointless. Cavs got what they needed and Celtics got what they needed.

A lot of times that can be true.

But in this particular case, the trade was directly between two teams that just did and are expected to compete head-to-head to get out of the East.

Unless the trade results in helping the Celtics get past the Cavaliers, then one could argue that they didn't "get what they needed".   

[Ilikesports17]

Pretty reliant on ITs hip.

If IT never returns to his previous self and misses a month or two in the process and Kyrie buys in, and Brooklyn pick isnt top 2, then I think Boston wins.

Brooklyn pick is unlikely to be top 2, Id say Kyrie is likely to buy in and ITs hip is the big mystery.

[droopdog7]

I mean, we should be okay with a tie right?  That's what trades are SUPPOSED to be.

[mctyson]

I said Cleveland, because I believe they have more degrees of freedom for victory.

Cleveland wins if:

1) The Cavs make the finals and either win or push GSW 6+games, aided by either IT or by a star player they acquire with any assets the Cs traded them

2) Lebron stays in Cleveland because IT resigns, or because the Cavs acquire a star player with any assets the Cs traded them

3) The Brooklyn pick lands in the top 3 (maybe even top 5) and the Cavs draft a multiple-time All Star

If any of #1-#3 happen, it is a win for the Cavs.  If they all happen or any combination happen together, it is massive win for the Cavs.'

Boston wins if:

1) They make the 17-18 NBA Finals, partially aided by Kyrie

2) They make an NBA Finals after the 17-18 season, partially aided by Kyrie AND Kyrie resigns

If either of those happen for Boston, I think it is a win.  They obviously cancel out Cleveland with #1 and #2 becomes a must if that does not happen.

Now of course there are scenarios where both teams can win their side of the trade, but I think that will be unlikely. 

[Phantom255x]

Cleveland Won This Trade.

But how the hell is Boston winning this poll 75% to 25%... 

It's funny because seems like the national media and most fanbases outside of CLE and BOS also feel Cleveland just robbed BOS. But that's mainly because of the BKN Pick they included and most assume that's a certain Top-3 pick. We'll have to see about that.

[CelticsElite]

That's because the media is overrating the pick and overrating IT. IT with a bad hip should be a much worse player. ITs game relies on athleticism. I expect a sharp decline in many numbers for it. Also. The pick at the end of the day is a gamble. Cleveland of all teams know this.... Remember their #1 pick Anthony Bennett? Neither do I. Kyrie is ours