What's going on in Cleveland?

[Moranis]

ESPN has a nice article confirming what I said earlier. Gilbert cheaped out. Initial offer to Billups was just 1.5 million which was up to still under 2 million as a final offer.  The market rate for a first timer in that position is 4 million.  Article also confirms that Griffin was making less than 2 million a year and that he left over money.  Gilbert just doesn't pay GM's which is why they always leave after the first contract.

[SHAQATTACK]

The end of the Cavs run. It's this year and that's it. LeBron is gone after the season.

This ^


I don't think they can win it .....Lebron has convinced himself , he needs more HELP ........so he plays the Beatles song HELP over and over and over ..... I think Lebron is looney now.

[Moranis]

The end of the Cavs run. It's this year and that's it. LeBron is gone after the season.

This ^


I don't think they can win it .....Lebron has convinced himself , he needs more HELP ........so he plays the Beatles song HELP over and over and over ..... I think Lebron is looney now.

let's say that is true where is he going that increases his chances of winning

[Neurotic Guy]

The end of the Cavs run. It's this year and that's it. LeBron is gone after the season.

This ^


I don't think they can win it .....Lebron has convinced himself , he needs more HELP ........so he plays the Beatles song HELP over and over and over ..... I think Lebron is looney now.

let's say that is true where is he going that increases his chances of winning

GSW

[Roy H.]

ESPN has a nice article confirming what I said earlier. Gilbert cheaped out. Initial offer to Billups was just 1.5 million which was up to still under 2 million as a final offer.  The market rate for a first timer in that position is 4 million.  Article also confirms that Griffin was making less than 2 million a year and that he left over money.  Gilbert just doesn't pay GM's which is why they always leave after the first contract.

You probably have some local perspective on this. How does Lebron come back, after Gilbert lied to him about spending? He's added at least several hundred million dollars to Gilbert's net worth.

Is being home and having an easy path to the Finals worth playing for a guy you hate, who promised to max your title chances before back-tracking?

[Roy H.]

The end of the Cavs run. It's this year and that's it. LeBron is gone after the season.

This ^


I don't think they can win it .....Lebron has convinced himself , he needs more HELP ........so he plays the Beatles song HELP over and over and over ..... I think Lebron is looney now.

let's say that is true where is he going that increases his chances of winning

I suppose he could try the Lakers. Who else has cap room next year?

San Antonio?

[jay]

Would the Knicks give Carmelo to Cleveland just to get rid of his contract? They could take back JR Smith and Channing Frye. Frye is in his last year. Smith is not a good contract, but he makes half of what Melo does.

Houston could offer a better package of Ariza (in his last year) and Eric Gordon, plus one minimum contract.

[jay]

The end of the Cavs run. It's this year and that's it. LeBron is gone after the season.

This ^


I don't think they can win it .....Lebron has convinced himself , he needs more HELP ........so he plays the Beatles song HELP over and over and over ..... I think Lebron is looney now.

let's say that is true where is he going that increases his chances of winning

I suppose he could try the Lakers. Who else has cap room next year?

San Antonio?

Yeah San Antonio is the one place he could go to really compete with GS.  LeBron and Kawhi would be monsters together and Green and Aldridge would be under contract for one more year.

[Ed Hollison]

At this point I would be surprised if he doesn't sign with the Lakers a year from now. Never mind surprised, I'd be shocked if he stayed in Cleveland.

[CelticSooner]

I'm loving Dan Gilbert. After his hate letter the guy just continues to show how volatile he is. LeBron walks next summer and Cleveland returns to the perennial lottery team they are destined to be.

[bdm860]

ESPN has a nice article confirming what I said earlier. Gilbert cheaped out. Initial offer to Billups was just 1.5 million which was up to still under 2 million as a final offer.  The market rate for a first timer in that position is 4 million.  Article also confirms that Griffin was making less than 2 million a year and that he left over money.  Gilbert just doesn't pay GM's which is why they always leave after the first contract.

I wonder about these GM contracts.

It's tough to gauge because they usually don't give out details or have a strict CBA to adhere to like the players.  So what do these contracts actually look like?

Like ESPN says Griffin made less than $2m, Money Inc. says it was $5.8m in 2016, and for everyone else in the Money Inc article they emphasized salary + bonuses/incentives.  I'd tend to trust ESPN here, but are they reporting base salary only and others are reporting on total comp?  Because, especially for Execs, those are 2 totally different things.

So back to Billups/Griffin.  Is it $1.5m base salary, with maybe something like a 500k bonus for finishing 1st in division, $750k bonus for finishing 1st in conference, $1m for making Finals, $2m for winning a championship?  With LeBron on your team, sure it's $1.5m base pay, but you're realistically looking at being division champs, a #1 seed, a Finals appearance, and a good chance of winning a championship, so is there an additional $2m-4m in achievable bonuses?

I could see a cheap owner like Gilbert (as well as others around the league) structuring contracts like that, especially if you're in a win now mode, "I'm not paying you to lose!"  And I can see how guys like Billups/Griffin know the LeBron money train might be reaching the end of the line (or how hard is it to win even with LeBron) and would push for more guaranteed money.

[hwangjini_1]

The end of the Cavs run. It's this year and that's it. LeBron is gone after the season.

This ^


I don't think they can win it .....Lebron has convinced himself , he needs more HELP ........so he plays the Beatles song HELP over and over and over ..... I think Lebron is looney now.

let's say that is true where is he going that increases his chances of winning

I suppose he could try the Lakers. Who else has cap room next year?

San Antonio?

if the point of lebron migrating to a new team is to win a championship, LA doesnt seem to make much sense. they dont have the talent or experience to win in the short term.

san antonio, if lebron is willing to play for less, makes a lot more sense.

or...the dark horse mentioned in another thread is boston. if lebron will sign for a pittance in order to win, the celtics roster is better than the cleveland roster by far.

[Moranis]

ESPN has a nice article confirming what I said earlier. Gilbert cheaped out. Initial offer to Billups was just 1.5 million which was up to still under 2 million as a final offer.  The market rate for a first timer in that position is 4 million.  Article also confirms that Griffin was making less than 2 million a year and that he left over money.  Gilbert just doesn't pay GM's which is why they always leave after the first contract.

You probably have some local perspective on this. How does Lebron come back, after Gilbert lied to him about spending? He's added at least several hundred million dollars to Gilbert's net worth.

Is being home and having an easy path to the Finals worth playing for a guy you hate, who promised to max your title chances before back-tracking?

A lot will depend on this season of course, but let's just assume they make the Finals and lose and there isn't much change to the roster.  I could still see Lebron coming back, if he looks around the league and doesn't see significantly increased chances of winning a title anywhere else.  And here's the thing, I don't think Lebron is going to play for the MLE.  He might take slightly less than max, but it is going to have to be near max to sign him because he has now been in two situations where ownership hasn't delivered because of money.  I just don't think he believes an owner will truly spend whatever it takes so why should he take a discount just to make an owner more money.

At the end of the day the only thing that really matters to Lebron is winning titles and if he doesn't think a new team will significantly increase his chances of winning titles, then he won't leave Cleveland. 

[SHAQATTACK]

Chaos

Panic

Cleveland about to be non relevant for another 40 years

[Moranis]

Chaos

Panic

Cleveland about to be non relevant for another 40 years

If James leaves, the Cavs will obviously trade off Love and Irving and I would expect a decent enough haul.  If they don't manage to mess up the draft, they might not be irrelevant for all that long, though obviously will be a very bad team intentionally for a little while.