Poll: Did Michael Jordan use steroids throughout his career?

[Smitty77]

And for the record there are plenty of stories on the net linking Jordan to steroids beginning around the time he met Tim Grover in the summer of 1989 at which time MJ bulked up significantly at the age of 27. If you believe he started using roids at that time it would also explain why he began distancing himself from teammates and started being far more prickly and even getting into fightsi.e. roid rage   and covering tracks (he also went bald). Remember this was before the internet and during a time when sports reporters didn't report on a lot of the off court stuff because they needed to keep relationships.

It also might explain why all of a sudden MJ retired out of the blue, some feel he was suspended for gambling but it easily could have been steroids and the league wanted to cover it up so let him "retire".  I don't have any idea if he was forced to retire or just needed a break but you could connect the dots if you felt he was using roids

At the end of the day I ave no idea if MJ was using just like I have no idea if James ever did, but neither was caught (or at least known to be caught) so I'd give both the benefit of the doubt.

Few things:

1. Jordan was always known to be an aggressive/distant guy and still is today, he has stopped talking to Charles Barkley because of negative comments on TNT about MJ's GM moves. Barkley has also said Jordan doesn't give to homeless or needy because he perceives them as lazy and weak.

2. Jordan was going bald as soon as he was in the league e.g. this is a photo from 1987

3. He 'suddenly' retired because he won 3 championships & lost his best friend and father in the most horrific way possible. As we all know MJ's dad wanted him to play baseball professionally and the only reason he returned to basketball is because of an MLB strike at the time, most believe if there wasn't a strike he never would have returned and would have gone on to the Majors.

Jordan didn't need steroids, he was always a freak athlete. At the time in the 1980's most players didn't even lift weights, Jordan (among the new crop of athletes globally) began to train and live 'professionally', Larry Bird for example would get drunk most weekends in the season.

Yes, indeed, you are SLIGHTLY BIASED.  You LOVE and worship MJ don't you??

Jordan was BANNED from the NBA for gambling, plain and simple!!

Read this with an open mind. 

https://books.google.com/books?id=4nQd6l2_lUYC&pg=PT449&lpg=PT449&dq=michael+jordan+and+gambling+%2B+sam+smith&source=bl&ots=PNdaBR039f&sig=TnCApoqUZwU9X-XjbXCi-eubEU8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjXr6XBpODTAhWIwiYKHb4LCqw4ChDoAQguMAI#v=onepage&q=michael%20jordan%20and%20gambling%20%2B%20sam%20smith&f=false

Then, research and READ (once again with an OPEN MIND) Sam Smith's writing about MJ's first "retirement!!!"

Then get back with me!!

Smitty77

[zubi.anaba]

It's possible, but I think it is far more probable that LeBron did steroids. 
They are widely different in muscle mass, and if you and I took them we would still not be at their level because both of them were freak athletes anyways.

Take a look at this :
http://www.livestrong.com/article/88372-effects-performance-enhancing-drugs/

I don't recall Jordan ever leaving as many games if any over cramps as LeBron has done.   Granted it circumstantial but in the modern era of hydration how does that happen?   Aren't these guys Gatorade poster boys?

Quick question how many games has Lebron left beause of cramps. Please list all the games? Game 1 vs SPurs in 2014 finals. Game 4 in 2012 Finals vs OKC. Season Opener in 2013 vs the Cs?SO even if we give some random game here and there SO what thats like at best 4-5 games out of a 1000s of games in his career and you think that somehow has statistical significance to him doing PEDs??? Perhaps Math is not your strong point

You can find a few articles about this but you can literally find dozens upon dozens about LeBron.

Yeah because Lebron played in the 24/7 social media and internet age. MJ did not.Neither did any of the players in 80s/90s. Not hard to decipher really.

I think Moranis tried to change the narrative in the other thread,

More like he showed how a bunch of half truths and circumstantial nonsense, mixed with blantant bias and envy can easily be morphed into "That player must be doing PEDs"

one has a tiny rumor and it could be true, the other a raging forest fire and people testifying that LJ was a client.  Big difference, but both could be false or both could be true.

Really??Perphaps you could all share with us these raging forest fire of people who have testified about Lebrons PEDs. The whole story about the biogensis clinic originated from a dude called Incarcerated BOB. Name sure does scream credibility now doesnt it

[Smitty77]

And for the record there are plenty of stories on the net linking Jordan to steroids beginning around the time he met Tim Grover in the summer of 1989 at which time MJ bulked up significantly at the age of 27. If you believe he started using roids at that time it would also explain why he began distancing himself from teammates and started being far more prickly and even getting into fightsi.e. roid rage   and covering tracks (he also went bald). Remember this was before the internet and during a time when sports reporters didn't report on a lot of the off court stuff because they needed to keep relationships.

It also might explain why all of a sudden MJ retired out of the blue, some feel he was suspended for gambling but it easily could have been steroids and the league wanted to cover it up so let him "retire".  I don't have any idea if he was forced to retire or just needed a break but you could connect the dots if you felt he was using roids

At the end of the day I ave no idea if MJ was using just like I have no idea if James ever did, but neither was caught (or at least known to be caught) so I'd give both the benefit of the doubt.

Few things:

1. Jordan was always known to be an aggressive/distant guy and still is today, he has stopped talking to Charles Barkley because of negative comments on TNT about MJ's GM moves. Barkley has also said Jordan doesn't give to homeless or needy because he perceives them as lazy and weak.

2. Jordan was going bald as soon as he was in the league e.g. this is a photo from 1987

3. He 'suddenly' retired because he won 3 championships & lost his best friend and father in the most horrific way possible. As we all know MJ's dad wanted him to play baseball professionally and the only reason he returned to basketball is because of an MLB strike at the time, most believe if there wasn't a strike he never would have returned and would have gone on to the Majors.

Jordan didn't need steroids, he was always a freak athlete. At the time in the 1980's most players didn't even lift weights, Jordan (among the new crop of athletes globally) began to train and live 'professionally', Larry Bird for example would get drunk most weekends in the season.

Then read this, again with as OPEN a MIND as you can!!!!

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/131997-mjs-1st-retirement-was-it-a-secret-suspension

Smitty77

[Roy H.]

... people testifying that LJ was a client.

I missed this. Who linked Lebron to PEDs / a steroid clinic?

Would it matter to that many people?

I enjoy baseball and football, and acknowledge that many guys have taken various chemicals to gain an advantage.

At the same time, I have no idea who actually used and didn't use. It seems a little like a witch hunt to ID guys and try to kill their reputations, esp. when we can't say with certainty at the end that we actually know.

"Would it matter?" is an interesting question.

Nobody cares in football. In baseball, nobody likes a guy connected to PEDs, unless he's a "good guy" (Andy Pettite) or a local hero (Papi). 

If MJ was connected to steroids, I think it would be rushed off. If it was Lebron? I think he'd be beloved in Cleveland and hated almost everywhere else.

[green_bballers13]

As far as I remember, the rumors of MJ's gambling led him to take a break from basketball. It would have been devastating for the face of the league to go down in flames.

[Moranis]

Jordan 1986

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=michael%20jordan%201986%20photo&view=detailv2&id=A17DEE0ABFC10CCED9ACDF8C678AFB574E42CB43&first=1&FORM=IQFRBA

Jordan 1987
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=michael%20jordan%201987%20photo&view=detailv2&id=4D0936F71B90211237A75DD0161B34D47FEB975E&first=0&FORM=IQFRBA

Now lets look at MJ from the 90's

Jordan 1990
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=bnCL6vwd&id=811C8034077AF4D32B0DA327C01A7CB78FAE89BE&thid=OIP.bnCL6vwdMXX-k7ZhgaAGDADhEU&q=michael+jordan+1990+photo&simid=608041540919168262&selectedIndex=8&PC=U316&ajaxhist=0

Jordan 92
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=YiGS7Gt8&id=08B197DBED3883F98F922604C92765B499A9D568&thid=OIP.YiGS7Gt8jJPazFNJLdAqCADgEs&q=michael+jordan+photo+1992&simid=608014744606215751&selectedIndex=3

[slightly biased bias fan]

And for the record there are plenty of stories on the net linking Jordan to steroids beginning around the time he met Tim Grover in the summer of 1989 at which time MJ bulked up significantly at the age of 27. If you believe he started using roids at that time it would also explain why he began distancing himself from teammates and started being far more prickly and even getting into fightsi.e. roid rage   and covering tracks (he also went bald). Remember this was before the internet and during a time when sports reporters didn't report on a lot of the off court stuff because they needed to keep relationships.

It also might explain why all of a sudden MJ retired out of the blue, some feel he was suspended for gambling but it easily could have been steroids and the league wanted to cover it up so let him "retire".  I don't have any idea if he was forced to retire or just needed a break but you could connect the dots if you felt he was using roids

At the end of the day I ave no idea if MJ was using just like I have no idea if James ever did, but neither was caught (or at least known to be caught) so I'd give both the benefit of the doubt.

Few things:

1. Jordan was always known to be an aggressive/distant guy and still is today, he has stopped talking to Charles Barkley because of negative comments on TNT about MJ's GM moves. Barkley has also said Jordan doesn't give to homeless or needy because he perceives them as lazy and weak.

2. Jordan was going bald as soon as he was in the league e.g. this is a photo from 1987

3. He 'suddenly' retired because he won 3 championships & lost his best friend and father in the most horrific way possible. As we all know MJ's dad wanted him to play baseball professionally and the only reason he returned to basketball is because of an MLB strike at the time, most believe if there wasn't a strike he never would have returned and would have gone on to the Majors.

Jordan didn't need steroids, he was always a freak athlete. At the time in the 1980's most players didn't even lift weights, Jordan (among the new crop of athletes globally) began to train and live 'professionally', Larry Bird for example would get drunk most weekends in the season.

Yes, indeed, you are SLIGHTLY BIASED.  You LOVE and worship MJ don't you??

Jordan was BANNED from the NBA for gambling, plain and simple!!

Read this with an open mind. 

https://books.google.com/books?id=4nQd6l2_lUYC&pg=PT449&lpg=PT449&dq=michael+jordan+and+gambling+%2B+sam+smith&source=bl&ots=PNdaBR039f&sig=TnCApoqUZwU9X-XjbXCi-eubEU8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjXr6XBpODTAhWIwiYKHb4LCqw4ChDoAQguMAI#v=onepage&q=michael%20jordan%20and%20gambling%20%2B%20sam%20smith&f=false

Then, research and READ (once again with an OPEN MIND) Sam Smith's writing about MJ's first "retirement!!!"

Then get back with me!!

Smitty77

No need to get aggressive Smitty,

I don't actually like Jordan the person much at all but I'm sorry but I do know reliable sources and there aren't any to this narrative.

There has never been evidence or even the slightest accusation that Jordan bet on his own games, or even bet on basketball or any other sporting event, other than his own golf matches.His nights at the casino? They’re epic and many, but if the NBA had suspended Jordan for that, it would have had to get rid of just about all of its players. The NBA has been a gambling league since way back in the days when teams rode on trains to get to their games. MJ and an array of modern players have only carried on a long tradition of playing cards, betting on golf rounds, hitting the tables at casinos. When Jordan came back to basketball in 1995, there wasn’t the slightest iota of sensitivity about his gambling. The Bulls even scheduled a preseason game in Vegas in 1996, so that Jordan and his teammates, including mega gambler Dennis Rodman, could all have plenty of time to hit the tables. If MJ had been suspended, there’s no way the Bulls and the NBA would have been so casual about his gambling. All of that is allowed. What is forbidden is betting on basketball games in any fashion.

“I don’t know that there ever really was a gambling issue,” former Chicago Bulls executive and longtime Jordan nemesis Jerry Krause said in an interview. The infamous “Crumbs” had never hesitated to pounce on any opportunity to criticize Jordan, if it was legitimate. There was nothing to the gambling, he said again and again in interviews in 2011 and 2012.

[tankcity!]

Jordan 1986

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=michael%20jordan%201986%20photo&view=detailv2&id=A17DEE0ABFC10CCED9ACDF8C678AFB574E42CB43&first=1&FORM=IQFRBA

Jordan 1987
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=michael%20jordan%201987%20photo&view=detailv2&id=4D0936F71B90211237A75DD0161B34D47FEB975E&first=0&FORM=IQFRBA

Now lets look at MJ from the 90's

Jordan 1990
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=bnCL6vwd&id=811C8034077AF4D32B0DA327C01A7CB78FAE89BE&thid=OIP.bnCL6vwdMXX-k7ZhgaAGDADhEU&q=michael+jordan+1990+photo&simid=608041540919168262&selectedIndex=8&PC=U316&ajaxhist=0

Jordan 92
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=YiGS7Gt8&id=08B197DBED3883F98F922604C92765B499A9D568&thid=OIP.YiGS7Gt8jJPazFNJLdAqCADgEs&q=michael+jordan+photo+1992&simid=608014744606215751&selectedIndex=3

Looks like he just started lifting to me...Lol this is a sad topic.

[green_bballers13]

And for the record there are plenty of stories on the net linking Jordan to steroids beginning around the time he met Tim Grover in the summer of 1989 at which time MJ bulked up significantly at the age of 27. If you believe he started using roids at that time it would also explain why he began distancing himself from teammates and started being far more prickly and even getting into fightsi.e. roid rage   and covering tracks (he also went bald). Remember this was before the internet and during a time when sports reporters didn't report on a lot of the off court stuff because they needed to keep relationships.

It also might explain why all of a sudden MJ retired out of the blue, some feel he was suspended for gambling but it easily could have been steroids and the league wanted to cover it up so let him "retire".  I don't have any idea if he was forced to retire or just needed a break but you could connect the dots if you felt he was using roids

At the end of the day I ave no idea if MJ was using just like I have no idea if James ever did, but neither was caught (or at least known to be caught) so I'd give both the benefit of the doubt.

Few things:

1. Jordan was always known to be an aggressive/distant guy and still is today, he has stopped talking to Charles Barkley because of negative comments on TNT about MJ's GM moves. Barkley has also said Jordan doesn't give to homeless or needy because he perceives them as lazy and weak.

2. Jordan was going bald as soon as he was in the league e.g. this is a photo from 1987

3. He 'suddenly' retired because he won 3 championships & lost his best friend and father in the most horrific way possible. As we all know MJ's dad wanted him to play baseball professionally and the only reason he returned to basketball is because of an MLB strike at the time, most believe if there wasn't a strike he never would have returned and would have gone on to the Majors.

Jordan didn't need steroids, he was always a freak athlete. At the time in the 1980's most players didn't even lift weights, Jordan (among the new crop of athletes globally) began to train and live 'professionally', Larry Bird for example would get drunk most weekends in the season.

Yes, indeed, you are SLIGHTLY BIASED.  You LOVE and worship MJ don't you??

Jordan was BANNED from the NBA for gambling, plain and simple!!

Read this with an open mind. 

https://books.google.com/books?id=4nQd6l2_lUYC&pg=PT449&lpg=PT449&dq=michael+jordan+and+gambling+%2B+sam+smith&source=bl&ots=PNdaBR039f&sig=TnCApoqUZwU9X-XjbXCi-eubEU8&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjXr6XBpODTAhWIwiYKHb4LCqw4ChDoAQguMAI#v=onepage&q=michael%20jordan%20and%20gambling%20%2B%20sam%20smith&f=false

Then, research and READ (once again with an OPEN MIND) Sam Smith's writing about MJ's first "retirement!!!"

Then get back with me!!

Smitty77

No need to get aggressive Smitty,

I don't actually like Jordan the person much at all but I'm sorry but I do know reliable sources and there aren't any to this narrative.

There has never been evidence or even the slightest accusation that Jordan bet on his own games, or even bet on basketball or any other sporting event, other than his own golf matches.His nights at the casino? They’re epic and many, but if the NBA had suspended Jordan for that, it would have had to get rid of just about all of its players. The NBA has been a gambling league since way back in the days when teams rode on trains to get to their games. MJ and an array of modern players have only carried on a long tradition of playing cards, betting on golf rounds, hitting the tables at casinos. When Jordan came back to basketball in 1995, there wasn’t the slightest iota of sensitivity about his gambling. The Bulls even scheduled a preseason game in Vegas in 1996, so that Jordan and his teammates, including mega gambler Dennis Rodman, could all have plenty of time to hit the tables. If MJ had been suspended, there’s no way the Bulls and the NBA would have been so casual about his gambling. All of that is allowed. What is forbidden is betting on basketball games in any fashion.

“I don’t know that there ever really was a gambling issue,” former Chicago Bulls executive and longtime Jordan nemesis Jerry Krause said in an interview. The infamous “Crumbs” had never hesitated to pounce on any opportunity to criticize Jordan, if it was legitimate. There was nothing to the gambling, he said again and again in interviews in 2011 and 2012.

No one cares about what Geno Smith does with his footballs.... When the best player in the game's integrity is questioned, the media starts paying attention.

[Moranis]

Jordan 1986

https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=michael%20jordan%201986%20photo&view=detailv2&id=A17DEE0ABFC10CCED9ACDF8C678AFB574E42CB43&first=1&FORM=IQFRBA

Jordan 1987
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=michael%20jordan%201987%20photo&view=detailv2&id=4D0936F71B90211237A75DD0161B34D47FEB975E&first=0&FORM=IQFRBA

Now lets look at MJ from the 90's

Jordan 1990
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=bnCL6vwd&id=811C8034077AF4D32B0DA327C01A7CB78FAE89BE&thid=OIP.bnCL6vwdMXX-k7ZhgaAGDADhEU&q=michael+jordan+1990+photo&simid=608041540919168262&selectedIndex=8&PC=U316&ajaxhist=0

Jordan 92
https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=YiGS7Gt8&id=08B197DBED3883F98F922604C92765B499A9D568&thid=OIP.YiGS7Gt8jJPazFNJLdAqCADgEs&q=michael+jordan+photo+1992&simid=608014744606215751&selectedIndex=3

Looks like he just started lifting to me...Lol this is a sad topic.

sure maybe that is it or maybe he started lifting with some chemical help.

Tim Grover is a well respected trainer that has been around a long time with Kobe and Wade among his clients (along with MJ).  Maybe he really did just put MJ on a perfectly legal training regime or maybe he just used the methods of the day.

Also of coincidence, the Barons at the time MJ was there had something like 5 people specifically named in the Mitchell Report and there are some vague quotes from one of those players that some people think are references to MJ.

Obviously any of these supposed steroids links are 20 plus years old from a time before the mass proliferation of the internet so they are always going to be weak links at best.

[manl_lui]

And for the record there are plenty of stories on the net linking Jordan to steroids beginning around the time he met Tim Grover in the summer of 1989 at which time MJ bulked up significantly at the age of 27. If you believe he started using roids at that time it would also explain why he began distancing himself from teammates and started being far more prickly and even getting into fightsi.e. roid rage   and covering tracks (he also went bald). Remember this was before the internet and during a time when sports reporters didn't report on a lot of the off court stuff because they needed to keep relationships.

It also might explain why all of a sudden MJ retired out of the blue, some feel he was suspended for gambling but it easily could have been steroids and the league wanted to cover it up so let him "retire".  I don't have any idea if he was forced to retire or just needed a break but you could connect the dots if you felt he was using roids

At the end of the day I ave no idea if MJ was using just like I have no idea if James ever did, but neither was caught (or at least known to be caught) so I'd give both the benefit of the doubt.

Few things:

1. Jordan was always known to be an aggressive/distant guy and still is today, he has stopped talking to Charles Barkley because of negative comments on TNT about MJ's GM moves. Barkley has also said Jordan doesn't give to homeless or needy because he perceives them as lazy and weak.

2. Jordan was going bald as soon as he was in the league e.g. this is a photo from 1987

3. He 'suddenly' retired because he won 3 championships & lost his best friend and father in the most horrific way possible. As we all know MJ's dad wanted him to play baseball professionally and the only reason he returned to basketball is because of an MLB strike at the time, most believe if there wasn't a strike he never would have returned and would have gone on to the Majors.

Jordan didn't need steroids, he was always a freak athlete. At the time in the 1980's most players didn't even lift weights, Jordan (among the new crop of athletes globally) began to train and live 'professionally', Larry Bird for example would get drunk most weekends in the season.

ROFL

actually not all that surprising to me, if you watched the dream team documentary i think there was a part where they all hit the beach or just hanging out, and Barkley was complaining that Bird loves them Budweisers and he couldn't keep up  ,

but yea back to the discussion, I do agree that, sports science has greatly evolved and grew since the late 80s to early 90s. Not that it wasn't a thing before then but I personally think (if someone can confirm), the NBA started investing more into personal trainers and team doctors a lot more.

[Eja117]

I hate accusations like 20 years after the fact without evidence and no real way for the accused to disprove it or defend himself.

[Donoghus]

No.

I just think its deflection from the Lebron apologists away from the argument that Lebron has been using.  You know, point the finger at someone else.  Jordan is the most natural competition for Lebron historically at this point.   

(I'm not sold LBJ has done anything either.  Just one of those "freak of nature things.)

[zubi.anaba]

I hate accusations like 20 years after the fact without evidence and no real way for the accused to disprove it or defend himself.

Hey quick question. You just wrote this earlier

There isn't enough evidence for me.
If the NBA had testing he would have passed it. If minor league baseball had testing he would have passed that. He would have passed the testing at the Olympic games in 1984 and 1992.  There was also the 1992 FIBA games and 1983 Pan Am games and there should have been college.

SO just to be clear MJ passed Olympic tests so you give him the benefit of the doubt right. SO question is would this not also apply to Lebron??

Lebron Played FIBA games in 2006. He then played Olympic games in 2004,2008 and 2012. He clearly passed all the tests required to participate in those games (like MJ did). SHouldnt that too give Lebron the benefit of the doubt?? Or does it not apply because its Lebron

[Roy H.]

No.

I just think its deflection from the Lebron apologists away from the argument that Lebron has been using.  You know, point the finger at someone else.  Jordan is the most natural competition for Lebron historically at this point.   

(I'm not sold LBJ has done anything either.  Just one of those "freak of nature things.)

If the argument is that Jordan likely used, I agree it's unfair.

If the point was "you can do the same sort of speculating regarding Jordan that critics do with Lebron" to point out the unreliability of PEDs speculation, I'm more sympathetic.

Frankly, I think that steroids for healing purposes should be legal in professional sports. The seasons are so grueling that I'm not going to vilify these guys. I've definitely evolved on this issue, but ultimately I wonder what the real harm is.