Is Jaylen Brown Untouchable?

[droopdog7]

This thread is a result of the mentality that good players, or potentially good players, shouldn't be traded.  Said it a million times but fans only want to trade players they don't like.  "That guy stinks, trade him!".

Of course brown is not untradeable.

[saltlover]

He's not untouchable.  There are only a few players even possibly available at the trade deadline who he would be worth trading for, however.

In my mind, in order of least wanting to trade to most willing to trade (in terms of prospects and picks only) it goes:

2017 Brooklyn
Brown
2018 Brooklyn
Zizic
Yab
2019 Memphis
2018 Celtics
Rozier
2019 Celtics
2019 Clippers
Jackson
Nader
2017 Minny 2nd rounder
All other second rounders

(Note: I consider neither Smart nor Olynyk prospects at this point -- they're young NBA rotation/starter type players. They'll both likely get better, but their value also includes current usefulness in addition to projection.  Young and Mickey are just flotsam.)

[CoachBo]

18 Brooklyn in theory would be more valuable to me than Brown.

But then, God knows what Ainge will do with it.

[jmen788]

Let's be honest here, fans get too attached to our own players.

If the C's had drafted Bender, or Dunn, or Murray, or Chriss at #3, many C's fans would think they're untouchable instead.  I think most probably wouldn't even trade whoever the C's took at #3 for Ingram at this point.  Had the C's drafted one of them though, I think the overwhelming consensus here would be there's no way the C's should trade whoever they drafted at #3 for Jaylen Brown because the player the C's drafted has star potential!

There's definitely some impartial people out there who think Brown would have gone #8 or #9 if the C's didn't draft him (see here and here).  Had the C's gotten Brown at #8 or #9 instead, suddenly I think some people around here wouldn't think Brown had the same potential.  I wouldn't trade a guy drafted #3 for Butler, but a guy drafted at #9 doesn't have the same potential, so ya I might consider trading him for Butler.

If the C's had Jimmy Butler, I doubt most here would trade him for Brown (well except for the few who always seem to want the C's to tank).

It's similar to Marcus Smart.  Many of the fans wouldn't trade Smart for Aaron Gordon or Julius Randle either.  But had the C's drafted one of them instead and now asked if we should trade one of them for Smart, again most people here would say no way.

It shouldn't matter what # the guy was drafted at or by whom, you want to get the best player.  Very few NBA players no matter where they're drafted turn out as good as Jimmy Butler.  I would definitely trade Brown for Butler.  I don't want to wait and see how Brown develops just because the C's drafted him or he was taken #3, I just want the best player (both now and in the future).

And don't forget for every Joe Johnson for Rodney Rogers or Billups for Kenny Anderson trade, there's a Jeff Green for Ray Allen, a Crowder for Rondo, and a Jefferson/Telfair/Green for Garnett trade.

I said nothing of the sort - that it's because he was drafted 3rd. I'm talking about skills and what he has shown thus far. I wouldn't hesitate to trade Marcus Smart for the right return, but not Brown, not yet anyways. Have you or other short-sighted fans already forgotten about Joe Johnson for a half year of Rodney Rogers and Delk? Or Billups for who even remembers at this point? It's too early to trade him, especially as a spare part in bunk trades including other assets like the Brooklyn pick(s) for players like Jimmy Butler.

Moreover, I also mentioned that I don't think any player is untouchable, but that people are way too liberal in wanting to find excuses to trade him like you just did.

[TheSlipperyWhistle]

Let's be honest here, fans get too attached to our own players.

If the C's had drafted Bender, or Dunn, or Murray, or Chriss at #3, many C's fans would think they're untouchable instead.  I think most probably wouldn't even trade whoever the C's took at #3 for Ingram at this point.  Had the C's drafted one of them though, I think the overwhelming consensus here would be there's no way the C's should trade whoever they drafted at #3 for Jaylen Brown because the player the C's drafted has star potential!

There's definitely some impartial people out there who think Brown would have gone #8 or #9 if the C's didn't draft him (see here and here).  Had the C's gotten Brown at #8 or #9 instead, suddenly I think some people around here wouldn't think Brown had the same potential.  I wouldn't trade a guy drafted #3 for Butler, but a guy drafted at #9 doesn't have the same potential, so ya I might consider trading him for Butler.

If the C's had Jimmy Butler, I doubt most here would trade him for Brown (well except for the few who always seem to want the C's to tank).

It's similar to Marcus Smart.  Many of the fans wouldn't trade Smart for Aaron Gordon or Julius Randle either.  But had the C's drafted one of them instead and now asked if we should trade one of them for Smart, again most people here would say no way.

It shouldn't matter what # the guy was drafted at or by whom, you want to get the best player.  Very few NBA players no matter where they're drafted turn out as good as Jimmy Butler.  I would definitely trade Brown for Butler.  I don't want to wait and see how Brown develops just because the C's drafted him or he was taken #3, I just want the best player (both now and in the future).

And don't forget for every Joe Johnson for Rodney Rogers or Billups for Kenny Anderson trade, there's a Jeff Green for Ray Allen, a Crowder for Rondo, and a Jefferson/Telfair/Green for Garnett trade.

I agree with you that to some extent we are all homers. We wouldn't take enough time to post on this site if we were not. I don't want to trade Brown for Jimmy Butler. Here's a quick glance into why:

1. We already have really good swings, Jae Crowder, and Avery Bradley (though I will admit they are not the level of Jimmy Butler, they are not far off).
2. We would have to give up some serious assets to do so, BKL picks, and probably assets like Smart or Brown. What kind of upgrade is Butler over Crowder? I mean, clearly an upgrade, but beat the Cavs in 7 games upgrade? If not, why sacrifice the future?

I followed the draft and prospects very closely, and I will agree with you that the pundits had Brown going anywhere from 3-9.  They also had Hillary winning the election. Point is, talk is cheap. Malcolm Brogdan who was not even on the radar until the combine is on top of the rookie ladder (leaving Embiid out here for obvious reasons). We are trying to have our cake and eat it too, try to win now, and have a bunch of great young prospects to give us longevity. Not an easy task. I would trade Brown for a difference making upgrade at a position of need (Cousins).

[chiken Green]

I have always been of the belief that you draft and build superstars and then add great pieces around them.. To me Brown is a guy that CBS can mold into a champion ala K. Leonard and Pop...

 I think it would be a huge mistake to trade this kid for most of whats out there right now..  (Cousins locker room antics, on the court melt downs and now this off the court stuff with the fight stuff with Matt Barnes is troubling)

And This Jimmy Butler talk is funny to me.. In Butlers first 2 years nobody would have said he would be a person who would warrant this kind of trade..  Brown 2 years younger (on a much better team) Will end up having a better rookie year than Butler did.. and I would be willing to bet the farm that Browns second year will be better than Butlers second year...  Browns floor in my opinion is Jimmy B.. Butler is nowhere near the Athlete that Brown is..

IF CBS can turn damaged nba players into Real players, what could he do with this uber talented, raw, untouched specimen? The Growth that this kid has shown from summer league to now is crazy incredible.  Imagine another year or 2 in this system under the coach that we all drool over.

Brown is not untouchable - but he should be.. and if he is moved I feel we will regret it.

[vgulab]

Sign Noel, draft Fultz.

I will be very happy with that kind of summer.

[pearljammer10]

I wouldn't say untouchable but whatever package we can make for a star without Brown involved would be my preference. I don't want to trade him and have another Billups situation.

[footey]

My fervent hope is that we land Lonzo Ball with the Nets' pick.  He will turn Brown into a 20 ppg scorer very quickly.  So many times Brown is ignored by the other players, less so than the beginning of the season, but still.  That will not happen with Ball in charge of the offense. We would become a running team, and Brown would absolutely thrive in that style of play.

Sorry if this seems off topic, but my point is that Brown has tremendous potential if aligned with the right team-mates.  I love IT, but he can't distribute and run a team the way that Ball can. I want to keep IT, but figure out a way that he can be used without compromising our team style of play.  He had come a long way but let's face the fact that come the 4th quarter, we pretty much turn the ball over to him and watch him do his thing.  I don't think that is a long term solution if we are to battle for our next ring.

[Ilikesports17]

My fervent hope is that we land Lonzo Ball with the Nets' pick.  He will turn Brown into a 20 ppg scorer very quickly.  So many times Brown is ignored by the other players, less so than the beginning of the season, but still.  That will not happen with Ball in charge of the offense. We would become a running team, and Brown would absolutely thrive in that style of play.

Sorry if this seems off topic, but my point is that Brown has tremendous potential if aligned with the right team-mates.  I love IT, but he can't distribute and run a team the way that Ball can. I want to keep IT, but figure out a way that he can be used without compromising our team style of play.  He had come a long way but let's face the fact that come the 4th quarter, we pretty much turn the ball over to him and watch him do his thing.  I don't think that is a long term solution if we are to battle for our next ring.

If we draft Ball it will be at least a year before he is "in charge of the offense"by that time Jaylen shouldn't have this problem anymore.

[footey]

He's not untouchable.  There are only a few players even possibly available at the trade deadline who he would be worth trading for, however.

In my mind, in order of least wanting to trade to most willing to trade (in terms of prospects and picks only) it goes:

2017 Brooklyn
Brown
2018 Brooklyn
Zizic
Yab
2019 Memphis
2018 Celtics
Rozier
2019 Celtics
2019 Clippers
Jackson
Nader
2017 Minny 2nd rounder
All other second rounders

(Note: I consider neither Smart nor Olynyk prospects at this point -- they're young NBA rotation/starter type players. They'll both likely get better, but their value also includes current usefulness in addition to projection.  Young and Mickey are just flotsam.)

I'd flip Nader over Jackson, and, maybe, Nets 2018 ahead of Jaylen (only because of the propensity of bigs projected to come out of that draft and the likely continued futility of the Nets for the foreseeable future). Otherwise, spot on ranking.

[saltlover]

He's not untouchable.  There are only a few players even possibly available at the trade deadline who he would be worth trading for, however.

In my mind, in order of least wanting to trade to most willing to trade (in terms of prospects and picks only) it goes:

2017 Brooklyn
Brown
2018 Brooklyn
Zizic
Yab
2019 Memphis
2018 Celtics
Rozier
2019 Celtics
2019 Clippers
Jackson
Nader
2017 Minny 2nd rounder
All other second rounders

(Note: I consider neither Smart nor Olynyk prospects at this point -- they're young NBA rotation/starter type players. They'll both likely get better, but their value also includes current usefulness in addition to projection.  Young and Mickey are just flotsam.)

I'd flip Nader over Jackson, and, maybe, Nets 2018 ahead of Jaylen (only because of the propensity of bigs projected to come out of that draft and the likely continued futility of the Nets for the foreseeable future). Otherwise, spot on ranking.

The principle reason I put Jaylen over the final Brooklyn pick is that if you're trading for a star, you're moving into win-now mode.  In that situation, Jaylen Brown will be more useful than the 2018 Brooklyn pick this year and next year by definition, and it's very unlikely that a rookie like Ayton will be as useful as Brown in his third year in 2018.  Combine that with ping-pong ball risk (significant) and Nets improvement risk (less likely but not impossible -- if they finish third-worst next year that decreases the chances that franchise Big will be available) and thus Brown becomes more untradable than the Brooklyn pick.

Once it gets down to Jackson/Nader level it doesn't really matter all that much.  I don't anticipate Ainge nixing a deal he's remotely interested in making because a team wants one of those two and not the other.  If roster spots and salary matching are not factors in the deal, I'd prefer Jackson because he's on the roster already, and thus can be an emergency option should we have multiple injuries to PG in March, and/or we want to rest the rotation a bit in April.  But again, I'm sure neither is a deal-breaker for any trade of significance.

[TheTruthFot18]

He's not untouchable.  There are only a few players even possibly available at the trade deadline who he would be worth trading for, however.

In my mind, in order of least wanting to trade to most willing to trade (in terms of prospects and picks only) it goes:

2017 Brooklyn
Brown
2018 Brooklyn
Zizic
Yab
2019 Memphis
2018 Celtics
Rozier
2019 Celtics
2019 Clippers
Jackson
Nader
2017 Minny 2nd rounder
All other second rounders

(Note: I consider neither Smart nor Olynyk prospects at this point -- they're young NBA rotation/starter type players. They'll both likely get better, but their value also includes current usefulness in addition to projection.  Young and Mickey are just flotsam.)

Anyone else think that Clippers pick in 2019 is a major wild card? Is it protected?

Clippers only have Jordan, Rivers, and Brice Johnson signed through 2019 (first two have player options). What if CP3 decided LA hasn't worked out and he heads somewhere else? What if Blake signs a big deal elsewhere to start over? If those both happen they will look like the 2016-17 Heat. Even if one leave and they can't adequately replace them that pick could drop.

[saltlover]

He's not untouchable.  There are only a few players even possibly available at the trade deadline who he would be worth trading for, however.

In my mind, in order of least wanting to trade to most willing to trade (in terms of prospects and picks only) it goes:

2017 Brooklyn
Brown
2018 Brooklyn
Zizic
Yab
2019 Memphis
2018 Celtics
Rozier
2019 Celtics
2019 Clippers
Jackson
Nader
2017 Minny 2nd rounder
All other second rounders

(Note: I consider neither Smart nor Olynyk prospects at this point -- they're young NBA rotation/starter type players. They'll both likely get better, but their value also includes current usefulness in addition to projection.  Young and Mickey are just flotsam.)

Anyone else think that Clippers pick in 2019 is a major wild card? Is it protected?

Clippers only have Jordan, Rivers, and Brice Johnson signed through 2019 (first two have player options). What if CP3 decided LA hasn't worked out and he heads somewhere else? What if Blake signs a big deal elsewhere to start over? If those both happen they will look like the 2016-17 Heat. Even if one leave and they can't adequately replace them that pick could drop.

The Clippers pick is lottery protected in 2019 and 2020.  If we don't get a 1st by 2020, we instead get a single 2nd round pick in 2020.  That's why it's rated a bit lower.  If they take a dive for a couple years, we could get only a 2nd.  The upside is a mid-1st.

[PhoSita]

No, but if the Celts trade him, the player they get back should offer similar potential to help the team win games over an extended period of time.

I'm not sure how good Jaylen will be, but the upside he offers is too good to give up for less than a star caliber player.