Problem: Lottery picks for #3 seed Celtics

[Donoghus]

They're doing both.

They still have time before you have to start worrying about the treadmill.

[green_bballers13]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Why do they need to make a decision in the next two years? They own BKN's next two picks.

Do you recommend that they trade Horford and IT for late 1st rounders?

Don't they need to spend even a little bit of money? I think IT and Horford are perfectly acceptable as place holders. Given the monumental challenge of becoming an NBA champion in this current league, I think Danny is doing pretty well.

[BitterJim]

The Net's picks we are getting along with our competitive team presents a peculiar problem for this team. Are we in win mode now (which means we do not have playing time for Rookies) or are we building for the future (which requires heavy playing time for our rookies). It is really a perplexing and complex issue for the front office and coaching staff.

So Bloggers, the multiple Nets' picks, blessing? Yes. But does it not create a conundrum for the front office on a strategy going forward? Win now versus Build for future.

this is a false assumption.  good teams with high picks have the luxury of bringing players along at a slower pace and not requiring them to produce immediately.  the idea is that it leads to better development of the player to fit with the team's structure.  I fail to see how adding top prospects to a  good team could possibly be a bad thing

only a false assumption if you do not want to answer the question. The question is .... are we building for future or win now team. We may be a good team, but we are not a championship team. Case in point. SA Spurs, their last championship team had the luxury of bringing along players like Leonard and Mills because they had established stars like Duncan Ginobilli and Parker. We are neither here or there, and that is my point. We are somewhere in the middle, and very soon we need to chart a course.

The answer is both, and neither.  Danny still has all of his options open.  Does a star/superstar become available, giving us the opportunity to compete for a championship for the next few years?  Boom, cap space/trade assets, he can make a move and compete now.  Injury to IT or Horford, or just a chance to trade them for a high lottery pick?  Boom, build a long term contender around our young guys, Nets picks, and whatever assets you get from trades.  Danny's staying flexible, and the contracts that AB, Crowder, and IT have will allow him to stay flexible through this summer as well. 

Danny's been able to stay flexible and wait for the right opportunities to crop up since the Nets trade.  I trust that he'll do what he thinks is best, but also change direction if the right deal comes along (like he did with trading Pierce and KG to the Nets).  People need to just have some faith and stop stressing about things that 1. you can't control and 2. aren't even issues

[LarBrd33]

The Net's picks we are getting along with our competitive team presents a peculiar problem for this team. Are we in win mode now (which means we do not have playing time for Rookies) or are we building for the future (which requires heavy playing time for our rookies). It is really a perplexing and complex issue for the front office and coaching staff.

So Bloggers, the multiple Nets' picks, blessing? Yes. But does it not create a conundrum for the front office on a strategy going forward? Win now versus Build for future.

False premise based on the idea that our young guys don't get minutes, because the team is too good.  They don't get minutes, because they aren't good enough to get minutes.

Presumably the player we get with the 2017 Brooklyn pick will be good enough to get major minutes right away.   Marcus Smart was good enough for minutes right away.  Jaylen isn't.  Partially because Smart was an NBA-ready prospect with star potential from what was thought to be a great draft...  and Jaylen is a very raw prospect from a weak draft.  Luckily 2017 is supposed to be awesome up top so we'll probably get someone who can make an impact right away.  Sounds like even if the pick falls in the 5-8 range, we're getting a better prospect than Jaylen.

[footey]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Given our draft stash, mediocrity seems overly harsh, don't you think?

[Moranis]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Why do they need to make a decision in the next two years? They own BKN's next two picks.

Do you recommend that they trade Horford and IT for late 1st rounders?

Don't they need to spend even a little bit of money? I think IT and Horford are perfectly acceptable as place holders. Given the monumental challenge of becoming an NBA champion in this current league, I think Danny is doing pretty well.

Boston needs to pick a direction.  If the direction is to build around the BKN picks, then yes, Boston should look to move Horford, Thomas, Crowder, and Bradley before the end of their contracts.  If Boston wants to win now and build a contender with Horford, Thomas, and Bradley, then Boston needs to move the prime assets to do so.  Again that tipping point isn't yet now, but it will be this summer and a direction needs to be chosen.  If Boston already knows what it wants to do, then it should start doing that now.

[Moranis]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Given our draft stash, mediocrity seems overly harsh, don't you think?

I don't believe so, because if you don't get young players minutes they won't become the players they could be.  Veterans will stunt their growth.  Similarly, there is no point hanging onto the picks if you are going to need those players to be contributing to a team a trying to win a title.  Trade them for players that can actually help you win a title. 

Boston will need to pick a direction and go with it in the very near future.  That doesn't mean right this second, but the time is quickly approaching.  And this won't be the first or last time Ainge is at that point.  He was in the summer of 2007.  He was in the summers of 12 and 13 (he went status quo in 12 before moving on in 13). 

[PhoSita]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Let's say for the sake of argument this is how it goes for the Celts in the next year or so:

Jimmy Butler trade talk resurfaces around the time of the draft, but the Celts remain unwilling to meet the asking price, which is Smart, Crowder or Bradley plus both of the remaining BRK picks.

They draft one of the point guards at the top of the draft -- Fultz, Ball, or Smith.  They use the T-Wolves 2nd rounder on a draft-and-stash guy.

They let Jerebko, Amir, Zeller, Green go in free agency.

They explore signing Paul Millsap or Serge Ibaka in free agency, but they end up getting max deals, which is too rich for how the Celts value them.  Blake Griffin re-signs with the Clips.

The Celts sign Taj Gibson and Andrew Bogut to short-term deals (1+1).

They re-sign Kelly Olynyk to a four year deal.

Yabu and Zizic sign with the team.

Before the start of the season, the Celts extend Marcus Smart on a reasonable deal.

This is the roster the Celts enter next season with:

Thomas / *Fultz* / Jackson
Bradley / Smart / Rozier
Crowder / Brown / Yabu
Gibson / Olynyk / Mickey
Horford / Bogut / Zizic


Where is the danger of "entering the land of mediocrity with no way out" here?

You've got 3 guys taken in the top 10 of the draft between 2014 and 2017 on that bench, plus a lottery pick from 2013. 

Guys like Gibson and Bogut can fill spots in the big rotation for the short-term without tying up the cap sheet in the long run. 

Maybe that team goes far in the playoffs, maybe not.  But they're not locked into anything long term.



The following summer, the Celts can make a decision about whether to re-sign Thomas and Bradley.

Even if they do, they would still have Smart, Olynyk, Brown, Rozier, Jackson, Yabu, Zizic, 2017 BRK 1st and 2018 BRK 1st as the next generation of Celts.

At the same time, Thomas, Crowder, Bradley, and Horford should continue to be productive, and will be possible to move for assets if the team decides to shift the focus toward developing the young guys.

I just don't see the urgency to "pick a direction" here.

[green_bballers13]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Why do they need to make a decision in the next two years? They own BKN's next two picks.

Do you recommend that they trade Horford and IT for late 1st rounders?

Don't they need to spend even a little bit of money? I think IT and Horford are perfectly acceptable as place holders. Given the monumental challenge of becoming an NBA champion in this current league, I think Danny is doing pretty well.

Boston needs to pick a direction.  If the direction is to build around the BKN picks, then yes, Boston should look to move Horford, Thomas, Crowder, and Bradley before the end of their contracts.  If Boston wants to win now and build a contender with Horford, Thomas, and Bradley, then Boston needs to move the prime assets to do so.  Again that tipping point isn't yet now, but it will be this summer and a direction needs to be chosen.  If Boston already knows what it wants to do, then it should start doing that now.

I think Danny knows what the plan is. He doesn't want to cheat fans with a tank, while also building for the future. Best of both worlds. Honestly, besides a handful of teams, (CLE, GSW, LAC, SAS), which team would you rather root for? Not TOR, thats for sure. They are going to peak out without smelling the finals.

I get that you want a ring. I don't get that you can't see a rebuild at work, without fraudulently taking fans' money. How many middle income families of 4 want to spend over $500 to watch their team lose by 20 points to the Knicks. If that is one of your prescribed routes, I'll take the other one.

[green_bballers13]

The Net's picks we are getting along with our competitive team presents a peculiar problem for this team. Are we in win mode now (which means we do not have playing time for Rookies) or are we building for the future (which requires heavy playing time for our rookies). It is really a perplexing and complex issue for the front office and coaching staff.

So Bloggers, the multiple Nets' picks, blessing? Yes. But does it not create a conundrum for the front office on a strategy going forward? Win now versus Build for future.

False premise based on the idea that our young guys don't get minutes, because the team is too good.  They don't get minutes, because they aren't good enough to get minutes.

Presumably the player we get with the 2017 Brooklyn pick will be good enough to get major minutes right away.   Marcus Smart was good enough for minutes right away.  Jaylen isn't.  Partially because Smart was an NBA-ready prospect with star potential from what was thought to be a great draft...  and Jaylen is a very raw prospect from a weak draft.  Luckily 2017 is supposed to be awesome up top so we'll probably get someone who can make an impact right away.  Sounds like even if the pick falls in the 5-8 range, we're getting a better prospect than Jaylen.

LB- I agree with a lot of what you write, except for when you start labelling our prospects. Why do you assume that a 22 yr old and a 20 yr old are anything close to what they will be in their prime (ages 26-32)? I think it is a key flaw in your logic. Weak draft? Are you Mel Kiper? I don't think we can judge these things until years after.

Is immediate impact the goal from selecting a 19 year old? I always thought that the draft process was more painful than FA acquisitions because of the wait.

[Moranis]

I've been saying for awhile that at some point in the near future, Boston is absolutely going to need to make a decision on what direction it wants to go.  I believe that decision point is this summer.  If it continues along in the current direction it will quickly enter the land of mediocrity with no way to get out.

Why do they need to make a decision in the next two years? They own BKN's next two picks.

Do you recommend that they trade Horford and IT for late 1st rounders?

Don't they need to spend even a little bit of money? I think IT and Horford are perfectly acceptable as place holders. Given the monumental challenge of becoming an NBA champion in this current league, I think Danny is doing pretty well.

Boston needs to pick a direction.  If the direction is to build around the BKN picks, then yes, Boston should look to move Horford, Thomas, Crowder, and Bradley before the end of their contracts.  If Boston wants to win now and build a contender with Horford, Thomas, and Bradley, then Boston needs to move the prime assets to do so.  Again that tipping point isn't yet now, but it will be this summer and a direction needs to be chosen.  If Boston already knows what it wants to do, then it should start doing that now.

I think Danny knows what the plan is. He doesn't want to cheat fans with a tank, while also building for the future. Best of both worlds. Honestly, besides a handful of teams, (CLE, GSW, LAC, SAS), which team would you rather root for? Not TOR, thats for sure. They are going to peak out without smelling the finals.

I get that you want a ring. I don't get that you can't see a rebuild at work, without fraudulently taking fans' money. How many middle income families of 4 want to spend over $500 to watch their team lose by 20 points to the Knicks. If that is one of your prescribed routes, I'll take the other one.

I actually would rather the team trade the picks and try to become a real contender.  I've been pretty clear on that.  I'd also be fine with making incremental trades that make that team better and don't give up any of the prime assets.  Trades like acquiring Greg Monroe or Tyson Chandler for Johnson and lesser draft picks, for example.  Anything that pushes Boston closer to contention so that if the real prime time player becomes available, Boston is that much closer to a title.

I also can't see how Boston keeps this team together without some major additions giving the up coming financial strain.  The financial metrics that will be in play just don't make it feasible to keep together a non-contender at contender prices.  So without those moves Boston absolutely should consolidate as much as possible.  If that means you trade Crowder and Bradley to upgrade a position or get better future assets, then it should be done.  If that means trading Horford or Thomas, then it should be done.  If that means letting Olynyk walk, then it should be done or he should be traded at the deadline.

[wdleehi]

All I can think of when I read this is the sports version of 1st world problems song.  (Weird Al)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwvlbJ0h35A
 

[BitterJim]

The Net's picks we are getting along with our competitive team presents a peculiar problem for this team. Are we in win mode now (which means we do not have playing time for Rookies) or are we building for the future (which requires heavy playing time for our rookies). It is really a perplexing and complex issue for the front office and coaching staff.

So Bloggers, the multiple Nets' picks, blessing? Yes. But does it not create a conundrum for the front office on a strategy going forward? Win now versus Build for future.

False premise based on the idea that our young guys don't get minutes, because the team is too good.  They don't get minutes, because they aren't good enough to get minutes.

Presumably the player we get with the 2017 Brooklyn pick will be good enough to get major minutes right away.   Marcus Smart was good enough for minutes right away.  Jaylen isn't.  Partially because Smart was an NBA-ready prospect with star potential from what was thought to be a great draft...  and Jaylen is a very raw prospect from a weak draft.  Luckily 2017 is supposed to be awesome up top so we'll probably get someone who can make an impact right away.  Sounds like even if the pick falls in the 5-8 range, we're getting a better prospect than Jaylen.

LB- I agree with a lot of what you write, except for when you start labelling our prospects. Why do you assume that a 22 yr old and a 20 yr old are anything close to what they will be in their prime (ages 26-32)? I think it is a key flaw in your logic. Weak draft? Are you Mel Kiper? I don't think we can judge these things until years after.

Is immediate impact the goal from selecting a 19 year old? I always thought that the draft process was more painful than FA acquisitions because of the wait.

When did he do that in his post?

As for calling it a weak draft, he's referring to how prospects are generally viewed for the draft.  2014 had a lot of highly regarded prospects, so it was considered strong.  2016, not so much, so it's considered weaker.  That doesn't mean that they won't exceed their expectations, but Smart and Brown aren't viewed as elite prospects.  They could become elite players, like Giannis or Kawhi Leonard have (neither was considered at great prospect at draft time), but that doesn't change the fact that they are not elite prospects

[saltlover]

The Net's picks we are getting along with our competitive team presents a peculiar problem for this team. Are we in win mode now (which means we do not have playing time for Rookies) or are we building for the future (which requires heavy playing time for our rookies). It is really a perplexing and complex issue for the front office and coaching staff.

So Bloggers, the multiple Nets' picks, blessing? Yes. But does it not create a conundrum for the front office on a strategy going forward? Win now versus Build for future.

False premise based on the idea that our young guys don't get minutes, because the team is too good.  They don't get minutes, because they aren't good enough to get minutes.

Presumably the player we get with the 2017 Brooklyn pick will be good enough to get major minutes right away.   Marcus Smart was good enough for minutes right away.  Jaylen isn't.  Partially because Smart was an NBA-ready prospect with star potential from what was thought to be a great draft...  and Jaylen is a very raw prospect from a weak draft.  Luckily 2017 is supposed to be awesome up top so we'll probably get someone who can make an impact right away.  Sounds like even if the pick falls in the 5-8 range, we're getting a better prospect than Jaylen.

LB- I agree with a lot of what you write, except for when you start labelling our prospects. Why do you assume that a 22 yr old and a 20 yr old are anything close to what they will be in their prime (ages 26-32)? I think it is a key flaw in your logic. Weak draft? Are you Mel Kiper? I don't think we can judge these things until years after.

Is immediate impact the goal from selecting a 19 year old? I always thought that the draft process was more painful than FA acquisitions because of the wait.

When did he do that in his post?

As for calling it a weak draft, he's referring to how prospects are generally viewed for the draft.  2014 had a lot of highly regarded prospects, so it was considered strong.  2016, not so much, so it's considered weaker.  That doesn't mean that they won't exceed their expectations, but Smart and Brown aren't viewed as elite prospects.  They could become elite players, like Giannis or Kawhi Leonard have (neither was considered at great prospect at draft time), but that doesn't change the fact that they are not elite prospects

2016 wasn't remotely considered a weak class -- it was considered to be somewhat lacking in potential superstar talent (although that's because there was one of those players instead of 2-3) , but one of the deepest in terms of producing potential rotation players.  2013 was weak.  2016 was not perceived that way, at all.

[Celtics18]

The Net's picks we are getting along with our competitive team presents a peculiar problem for this team. Are we in win mode now (which means we do not have playing time for Rookies) or are we building for the future (which requires heavy playing time for our rookies). It is really a perplexing and complex issue for the front office and coaching staff.

So Bloggers, the multiple Nets' picks, blessing? Yes. But does it not create a conundrum for the front office on a strategy going forward? Win now versus Build for future.

False premise based on the idea that our young guys don't get minutes, because the team is too good.  They don't get minutes, because they aren't good enough to get minutes.

Presumably the player we get with the 2017 Brooklyn pick will be good enough to get major minutes right away.   Marcus Smart was good enough for minutes right away.  Jaylen isn't.  Partially because Smart was an NBA-ready prospect with star potential from what was thought to be a great draft...  and Jaylen is a very raw prospect from a weak draft.  Luckily 2017 is supposed to be awesome up top so we'll probably get someone who can make an impact right away.  Sounds like even if the pick falls in the 5-8 range, we're getting a better prospect than Jaylen.

LB- I agree with a lot of what you write, except for when you start labelling our prospects. Why do you assume that a 22 yr old and a 20 yr old are anything close to what they will be in their prime (ages 26-32)? I think it is a key flaw in your logic. Weak draft? Are you Mel Kiper? I don't think we can judge these things until years after.

Is immediate impact the goal from selecting a 19 year old? I always thought that the draft process was more painful than FA acquisitions because of the wait.

When did he do that in his post?

As for calling it a weak draft, he's referring to how prospects are generally viewed for the draft.  2014 had a lot of highly regarded prospects, so it was considered strong.  2016, not so much, so it's considered weaker.  That doesn't mean that they won't exceed their expectations, but Smart and Brown aren't viewed as elite prospects.  They could become elite players, like Giannis or Kawhi Leonard have (neither was considered at great prospect at draft time), but that doesn't change the fact that they are not elite prospects

2016 wasn't remotely considered a weak class -- it was considered to be somewhat lacking in potential superstar talent (although that's because there was one of those players instead of 2-3) , but one of the deepest in terms of producing potential rotation players.  2013 was weak.  2016 was not perceived that way, at all.

2013 was considered weak at the time, but it has actually turned out to be a fairly strong draft with one legitimate superstar, a couple of second tier stars, and fairly good depth of competent NBA players--some of whom still have room for improvement.