36.7 % , 29.0 % , 62.5 %

[MBunge]

Avery Bradley at 22 in his third year was shooting 40% from the field, 32% from three and playing a much less significant role in the offense.  Marcus is also shooting almost twice as many threes as Avery was at the same age.

Marcus has shot the ball badly, especially from three, but that's being exaggerated by how Stevens is using him.  Part of it is that Stevens has a lot of confidence in Marcus and is playing him a lot but part of it is also Stevens' stubborn insistence on putting Marcus off the ball and telling him to jack up threes.

Chauncey Billups at 22 in his second year in the league shot 39% from the field and 36% from three, by the way.

Mike

Bradley also shot over 40% from three his second year and was a  37.5% shooter from three in college and was to that point a career FT shooter of well over 75%.

Smart was below 30% from three in both his years in college and is coming off the worst first 2 years of shooting in NBA history.  He isn't a guy that has shown the ability to shoot the ball well at any point in his recorded history. 

It is nice to think that Smart could become Bradley, there is just no evidence that can realistically lead anyone to that conclusion.  Unfortunately we can't just wish it so.

The point isn't that he will become Bradley or Billups or that Smart will ever become a great shooter.  The point is that just as those players improved, Smart still can improve.  The point is also that Smart's biggest problem is that he's a terrible three point shooter AND HIS COACH IS TELLING TO KEEP JACKING UP THREES.  What would Tony Allen have looked like if Doc told him to park behind the arcs and let him repeatedly go 1-8 and 0-5?

There's no denying that if Smart doesn't improve on offense, he'll never be better than a role player.  But he's 22, at least 2 or 3 years away from even entering his prime and is right now a better overall player than Avery Bradley was at the same age.

If this team becomes a legit contender and Marcus still sucks this bad offensively, that's when we'll need to be concerned.

Mike

But Smart wasn't a great shooter in college and has just continued that trend in the NBA.  Will he get better, probably, I mean he can't really get worse, but he will never be even a good shooter unless his entire history to this point has been a lie. 

and I'm not sure why keep mentioning Billups.  He shot 33% as a rookie and 36% in year two.  In his 13 games in year 3 he was terrible, but went up to 38% in year 4 in a full season.  Billups was never a terrible shooter and wasn't killing his team when he was shooting the 3 ball.

I bring up Billups because he's a player that most fans and multiple teams gave up on, then went on to have a great career.  I also bring him up because you can make a very strong argument that Smart is better at everything except shooting than Billups at the same age.

If Marcus were averaging one 3 attempt a game instead of over four, he'd be much closer to a mediocre offensive player than a horrible one.

Mike

and if pigs could fly they'd be called birds.  Smart is the worst shooter in NBA history, yet he keeps right on shooting.  That arrogance and stubbornness will turn him into Rondo

Smart is shooting 44% from 2, which is not great but far from horrible.  He's a terrible shooter only because he jacks up so many threes and he does that BECAUSE STEVENS TELLS HIM TO.  For two years under Stevens, Sully averaged roughly three 3 point shots a game.  Last season, that was down to just over one 3 point attempt a game.  Do you think Sully just decided on his own to stop shooting so many threes?

Smart is not a good shooter by any standard but his two-point percentage has improved the last two seasons.  If he didn't take so many bleepin' threes, that's what people would notice.  But because Stevens has him shooting more threes per game than Kyle Korver, that's all people notice.

Mike

[celtics2030]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

[PhoSita]

He has to shoot a lot less and concentrate on doing the things offensively that will make him better. He has to pass more and seek out the open man more. He has to commit to being a great rebounder. He has to drive the lane more and create offense that way.

My main concern with Smart shooting less and playing a more distribution-focused role on offense is that he could turn into a Rubio / Rondo sort of player ... that is, a guy the defense happily plays off, knowing he's going to defer instead of taking a shot.

Certainly I'd like to see Smart be more judicious with his shots, especially jumpers.

However, I think it's important for the team offense and for Smart as an individual player that he continue to have a willingness to take good shots that are open, even if he never shoots a particularly high percentage on them.  At the very least, we've seen that Smart has a penchant for hot streaks.  That can make a defense think twice about leaving him completely open.


I'd always prefer to have a 30% 3P shooter who happily takes any open shot he gets as opposed to a guy who hesitates and defers so that the defense can more or less ignore him.


He needs to get inside more, get to the line more, and finish at the rim better, however.  In college he was a solid finisher at the rim and drove a fair amount.  In the pros, that part of his game has been diminished significantly.  I worry, though, that he just doesn't have the first step to get inside enough as the ball-handler.

[CelticGuardian]

He has to shoot a lot less and concentrate on doing the things offensively that will make him better. He has to pass more and seek out the open man more. He has to commit to being a great rebounder. He has to drive the lane more and create offense that way.

My main concern with Smart shooting less and playing a more distribution-focused role on offense is that he could turn into a Rubio / Rondo sort of player ... that is, a guy the defense happily plays off, knowing he's going to defer instead of taking a shot.

Certainly I'd like to see Smart be more judicious with his shots, especially jumpers.

However, I think it's important for the team offense and for Smart as an individual player that he continue to have a willingness to take good shots that are open, even if he never shoots a particularly high percentage on them.  At the very least, we've seen that Smart has a penchant for hot streaks.  That can make a defense think twice about leaving him completely open.


I'd always prefer to have a 30% 3P shooter who happily takes any open shot he gets as opposed to a guy who hesitates and defers so that the defense can more or less ignore him.


He needs to get inside more, get to the line more, and finish at the rim better, however.  In college he was a solid finisher at the rim and drove a fair amount.  In the pros, that part of his game has been diminished significantly.  I worry, though, that he just doesn't have the first step to get inside enough as the ball-handler.

This has been the story for him since college though, he was always adept at using screens. He doesn't have enough shake to get guys going one way, but he's strong and fast should be able to bulldoze himself in there and draw a foul like he did in college. There's just a lot of emphasis on perimeter scoring in our team, and we never presented him with a situation where he's the primarily ball handler. I say this Spurs game is very important for him and thus, for us as fans.

[MBunge]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

And Payton is actually shooting threes WORSE than Smart.  The different is that Smart is taking over twice as many per game.  Maybe those are things you should consider?

Mike

[TrueFan]

Avery Bradley at 22 in his third year was shooting 40% from the field, 32% from three and playing a much less significant role in the offense.  Marcus is also shooting almost twice as many threes as Avery was at the same age.

Marcus has shot the ball badly, especially from three, but that's being exaggerated by how Stevens is using him.  Part of it is that Stevens has a lot of confidence in Marcus and is playing him a lot but part of it is also Stevens' stubborn insistence on putting Marcus off the ball and telling him to jack up threes.

Chauncey Billups at 22 in his second year in the league shot 39% from the field and 36% from three, by the way.

Mike

Bradley also shot over 40% from three his second year and was a  37.5% shooter from three in college and was to that point a career FT shooter of well over 75%.

Smart was below 30% from three in both his years in college and is coming off the worst first 2 years of shooting in NBA history.  He isn't a guy that has shown the ability to shoot the ball well at any point in his recorded history. 

It is nice to think that Smart could become Bradley, there is just no evidence that can realistically lead anyone to that conclusion.  Unfortunately we can't just wish it so.

The point isn't that he will become Bradley or Billups or that Smart will ever become a great shooter.  The point is that just as those players improved, Smart still can improve.  The point is also that Smart's biggest problem is that he's a terrible three point shooter AND HIS COACH IS TELLING TO KEEP JACKING UP THREES.  What would Tony Allen have looked like if Doc told him to park behind the arcs and let him repeatedly go 1-8 and 0-5?

There's no denying that if Smart doesn't improve on offense, he'll never be better than a role player.  But he's 22, at least 2 or 3 years away from even entering his prime and is right now a better overall player than Avery Bradley was at the same age.

If this team becomes a legit contender and Marcus still sucks this bad offensively, that's when we'll need to be concerned.

Mike

But Smart wasn't a great shooter in college and has just continued that trend in the NBA.  Will he get better, probably, I mean he can't really get worse, but he will never be even a good shooter unless his entire history to this point has been a lie. 

and I'm not sure why keep mentioning Billups.  He shot 33% as a rookie and 36% in year two.  In his 13 games in year 3 he was terrible, but went up to 38% in year 4 in a full season.  Billups was never a terrible shooter and wasn't killing his team when he was shooting the 3 ball.

I bring up Billups because he's a player that most fans and multiple teams gave up on, then went on to have a great career.  I also bring him up because you can make a very strong argument that Smart is better at everything except shooting than Billups at the same age.

If Marcus were averaging one 3 attempt a game instead of over four, he'd be much closer to a mediocre offensive player than a horrible one.

Mike

Good point.

Also.

Is there a stat out there for last second desperation shots?

I don't think it would make more then a 1 or 2 percentage point difference but it would be nice to know what his field goal percentage is minus those shots.

Basketball Reference has "heaves", and has Smart at 5 for the season (as compared to 4 for each of the last two seasons), although you should take their shot location data with a pinch of salt.  Without those 5 (which again, may not be accurate) he's shooting 30.5%, which is still bad

It's at least encouraging that his 3 point shooting has improved from last year's truly awful 25.3%.  Hopefully he can get closer to his rookie season shooting of 33.5% and then improve again next year

We probably should start a thread to keep count of them because I'm sure there are more then 5 wild shots he's taken at the end of a quarter.

[PickNRoll]

Avery Bradley at 22 in his third year was shooting 40% from the field, 32% from three and playing a much less significant role in the offense.  Marcus is also shooting almost twice as many threes as Avery was at the same age.

Marcus has shot the ball badly, especially from three, but that's being exaggerated by how Stevens is using him.  Part of it is that Stevens has a lot of confidence in Marcus and is playing him a lot but part of it is also Stevens' stubborn insistence on putting Marcus off the ball and telling him to jack up threes.

Chauncey Billups at 22 in his second year in the league shot 39% from the field and 36% from three, by the way.

Mike

Bradley also shot over 40% from three his second year and was a  37.5% shooter from three in college and was to that point a career FT shooter of well over 75%.

Smart was below 30% from three in both his years in college and is coming off the worst first 2 years of shooting in NBA history.  He isn't a guy that has shown the ability to shoot the ball well at any point in his recorded history. 

It is nice to think that Smart could become Bradley, there is just no evidence that can realistically lead anyone to that conclusion.  Unfortunately we can't just wish it so.

The point isn't that he will become Bradley or Billups or that Smart will ever become a great shooter.  The point is that just as those players improved, Smart still can improve.  The point is also that Smart's biggest problem is that he's a terrible three point shooter AND HIS COACH IS TELLING TO KEEP JACKING UP THREES.  What would Tony Allen have looked like if Doc told him to park behind the arcs and let him repeatedly go 1-8 and 0-5?

There's no denying that if Smart doesn't improve on offense, he'll never be better than a role player.  But he's 22, at least 2 or 3 years away from even entering his prime and is right now a better overall player than Avery Bradley was at the same age.

If this team becomes a legit contender and Marcus still sucks this bad offensively, that's when we'll need to be concerned.

Mike

But Smart wasn't a great shooter in college and has just continued that trend in the NBA.  Will he get better, probably, I mean he can't really get worse, but he will never be even a good shooter unless his entire history to this point has been a lie. 

and I'm not sure why keep mentioning Billups.  He shot 33% as a rookie and 36% in year two.  In his 13 games in year 3 he was terrible, but went up to 38% in year 4 in a full season.  Billups was never a terrible shooter and wasn't killing his team when he was shooting the 3 ball.

I bring up Billups because he's a player that most fans and multiple teams gave up on, then went on to have a great career.  I also bring him up because you can make a very strong argument that Smart is better at everything except shooting than Billups at the same age.

If Marcus were averaging one 3 attempt a game instead of over four, he'd be much closer to a mediocre offensive player than a horrible one.

Mike

and if pigs could fly they'd be called birds.  Smart is the worst shooter in NBA history, yet he keeps right on shooting.  That arrogance and stubbornness will turn him into Rondo

Smart is shooting 44% from 2, which is not great but far from horrible.  He's a terrible shooter only because he jacks up so many threes and he does that BECAUSE STEVENS TELLS HIM TO.  For two years under Stevens, Sully averaged roughly three 3 point shots a game.  Last season, that was down to just over one 3 point attempt a game.  Do you think Sully just decided on his own to stop shooting so many threes?

Smart is not a good shooter by any standard but his two-point percentage has improved the last two seasons.  If he didn't take so many bleepin' threes, that's what people would notice.  But because Stevens has him shooting more threes per game than Kyle Korver, that's all people notice.

Mike

Sure, you can bottle him up like Ricky Rubio and demand that he stops shooting 3's... and watch your floor spacing go to he#$.  The threat of taking and making 3's is crucial to Steven's offense.  None of it works if we're not swinging it side-to-side and driving closeouts.  That means you have to take open 3's.  30% isn't good, but it's good enough that he needs to keep shooting them.  Defenses are still respecting him.

If Smart had made just 5 more 3pt attempts this year, he'd be at a respectable 36% (not counting heaves).  That would be 15 points over 24 games, or 0.6ppg.  Are we really sweating 0.6ppg?  Would you have him stop taking 3's and allow defenses to sag for 0.6ppg?

[PickNRoll]

Avery Bradley at 22 in his third year was shooting 40% from the field, 32% from three and playing a much less significant role in the offense.  Marcus is also shooting almost twice as many threes as Avery was at the same age.

Marcus has shot the ball badly, especially from three, but that's being exaggerated by how Stevens is using him.  Part of it is that Stevens has a lot of confidence in Marcus and is playing him a lot but part of it is also Stevens' stubborn insistence on putting Marcus off the ball and telling him to jack up threes.

Chauncey Billups at 22 in his second year in the league shot 39% from the field and 36% from three, by the way.

Mike

Bradley also shot over 40% from three his second year and was a  37.5% shooter from three in college and was to that point a career FT shooter of well over 75%.

Smart was below 30% from three in both his years in college and is coming off the worst first 2 years of shooting in NBA history.  He isn't a guy that has shown the ability to shoot the ball well at any point in his recorded history. 

It is nice to think that Smart could become Bradley, there is just no evidence that can realistically lead anyone to that conclusion.  Unfortunately we can't just wish it so.

The point isn't that he will become Bradley or Billups or that Smart will ever become a great shooter.  The point is that just as those players improved, Smart still can improve.  The point is also that Smart's biggest problem is that he's a terrible three point shooter AND HIS COACH IS TELLING TO KEEP JACKING UP THREES.  What would Tony Allen have looked like if Doc told him to park behind the arcs and let him repeatedly go 1-8 and 0-5?

There's no denying that if Smart doesn't improve on offense, he'll never be better than a role player.  But he's 22, at least 2 or 3 years away from even entering his prime and is right now a better overall player than Avery Bradley was at the same age.

If this team becomes a legit contender and Marcus still sucks this bad offensively, that's when we'll need to be concerned.

Mike

But Smart wasn't a great shooter in college and has just continued that trend in the NBA.  Will he get better, probably, I mean he can't really get worse, but he will never be even a good shooter unless his entire history to this point has been a lie. 

and I'm not sure why keep mentioning Billups.  He shot 33% as a rookie and 36% in year two.  In his 13 games in year 3 he was terrible, but went up to 38% in year 4 in a full season.  Billups was never a terrible shooter and wasn't killing his team when he was shooting the 3 ball.

I bring up Billups because he's a player that most fans and multiple teams gave up on, then went on to have a great career.  I also bring him up because you can make a very strong argument that Smart is better at everything except shooting than Billups at the same age.

If Marcus were averaging one 3 attempt a game instead of over four, he'd be much closer to a mediocre offensive player than a horrible one.

Mike

Good point.

Also.

Is there a stat out there for last second desperation shots?

I don't think it would make more then a 1 or 2 percentage point difference but it would be nice to know what his field goal percentage is minus those shots.

Basketball Reference has "heaves", and has Smart at 5 for the season (as compared to 4 for each of the last two seasons), although you should take their shot location data with a pinch of salt.  Without those 5 (which again, may not be accurate) he's shooting 30.5%, which is still bad

It's at least encouraging that his 3 point shooting has improved from last year's truly awful 25.3%.  Hopefully he can get closer to his rookie season shooting of 33.5% and then improve again next year

We probably should start a thread to keep count of them because I'm sure there are more then 5 wild shots he's taken at the end of a quarter.

he's also taken a few from the hash, near side of half court, that they might not count as heaves.  Not sure how they track heaves.

[Ilikesports17]

OP mentioned something here a lot of people dont mention.

Marcus shoots a ton of threes and doesnt get to the basket/line much. He gets criticized for this a lot, but I think the reason he shoot so many threes is because he is so bad going to and finishing at the rim. His looks mostly come from 3, because he cant create much else.

That said, I disagree with the conclusion.

Smart isnt a potential star. I do think he could figure out the jumper (to some extent), improve his decision making and gain a little savy using his strength to create easy opportunities at the rim and free throws ala Paul Pierce. If he can do these things, he can play a huge roll on a championship team. He can run your offense and if he can get to the point where he can hit open catch and shoot threes, he wont be an offensive liability ever. His defense is so valuable and as everyone notes he just makes winning plays. He is currently top 5 in offensive fouls drawn (hes finished in the top 5 both of his previous years as well).

Defensive liabilities are tough on contenders because when the game slows down and goes possession by possession in the later rounds of the playoffs, you see matchups on offense get isolated and attacked. We saw it in the finals. Each team would more or less identify the defender they felt they could take advantage of and attack them via pick and roll.

Provided Marcus can hit an open catch and shoot three, this wont happen on offense.

The second piece of the conclusion was that Smart is a big-time asset.

He really isnt. He doesnt project as a star, yet he is really valuable to winning. These are the type
of guys that I think are more valuable to their team than any other team. In a trade he carries the "defensive role-player" label, but that sells his value short.

Keep Smart.

[jpotter33]

This is my first time commenting on the Marcus Smart is a bad offensive player subject. I was really hoping that by now, Smart would have learned to shoot better but there has been little to no improvement in his shooting percentages.

But Smart is a heck of an all around basketball player. He is one of the best defenders in the league and he does a lot of things offensively that are good. He is an under rated passer. I think he has plus floor vision. I also think he could be a great rebounding guard. He has a high bbiq.

But....

He has to shoot a lot less and concentrate on doing the things offensively that will make him better. He has to pass more and seek out the open man more. He has to commit to being a great rebounder. He has to drive the lane more and create offense that way.

Some of this stuff is on him. Other things is on Stevens. They both have to change how Smart plays and is utilized to maximize what Marcus can give this team. Smart has had his chance to shoot his way into better shooting numbers. Its not happening. Its time to slow down on the shooting and time to concentrate on doing the things Marcus is great at to get the most of him as a player

I think the OKC game is a great way to show the accuracy of this post. When you make him the primary ball handler and don't play him off the ball as a spot up shooter, he does an excellent job of initiating the offense and getting others involved. The first six minutes of the third quarter the other night was some of the best team basketball I've ever seen, and it started with Smart initiating the offense via penetration or PnR and the team utilizing excellent ball movement to find good shots.

There's simply no more excuse for playing Smart off the ball. He just isn't that type of player, and he needs to be initiating the offense to maximize his skill set offensively.

[jpotter33]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

And Payton is actually shooting threes WORSE than Smart.  The different is that Smart is taking over twice as many per game.  Maybe those are things you should consider?

Mike

Context is obviously not a strong suit of the super Smart haters.

[celtics2030]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

And Payton is actually shooting threes WORSE than Smart.  The different is that Smart is taking over twice as many per game.  Maybe those are things you should consider?

Mike

No because you say that he shoots 2 pointers at a decent clip. You might be wrong because Im not going to count layups and putbacks or fast break layups as shooting , so that stat might include those.

[celtics2030]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

And Payton is actually shooting threes WORSE than Smart.  The different is that Smart is taking over twice as many per game.  Maybe those are things you should consider?

Mike

Context is obviously not a strong suit of the super Smart haters.

First of all, guys like you and Mike are the worst because you guys get super defensive, and end up looking wrong anyways.

[TrueFan]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

And Payton is actually shooting threes WORSE than Smart.  The different is that Smart is taking over twice as many per game.  Maybe those are things you should consider?

Mike

Context is obviously not a strong suit of the super Smart haters.

First of all, guys like you and Mike are the worst because you guys get super defensive, and end up looking wrong anyways.

The most defensive person here is probably you.

[PickNRoll]

Elfrid Payton shoots 52% from 2.....so hes better

You should know better , how many of those 2's for Smart are put backs or layups? Why wont you look at his shooting outside of say 7 feet? Maybe then your point would have value 

And Payton is actually shooting threes WORSE than Smart.  The different is that Smart is taking over twice as many per game.  Maybe those are things you should consider?

Mike

Hey, I know another Payton who can't shoot 3's.  Gary Payton. 

All-rookie second team. 
Scored 7,9,and 13 ppg respectively in his first 3 seasons.
Career 31% 3pt shooter
~ 4 rebounds and 7 assists per game
shot 31% on 4.6 3pt attempts while winning DPOY (only PG ever)

Remind you of anyone?