Author Topic: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!  (Read 6116 times)

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Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2016, 10:14:00 AM »

Offline droopdog7

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Yeah, this is yet another homer thread.  People aren't willing to trade Avery or Crowder unless we get all stars in return?  Yeah, then I guess you're not trading those guys.  And people only WILLING to trade guys they don t really care about.

The overvaluing of our guys is way over the top.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2016, 10:21:57 AM »

Offline LGC88

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Yeah, this is yet another homer thread.  People aren't willing to trade Avery or Crowder unless we get all stars in return?  Yeah, then I guess you're not trading those guys.  And people only WILLING to trade guys they don t really care about.

The overvaluing of our guys is way over the top.

You didn't get what we have said.
We don't overvalue our players. We value the core of this team.
If we trade this core + picks for 2 stars, you end up like the clippers with no bench and very limited chance to win title.
With superteam like Cavs and GS, our only chance is to keep this defensive core and add stars though FA or (trade) picks.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2016, 10:26:22 AM »

Offline slightly biased bias fan

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Yeah, this is yet another homer thread.  People aren't willing to trade Avery or Crowder unless we get all stars in return?  Yeah, then I guess you're not trading those guys.  And people only WILLING to trade guys they don t really care about.

The overvaluing of our guys is way over the top.

So true, if anything these are the few I would trade out of our valuable assets. Both Bradley & Crowder have very good contracts as of now but don't think for a second they won't want a max once their contracts are up, also Bradley is an awesome defender but he is only 6'1-2 with shoes and when his athleticism goes he won't be anywhere near as good of a defender as his vert and hustle are staples of his game plus I am sure Smart will pass him in a few years and Crowder is for me standing in the way of Brown's development. I can't see either's value being any higher...I say strike when the iron's hot and trade them along with 18 Brooklyn pick either this or next season.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2016, 10:28:43 AM »

Offline apc

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My gut feeling is that DA also thinks highly of those three.
He will not trade the for a marginal upgrade (Butler?)., but if a legit all-star- game changer is available DA will not hesitate.


Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2016, 10:46:21 AM »

Offline dysgenic

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I'd be willing to move Crowder under the right circumstances. I'm resistant to trading Smart.  I'm totally opposed to trading AB. He gets better every year, has a great contract, and is the heart and soul of this team. You know we beat Atlanta if he is healthy as well.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2016, 10:47:47 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Sure you can if it upgrades the team overall. Having plus defenders across the perimeter (except for Thomas) is crucial to how last years team worked.

But if you upgrade the team overall you just play differently.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2016, 10:49:42 AM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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By way of all the rumors, I think it's safe to assume that Smart has already been offered in a trade.

I'll be surprised if he is still a Celtic by the end of this season. Have to trade him now before he loses perceived upside.
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Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2016, 10:53:37 AM »

Offline td450

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Yeah, this is yet another homer thread.  People aren't willing to trade Avery or Crowder unless we get all stars in return?  Yeah, then I guess you're not trading those guys.  And people only WILLING to trade guys they don t really care about.

The overvaluing of our guys is way over the top.

So true, if anything these are the few I would trade out of our valuable assets. Both Bradley & Crowder have very good contracts as of now but don't think for a second they won't want a max once their contracts are up, also Bradley is an awesome defender but he is only 6'1-2 with shoes and when his athleticism goes he won't be anywhere near as good of a defender as his vert and hustle are staples of his game plus I am sure Smart will pass him in a few years and Crowder is for me standing in the way of Brown's development. I can't see either's value being any higher...I say strike when the iron's hot and trade them along with 18 Brooklyn pick either this or next season.

Bradley is 25. So yeah, 6 or 7 years from now he will begin to decline as a defender. I'm not sure it's time to start worrying about that just yet.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2016, 11:10:15 AM »

Offline Smokeeye123

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I would nuke our entire team if it meant getting Cousins or a player on his caliber.  Listen Crowder and Bradley are gritty players and great to root for, but they are not good enough to win a championship with if they are the best players on your team.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2016, 11:22:13 AM »

Offline EJPLAYA

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I would nuke our entire team if it meant getting Cousins or a player on his caliber.  Listen Crowder and Bradley are gritty players and great to root for, but they are not good enough to win a championship with if they are the best players on your team.
Yeah that's smart. Then we'd end up being an amazing team like the kings!! I think it's pretty obvious how successful we'd be with nobody except for cousins...

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2016, 11:26:38 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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Yeah, this is yet another homer thread.  People aren't willing to trade Avery or Crowder unless we get all stars in return?  Yeah, then I guess you're not trading those guys.  And people only WILLING to trade guys they don t really care about.

The overvaluing of our guys is way over the top.

That's part of the entertainment of this blog. TP for recognizing the chronic overvaluing of relatively average Celtic players. You should have been here when Rondo was on the trade block.
Coined the CelticsBlog term, "Euromistake."

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #26 on: July 07, 2016, 11:29:54 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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I have no heartburn about trading Marcus Smart whatsoever. Not offensively skilled enough to worry about trading. We'll be fine defensively.

Stevens wants guys that can switch in pick n rolls with out giving up much of an advantage. He hasn't had that ability to do that yet because of players like Sully and KO that can't guard anything faster than a sloth.

Smarts been able to guard 1-5 with some success. While AB can shoot better than Smart he can only really guard 1's and 2's. And IT, 1's. Smart has done a lot on the defensive end that makes up for his lack off offense. If he can become an average offensive player, which wouldn't take too much, he has a slight advantage over AB.

And I'm not saying Smart should be a starter, I don't think AB is really a starter, not on a contender. Butler fills that roll much more, but I'd rather have Smart and AB backing up IT and a Butler than get rid of one of them.

Unfortunately AB has the most value when it comes to D and the ability to shoot the 3 ball under that contract. If you're swapping one for Butler, AB would be the one that goes because you have to give up one less asset to make it work in a trade.  And if you keep AB, he's going to demand a huge pay raise in a could years.

Smart will be more cost effective and you don't give up much.

Until Smart proves he can shoot and consistently distribute the basketball without turnovers - neither skill I believe he will ever develop - I just chuckle at the people who consider him untouchable.

If people love his warts that much, just go get Tony Allen back from Memphis. Not much difference in the skill set.

I suspect it's more of "Don't trade my favorite player," actually.
Coined the CelticsBlog term, "Euromistake."

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #27 on: July 07, 2016, 11:35:07 AM »

Offline dannyboy35

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Yeah, I'm personally very ready to move Smart. I'm becoming more intrigued by Rozier and even want to see what Jackson can do. Smart is a guy I'd love to have on a championship bench but we aren't close and while I could be proven wrong I think his offense will always be Ron Artest like. Very choppy and inconsistent. Plus he's not good st staying in front of point guards. Great on 2's and 3's but I don't like him defending 1's right now. I'm not sure he has the quickness in him for that. Not his fault. I admire his effort always.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #28 on: July 07, 2016, 11:37:22 AM »

Offline dannyboy35

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Just venting but this is all an incredible case of bad luck with the salary spike. Ainge set things up incredibly. We could have been one of a handful of teams to take in two max guys and have an incredible supporting cast. Such a bummer.

Re: Not to be a Homer... but *CAN'T* Trade Bradley, Smart or Crowder!
« Reply #29 on: July 07, 2016, 11:53:36 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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I have no heartburn about trading Marcus Smart whatsoever. Not offensively skilled enough to worry about trading. We'll be fine defensively.

Stevens wants guys that can switch in pick n rolls with out giving up much of an advantage. He hasn't had that ability to do that yet because of players like Sully and KO that can't guard anything faster than a sloth.

Smarts been able to guard 1-5 with some success. While AB can shoot better than Smart he can only really guard 1's and 2's. And IT, 1's. Smart has done a lot on the defensive end that makes up for his lack off offense. If he can become an average offensive player, which wouldn't take too much, he has a slight advantage over AB.

And I'm not saying Smart should be a starter, I don't think AB is really a starter, not on a contender. Butler fills that roll much more, but I'd rather have Smart and AB backing up IT and a Butler than get rid of one of them.

Unfortunately AB has the most value when it comes to D and the ability to shoot the 3 ball under that contract. If you're swapping one for Butler, AB would be the one that goes because you have to give up one less asset to make it work in a trade.  And if you keep AB, he's going to demand a huge pay raise in a could years.

Smart will be more cost effective and you don't give up much.

You give Olynyk a great disservice with that comment. 

There is a reason why he has had some of the better advanced numbered defensively at his position the last 2 seasons - it's not a fluke.  KO is not a rim protector by any means, but he's actually a LOT more mobile the people give him credit for.  He moves pretty well laterally for a 7 footer, he's very intelligent and is always in the right place at the right time, and he rarely does stupid things like bite on pump fakes.

Even his shotblocking numbers were half respectable last season.

Kelly's athleticism is massively underrated on here I think.  He's not a great leaper and doesn't play much above the rim, but he runs hard and and often in transition and he has consistently been one of our better defensive players for a year or two now.

If you can reduce the foul tendancy (he did a bit last year) he'll get even better.

Sully is in a similar category - when he wants to be. Sully has shown he can be a quality defensive player but doesn't always seem to be motivated to move.  He's not as mobile as KO though and seems to struggle a lot more against quicker bigs who Kelly often can stick with ok.

I still remember the brilliant defensive Job Olynyk did against Cousins not that long ago.  Can't begin to compete with him on size or strength, but he used angles and his hands well to force DMC into uncomfortable positions, and in that he forced a lot of bad shots.  He didn't get a lot of credit for it, but he was playing EXCEPTIONAL defence that night against a guy who should have had his number in so many ways.