The problem isn't the Celtics. It's some of the fans.

[elcotte]

I think there are just too many emotional over reactions from fans who had high expectations for unrealistic trades based on misinformation. If we had drafted Dunn, and the Sixers and Bulls refused to put together a good trade offer, these same fans would now be clamoring over the fact that we have too many guards and we have to trade one of Dunn/Smart and the league knows this so we're screwed.

IF the Bulls or Sixers were serious enough to get Dunn, they would have done so with the Suns or Wolves after us. They didn't manage to make a trade with 3 different teams that could have gotten them Dunn, so it is very apparent that they were not making good offers and what was reported was inaccurate.

TP  If the Sixer's offer was so good why didn't the Suns or Minneapolis take it?

Exactly. I address this question to ShAQATTACK and CoachBo and everyone who insists Ainge passed on a great deal last night.

Yes, and also Middleton and Monroe for #16 and #23 and a player.....
Ainge has to be an idiot because these were rock hard deals, because they were on the internet, and he passed them up because he doesn't know anything.
Yea, sure.

[BitterJim]

You'll find this kind of complaining among all fanbases of major sports teams.  Just ignore them or laugh at their knee-jerk reactions.  Some of the negative responses are actually pretty comical, even if they can be over the top and annoying at times.

In general, people need to remember that the outspoken opinions of a few don't represent the viewpoints of the regular users of C's blog as a whole.  Oftentimes posters here will group the blog together, making generalized statements like "people here think Ainge is a draft savant" and proceed to post negative remarks in a condescending tone. 

This is a great blog with many, many knowledgeable fans.  There are other sports boards where practically every topic degenerates into flamewars and insults without meaningful discussion.  Don't let the complaining on C's blog detract you from the fact that this is overall a well-moderated and great sports forum.

TP for the laugh.

I suppose you could tell whom I was referring to.

If only we could get just a taste of all the basketball knowledge Coach Bo has, maybe we could see the light!  How we would kill to be as wise and mighty as he!  Imagine the success of the Celtics if he were at the helm: players wouldn't just join us, they would PAY to play for us!

Please, of mighty Coach GM LORD Bo, please bestow more of your immense intelligence upon us, so that we too may see Danny Ainge for what he really is!

[Sketch5]

Fans were screwed last night.

They waited for a REAL deal

It was there for the taking nd the MGMT threw it away ......on a silver platter .....and it was ignored.

Could be the worst draft night in Celtic history

Yeah, but that silver platter had a bear trap on it. Too much to give up for Butler that doesn't tip the scales that much. And I don't think Durant would come to Boston for just IT and Butler and no help. That's the issue of OKC. DA can grab a couple in FA and still have AB Cowder Smart and Brown as your bench. Thats pretty good.

[Snakehead]

You'll find this kind of complaining among all fanbases of major sports teams.  Just ignore them or laugh at their knee-jerk reactions.  Some of the negative responses are actually pretty comical, even if they can be over the top and annoying at times.

In general, people need to remember that the outspoken opinions of a few don't represent the viewpoints of the regular users of C's blog as a whole.  Oftentimes posters here will group the blog together, making generalized statements like "people here think Ainge is a draft savant" and proceed to post negative remarks in a condescending tone. 

This is a great blog with many, many knowledgeable fans.  There are other sports boards where practically every topic degenerates into flamewars and insults without meaningful discussion.  Don't let the complaining on C's blog detract you from the fact that this is overall a well-moderated and great sports forum.

TP for the laugh.

Not to sound like a pretentious prick, but from the point of view from someone who has been around since 2004 or so, the  couple of successful years we had between 2008 and 2010 did result in a non-negligible influx of pink-hatter kids.

The older folks were mostly die-hards and/or masochists who enjoyed rooting for the laundry of a perennial 30-win team. I'm glad that a good amount of them are still around, but the population certainly got somewhat watered down.

Since you opened the gate, I will say it just reeks of a lot of Boston fans in the time of recent success.  So entitled and ridiculous.  Everyone knows all the offers on the table because they are the junior GM in training, plugged into everything in the league.

Picking a guy at 16 they didn't watch a bunch of videos of and wasn't on the rankings of some Draft Express-guru who doesn't actually evaluate talent for a team or draft basketball players is a reach.  When you've said like half of the first 30 picks are a reach, maybe you don't know what the hell you're talking about?

At one point we were thrilled we could be putting out a competitive team that still can get a top 3 pick.  Now if we take a top 3 prospect it was a gigantic failure.  KG/Ray Allen trades come along every year, right?  That's how these people talk.

TP to you Koz you have been great the last couple days on here.

[jpotter33]

I think there are just too many emotional over reactions from fans who had high expectations for unrealistic trades based on misinformation. If we had drafted Dunn, and the Sixers and Bulls refused to put together a good trade offer, these same fans would now be clamoring over the fact that we have too many guards and we have to trade one of Dunn/Smart and the league knows this so we're screwed.

IF the Bulls or Sixers were serious enough to get Dunn, they would have done so with the Suns or Wolves after us. They didn't manage to make a trade with 3 different teams that could have gotten them Dunn, so it is very apparent that they were not making good offers and what was reported was inaccurate.

TP  If the Sixer's offer was so good why didn't the Suns or Minneapolis take it?

Exactly. I address this question to ShAQATTACK and CoachBo and everyone who insists Ainge passed on a great deal last night.

A) Minnesota is already stuffed with bigs (one of which has HOF potential), so it makes absolutely no sense that they would trade with Philly. They also extremely loved Dunn and had a need for him, so Minny would make no sense taking that deal. It's called context.

B) The Suns obviously viewed Bender and Chriss as better, higher-ceiling prospects than Noel and Okafor, which are reasonable arguments. They also already have Chandler, who does essentially the same thing as Noel just not as athletically or good anymore due to him losing his athleticism.

So, no, just posting these two teams as evidence that it wasn't a good trade doesn't work when you take their context into consideration.

[greece66]

I also found the level of conversation disappointing although tbh this is what to expect in a sports forum.

The matter of the fact is we do not know enough to discuss this meaningfully.

Full information about trades that failed to happen is never disclosed; the credulity of fans to instantly buy whatever X or Y typed on twitter is amazing...

As for players, teams relied more than ever on what they saw in workouts and through their own scouting. DX mock was a travesty.

I understand when people get disappointed when a personal favourite is not choses- I felt the same way for Giannis in 2013. But let's at least wait a few months before jumping to conclusions about who is the draft's best player and the supposed mistakes of Ainge.

[PaulAllen]

Fans were screwed last night.

They waited for a REAL deal

It was there for the taking nd the MGMT threw it away ......on a silver platter .....and it was ignored.

Could be the worst draft night in Celtic history

haha how old are you?

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

Seems a lot of the fans are smarter than Ainge from the stupid stunt he pulled last night.

I wish I was as dumb as Ainge is, he actually has the job and is getting paid millions. Hmmm, let me weigh the options on who I'd rather be, smarter person giving opinions on a free site or a GM of the greatest organization in basketball and getting a fat bank account? Can someone pass me a dunce cap?

[Scintan]

You'll find this kind of complaining among all fanbases of major sports teams.  Just ignore them or laugh at their knee-jerk reactions.  Some of the negative responses are actually pretty comical, even if they can be over the top and annoying at times.

In general, people need to remember that the outspoken opinions of a few don't represent the viewpoints of the regular users of C's blog as a whole.  Oftentimes posters here will group the blog together, making generalized statements like "people here think Ainge is a draft savant" and proceed to post negative remarks in a condescending tone. 

This is a great blog with many, many knowledgeable fans.  There are other sports boards where practically every topic degenerates into flamewars and insults without meaningful discussion.  Don't let the complaining on C's blog detract you from the fact that this is overall a well-moderated and great sports forum.

TP for the laugh.

Not to sound like a pretentious prick, but from the point of view from someone who has been around since 2004 or so, the  couple of successful years we had between 2008 and 2010 did result in a non-negligible influx of pink-hatter kids.

The older folks were mostly die-hards and/or masochists who enjoyed rooting for the laundry of a perennial 30-win team. I'm glad that a good amount of them are still around, but the population certainly got somewhat watered down.

That goes in both directions.  The homers, as a group, were more reasonable and thoughtful, as well.

[Rosco917]

I have never been more disappointed in this blog than last night and the toxic posting is only intensifying.

Too many seem more interested in conjecture and fantasy than in watching the team continue to develop in a multi-year process.

I've learned absolutely nothing from visiting this website last night and today.

Danny was very clever to not make a trade for the sake of it. To give away the shop for one player, whether it's Butler or Cousins, would have been the wrong decision.

The draft is overrated in that these players are not going to show up on day one and lift us up. People also need to chill out and wait to see what happens in free agency and trades.

While people complain about treadmills and fireworks that never happen, Danny is very close to balancing the roster.

Danny did not draft a guard. That was his best decision. That means we are all set at guard and Isaiah, Avery and Smart are that core. I expect Rozier to step up and be the fourth guard.

We have one of the best back courts in the NBA and Danny was clever to not upset that balance.

Now we are similarly all set to go at small forward. Crowder plus Brown is the same level of competence we have at guards. We are all set at three of five positions. That is something to be positive about.

I guess what needs to be known is which of these guys are draft and stash and who might play next year. Brown is obviously going to be in the rotation. His selection seems to imply that Evan Turner is not returning.

I await to see what Danny does with the front court. I can't imagine us winning less games than last year no matter what happens or doesn't happen next.

Anyone who can't wait another year or two for Danny to pull the trigger or for younger players to emerge is not the kind of fan I respect.

I await for more posts from Rollie and the few people on this blog who are thoughtful and not prone to making public hissy fits about a sport.

I would not miss Sully and Zeller and don't expect them back. I think Amir and Jerebko are returning. I hope Zizac is not draft and stash and can be the fourth or fifth big. We should be able to have a better idea about Jordan Mickey soon. It will also be Kelly's fourth year and it will be interesting to see what he does. And Marcus Smart is another player to keep an eye on.

Those who think we have a mediocre roster are fans that I don't respect. If it is so painful to follow the team and one feels they suck and everything sucks, those are not people I enjoy reading their thoughts.

I would sign Dwight Howard if at all possible. He could be the foundation for a three year window right now to win it all. He would cost nothing as a free agent other than his contract. That would take care of the antsy crowd who refuse to look ahead and forget that we are already in the hunt to be ranked as the sixth best team in the NBA.

Then in three years, all of our players still on the team from Smart to new draft picks and even the Brooklyn pick next year could be ready to compete. We do need a center. It might be Zizac. We need a bridge to get to three years in the future. If we could sign a decent free agent center to go with Amir and if Olynyk and Jerebko are decent and keep improving, we could steal a title before we even reach some longer window. Then we become the San Antonio Spurs.

If Danny strikes out on free agency, we are still a 48+ win team with a ton of assets. Or we could redo last year when some blogger all over this page kept saying the Nets were solid and could make the playoffs or late lottery. You can do that. I won't.

I believe right now we are only one player away from winning it all. That may or may not happen. We will definitely get that one or two players eventually and within a couple years. No one has a crystal ball. It either happens or doesn't this Summer or the passing of time ensures it will.

If we added Dwight Howard to the roster, how does the opponent score on us?

It's only been three years! People need to relax and enjoy this. We've gone from being at the bottom of the league to sixth best or top ten at least. The Brooklyn Nets did crumble and continue to crumble.

Maybe Zizac is not draft and stash and he can be the fourth big. Sure, we need Olynyk to take the next step. We need one more move for bigs. One move!

I place the bar for next season at 50+ wins and to win a playoff series or two.

It's gonna be fun. Will Smart shoot better? What about his point guard skills? Can he handle that for ten minutes a game? Or will Rozier make it into the rotation?

With Turner probably now gone, someone like Olynyk will have to assert himself playing some point-center or Rozier has to get it done. Or Smart will be the one. Isaiah can't play the whole game.

That is a better problem than if Ainge had drafted Dunn and there'd be too much of a logjam.

Patience is needed.

Appreciating what you have is needed.

It took Danny and Brad only a year and a half to turn the Celtics into a playoff team. Think about that!

Maybe some Celtics fans should find a different sport to follow.

They are obviously creating ulcers and not having much fun.

The guys getting drafted are usually around 19. Marcus Smart played his rookie year and so will Brown. We just added another core player for the next ten to fifteen years.

Can Jaylen and Jae play together? That would help. But that is not a problem for next year. It will only be an issue years later if they are both very good yet redundant.

While others are whining and crying, I will continue to enjoy the green kool-aid. The Celtics glass is three quarters full. The light at the end of the tunnel has entered the picture. We are one center away from winning it all or being right there. We didn't have to gut the team to get one superstar. I don't think Danny is done. I wasn't happy with David Lee, but I think a healthy Amir is part of the current core. Amir and Olynyk is not a bad tandem for power forward/center. We need one true center so guys like them are not overwhelmed. KG turned into a true center, but Danny never filled the hole left by Perk's departure.

I am curious how our front court will end up. Everything else seems to have been solved.

I like the sound of this, nice job TP
Let's see how free agency goes, before all stomp our feet and cry.

[hpantazo]

I think there are just too many emotional over reactions from fans who had high expectations for unrealistic trades based on misinformation. If we had drafted Dunn, and the Sixers and Bulls refused to put together a good trade offer, these same fans would now be clamoring over the fact that we have too many guards and we have to trade one of Dunn/Smart and the league knows this so we're screwed.

IF the Bulls or Sixers were serious enough to get Dunn, they would have done so with the Suns or Wolves after us. They didn't manage to make a trade with 3 different teams that could have gotten them Dunn, so it is very apparent that they were not making good offers and what was reported was inaccurate.

TP  If the Sixer's offer was so good why didn't the Suns or Minneapolis take it?

Exactly. I address this question to ShAQATTACK and CoachBo and everyone who insists Ainge passed on a great deal last night.

A) Minnesota is already stuffed with bigs (one of which has HOF potential), so it makes absolutely no sense that they would trade with Philly. They also extremely loved Dunn and had a need for him, so Minny would make no sense taking that deal. It's called context.

B) The Suns obviously viewed Bender and Chriss as better, higher-ceiling prospects than Noel and Okafor, which are reasonable arguments. They also already have Chandler, who does essentially the same thing as Noel just not as athletically or good anymore due to him losing his athleticism.

So, no, just posting these two teams as evidence that it wasn't a good trade doesn't work when you take their context into consideration.

It is strong evidence, I disagree. If the Bulls offer with Butler was so good, the Wolves would have jumped at it. Having bigs has nothing to do with Butler. They would LOVE to take Butler to add to Towns and Wiggins. 

If Noel and Okafor are supposed to be so good, the Wolves would have jumped at the chance to take one of them. Dieng is no all-star. They also have a borderline all-star PG in Rubio.

As for the Suns, the majority of people here who are angry at Ainge for not trading the #3 pick are also the same people who absolutely hate Bender and don't think much of Chriss, so I as again, if the Sixers and Bulls offers were so good, why did the Suns prefer to take Bender over 'sure-fire all-stars'?

[Eja117]

Speaking of laughable....this idea that smart guys can't make dumb mistakes....and regular Joes can't recognize that and call it out....yeah. That's pretty laughable.

Celtics fans. We're all just too dumb and misinformed to understand the genius that is always our NBA front office.

I get that there are some people that feel there are some fans that will always be negative no matter what, but the fans that will always be positive no matter what are no better and just as insufferable and it's embarrassing.

And it's a double standard. If you point out mistakes later on you're Monday morning quarterbacking. If you point it out when it happens you're just negative for no reason.

I love cheerleaders. They have their place in the world. But after a while you have to put down the pom poms.

[Fred Roberts]

Gotta say I concur 100% with the sentiment that the fan base is incredibly whiny. Incredibly whiny. What I disagree with, is that we are a true contender by adding Dwight Howard. He'd help, but how much I'm not sure.

I'm okay with building from within, rather than chasing the quick fix.

Frankly, I don't know if we match the 48 wins from last season. We overachieved, big time. Everybody thinks it's like we have the Big 3 at the tail end of their primes and it's WIN now at all costs.

Guess what? NOT even CLOSE!!

We are a scrappy bunch of tweener pieces, that with our coaching staff, add up to a nice little team. There's tons to like and lots to work with but we could go down or up based on moves, other teams improving and how we build this out.

[fubar089]

Well said OP. TP.

[SCeltic34]

You'll find this kind of complaining among all fanbases of major sports teams.  Just ignore them or laugh at their knee-jerk reactions.  Some of the negative responses are actually pretty comical, even if they can be over the top and annoying at times.

In general, people need to remember that the outspoken opinions of a few don't represent the viewpoints of the regular users of C's blog as a whole.  Oftentimes posters here will group the blog together, making generalized statements like "people here think Ainge is a draft savant" and proceed to post negative remarks in a condescending tone. 

This is a great blog with many, many knowledgeable fans.  There are other sports boards where practically every topic degenerates into flamewars and insults without meaningful discussion.  Don't let the complaining on C's blog detract you from the fact that this is overall a well-moderated and great sports forum.

TP for the laugh.

Not to sound like a pretentious prick, but from the point of view from someone who has been around since 2004 or so, the  couple of successful years we had between 2008 and 2010 did result in a non-negligible influx of pink-hatter kids.

The older folks were mostly die-hards and/or masochists who enjoyed rooting for the laundry of a perennial 30-win team. I'm glad that a good amount of them are still around, but the population certainly got somewhat watered down.

Understandable - I can somewhat sense this even though I've only been around since 2012 (wasn't aware of this blog before then).  Can't say I'm a fan of people who post one or two-liners simply for the sake of complaining or refuting someone elses' stance without offering counterarguments.