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Author Topic: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?  (Read 19379 times)

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Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« on: January 12, 2016, 11:25:02 PM »

Offline obnoxiousmime

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We've all heard the report that before targeting the 9th pick, Ainge wanted to deal into the fourth pick to draft Winslow only to be rebuffed. However, it seems like from early returns Porzingis is going to be a better player and would also fill a greater need for the Celtics. Even if Winslow ends up being a very good player, it would seem that Porzingis being so uniquely skilled for a 7-footer would still make him more valuable than just a very good wing guy who isn't on that LeBron James-ian level.

I just really hope if a similar situation comes up in the future Ainge does not have any bias against the European player and that he doesn't play it safe and take someone with a lower ceiling but higher floor.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2016, 11:28:59 PM »

Offline alldaboston

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It bothers me but honestly I wouldn't be surprised, given the type of players Danny seems to like: "scrappy, hard-nosed, tough, work ethic, heart, etc". Not guys with talent or skill.
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Quote from: Beat LA on July 03, 2016, 02:47:34 AM
I could very well see the Hawks... starting Taurean Prince at the 3, who is already better than Crowder, imo.

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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2016, 11:29:50 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Assuming it's true, yeah, it does kind of point to where Ainge's strengths and weaknesses are as a talent evaluator. 

I think he's really good at picking out guys who will compete and contribute to winning in the NBA.  I'm not sure how good he is at identifying players that have the potential to carry a team, though.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2016, 11:34:03 PM »

Offline max215

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No one expected the Zinger to be this good this quickly, but if true, these rumors certainly don't inspire confidence in Danny's ability to evaluate talent.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2016, 11:34:40 PM »

Offline ssspence

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It certainly does. As I've started repeatedly, international scouting has clearly been a major weakness for this front office.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2016, 11:36:53 PM »

Offline alldaboston

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He's a great "role-player" drafter, it seems. But as far as selecting franchise altering talent, ..... Not so sure. That's why I'm somewhat scared of who Danny will pick with the nets pick. Hope he actually selects the guy with talent, not the guy with "scrappy" play but lack of talent.
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Quote from: Beat LA on July 03, 2016, 02:47:34 AM
I could very well see the Hawks... starting Taurean Prince at the 3, who is already better than Crowder, imo.

you vs. the guy she tells you not to worry about
Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2016, 11:42:43 PM »

Offline max215

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Quote from: alldaboston on January 12, 2016, 11:36:53 PM
He's a great "role-player" drafter, it seems. But as far as selecting franchise altering talent, ..... Not so sure. That's why I'm somewhat scared of who Danny will pick with the nets pick. Hope he actually selects the guy with talent, not the guy with "scrappy" play but lack of talent.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Danny has never had a top 3 pick at his disposal, right? Was Green at #5 his earliest pick? We don't really know how good he is at finding superstar talent early in the draft.
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Isaiah, you were lightning in a bottle.

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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2016, 11:47:20 PM »

Offline alldaboston

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Quote from: max215 on January 12, 2016, 11:42:43 PM
Quote from: alldaboston on January 12, 2016, 11:36:53 PM
He's a great "role-player" drafter, it seems. But as far as selecting franchise altering talent, ..... Not so sure. That's why I'm somewhat scared of who Danny will pick with the nets pick. Hope he actually selects the guy with talent, not the guy with "scrappy" play but lack of talent.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Danny has never had a top 3 pick at his disposal, right? Was Green at #5 his earliest pick? We don't really know how good he is at finding superstar talent early in the draft.

I think your right, but I also think that if this rumor is to be believed, then it gives an idea of his capabilities as a drafter of superstar talent. Now, I don't watch heat games, so I don't know how Winslow is playing, but just looking at stats it doesn't seem overly impressive. But at the same time, a lot of people expected porzinGOAT to take a few years to develop, and Winslow was coming off s great ncaa tourney, so that may have swayed Danny's though process.
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Quote from: Beat LA on July 03, 2016, 02:47:34 AM
I could very well see the Hawks... starting Taurean Prince at the 3, who is already better than Crowder, imo.

you vs. the guy she tells you not to worry about
Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2016, 11:55:57 PM »

Offline max215

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Quote from: alldaboston on January 12, 2016, 11:47:20 PM
Quote from: max215 on January 12, 2016, 11:42:43 PM
Quote from: alldaboston on January 12, 2016, 11:36:53 PM
He's a great "role-player" drafter, it seems. But as far as selecting franchise altering talent, ..... Not so sure. That's why I'm somewhat scared of who Danny will pick with the nets pick. Hope he actually selects the guy with talent, not the guy with "scrappy" play but lack of talent.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Danny has never had a top 3 pick at his disposal, right? Was Green at #5 his earliest pick? We don't really know how good he is at finding superstar talent early in the draft.

I think your right, but I also think that if this rumor is to be believed, then it gives an idea of his capabilities as a drafter of superstar talent. Now, I don't watch heat games, so I don't know how Winslow is playing, but just looking at stats it doesn't seem overly impressive. But at the same time, a lot of people expected porzinGOAT to take a few years to develop, and Winslow was coming off s great ncaa tourney, so that may have swayed Danny's though process.

Heat fans adore Winslow. Think of him as a wing version of Marcus Smart. His numbers aren't flashy, but he's a legitimate NBA player.
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Isaiah, you were lightning in a bottle.

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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2016, 12:01:22 AM »

Offline obnoxiousmime

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Yeah, the 5th pick in 2007 was the earliest he ever had and he correctly chose Ray Allen over Jeff Green even though at the time he (and Doc) claimed to like Green a lot. He seemed to confirm this when he traded for Green and re-signed him only to find out Green isn't even good enough to be a third option on a good team.

All we really have to go on are rumors, like when he tried to deal Pierce for the third pick to draft Chris Paul. That would have been a good pick and fair value for Pierce.

There's also the rumor that Ainge liked Durant over Oden. That's a case where taking the "safer" guy over the upside guy made sense.

There was also that rumored fascination with Robert Swift who would have been a total disaster if we had gotten him.

Anybody else remember any Ainge draft rumors? Did we ever get the full story on whether Ainge really liked Austin Rivers or was it just he and Doc trying to help Austin get his stock up? That would have also been a disaster.





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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2016, 12:04:45 AM »

Offline HomerSapien

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Wasn't he also supposedly big on Yi Jianlan?
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2016, 12:05:20 AM »

Offline saltlover

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It doesn't bother me because:

1) The rumor about Winslow over Porzingis is a rumor -- it's also been told that he was going to take Porzingis with 4.

2) Heading into the 2014 draft, Ainge was supposedly very interested in taking Porzingis before he withdrew.

3) Winslow is a very good player, and the Celtics would be a better team if they had him.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2016, 12:23:06 AM »

Offline ManUp

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No, hindsight is 20/20 Porzingis was a risky pick in the top 5.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2016, 12:38:44 AM »

Offline oldtype

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Not a lot of people are actually "good" at drafting superstar talent, because it's so rare. It would be like being "good" at winning the lottery.
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Re: Does it bother anybody that Ainge apparently wanted Winslow over Porzingis?
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2016, 12:43:08 AM »

Offline chambers

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We don't know who he was trying to move up and get originally.
There were reports of Okafur and Porzingis being targets.
Winslow was the obvious target when he started falling past #6, and Ainge must have felt that he was incredible value (or a top 3 pick in most other drafts).

The thing is, Winslow is playing bench minutes behind some pretty good veteran NBA players in Miami and he's doing well.
Once Wade and Deng are gone, it's going to be Winslow and Dragic carrying Chris Bosh off to the glue factory in 3 years time.

Winslow has already shown all NBA defensive ability and great versatility.
It's simply too early to say what draft moves were good/bad when they're reaching the half way point in their rookie years.

Winslow could look like a ROY candidate if he got starters minutes on a weaker team like Kristaps.
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