I somewhat feel bad for Danny.  I think he's an amazing GM.  One of the best in the league.  And he's had some dumb luck.  Nobody would have predicted that removing Jeff Green and Rajon Rondo from a 26 win team would somehow result in 40 wins and an accidental playoff berth.    Missing out on the Wiggins/Parker/Embiid draft was a bad beat.   There have been a few years of blown opportunities... him trying to trade Ray only to have the deal fall apart last minute.  David West agreeing to sign here only to bail last second.   Our futile attempts to move middling assets for Kevin Love.  Our futile attempt to move up in the draft last year to select Embiid.  Our futile attempts to move up in the draft this year.   It's been rough and probably very frustrating.  Despite this, he's pulled off some great moves... getting good value out of KG and Paul's in their final days.  Getting some meh assets out of impending free agents Rondo and Green.    He typically drafts guys who outperform their draft slot.   But now he's sitting on a hill of beans and he's not surprisingly having trouble selling the beans for a golden goose.   

I still have faith that we'll be a player in free agency.  I think our front office, org, city, history, coach, etc will make us a real player.  I'm glad he's in charge.  Maybe I'm still in denial, but I'm glad Danny is running this team.   Moving into the Top 10 never seemed feasible... if it was going to take a major overpay, he was probably smart to pass on it.  Keep collecting those middling assets and hopefully he'll eventually be able to move some for an impact player.

Good GM in a bad situation I guess.

It's an ok situation.  We just haven't lucked into any franchise talent.  We just have lots and lots of mediocre assets.  We're still in position to eventually pull something off hopefully.

I somewhat feel bad for Danny.  I think he's an amazing GM.  One of the best in the league.  And he's had some dumb luck.  Nobody would have predicted that removing Jeff Green and Rajon Rondo from a 26 win team would somehow result in 40 wins and an accidental playoff berth.    Missing out on the Wiggins/Parker/Embiid draft was a bad beat.   There have been a few years of blown opportunities... him trying to trade Ray only to have the deal fall apart last minute.  David West agreeing to sign here only to bail last second.   Our futile attempts to move middling assets for Kevin Love.  Our futile attempt to move up in the draft last year to select Embiid.  Our futile attempts to move up in the draft this year.   It's been rough and probably very frustrating.  Despite this, he's pulled off some great moves... getting good value out of KG and Paul's in their final days.  Getting some meh assets out of impending free agents Rondo and Green.    He typically drafts guys who outperform their draft slot.   But now he's sitting on a hill of beans and he's not surprisingly having trouble selling the beans for a golden goose.   

I still have faith that we'll be a player in free agency.  I think our front office, org, city, history, coach, etc will make us a real player.  I'm glad he's in charge.  Maybe I'm still in denial, but I'm glad Danny is running this team.   Moving into the Top 10 never seemed feasible... if it was going to take a major overpay, he was probably smart to pass on it.  Keep collecting those middling assets and hopefully he'll eventually be able to move some for an impact player.

On the other hand, he lucked into Allen/Garnett/Pierce. If we're going to excuse him for bad luck, we shouldn't then praise him for good luck.

So, take away the fortune of Garnett/Allen, and what's Ainge then?  Whatever your answer might be, that's how he needs to be evaluated, IMO. 

Btw, Ainge looks spent.  You can tell he's disappointed.  I feel for the guy... but you can't give up assets just to give them up.  If the price was something like Sully + #16 + #28 for #9?... would it have been worth it?  I mean... Winslow might haunt us, but trading Sully might haunt us as well.  You never know.   If there was a good deal available, Ainge would have taken it.  He knows what he's doing. 

Quote from: LarBrd33 on June 26, 2015, 01:09:39 AM

I somewhat feel bad for Danny.  I think he's an amazing GM.  One of the best in the league.  And he's had some dumb luck.  Nobody would have predicted that removing Jeff Green and Rajon Rondo from a 26 win team would somehow result in 40 wins and an accidental playoff berth.    Missing out on the Wiggins/Parker/Embiid draft was a bad beat.   There have been a few years of blown opportunities... him trying to trade Ray only to have the deal fall apart last minute.  David West agreeing to sign here only to bail last second.   Our futile attempts to move middling assets for Kevin Love.  Our futile attempt to move up in the draft last year to select Embiid.  Our futile attempts to move up in the draft this year.   It's been rough and probably very frustrating.  Despite this, he's pulled off some great moves... getting good value out of KG and Paul's in their final days.  Getting some meh assets out of impending free agents Rondo and Green.    He typically drafts guys who outperform their draft slot.   But now he's sitting on a hill of beans and he's not surprisingly having trouble selling the beans for a golden goose.   

I still have faith that we'll be a player in free agency.  I think our front office, org, city, history, coach, etc will make us a real player.  I'm glad he's in charge.  Maybe I'm still in denial, but I'm glad Danny is running this team.   Moving into the Top 10 never seemed feasible... if it was going to take a major overpay, he was probably smart to pass on it.  Keep collecting those middling assets and hopefully he'll eventually be able to move some for an impact player.

On the other hand, he lucked into Allen/Garnett/Pierce. If we're going to excuse him for bad luck, we shouldn't then praise him for good luck.

So, take away the fortune of Garnett/Allen, and what's Ainge then?  Whatever your answer might be, that's how he needs to be evaluated, IMO.

TPs for days. I'll go back on the soapbox I was on that he was handed KG and the rest fell into place. I got on board with the rebuild and believed he did a nice job collecting very solid role players (Crowder and IT). But he has a lot to prove, and draft-wise, he hasn't done it. Point to anyone drafting during the Big 3 era (Rondo, Perk) and I'll just argue they were a product of the environment (they're also my 2 favorite Cs during our run). I would give him one more year, 2 max, to figure things out. Nothing else he has done is worth crap imo.

Quote from: tarheelsxxiii on June 26, 2015, 01:26:02 AM

Quote from: Scintan on June 26, 2015, 01:16:42 AM

Quote from: LarBrd33 on June 26, 2015, 01:09:39 AM

I somewhat feel bad for Danny.  I think he's an amazing GM.  One of the best in the league.  And he's had some dumb luck.  Nobody would have predicted that removing Jeff Green and Rajon Rondo from a 26 win team would somehow result in 40 wins and an accidental playoff berth.    Missing out on the Wiggins/Parker/Embiid draft was a bad beat.   There have been a few years of blown opportunities... him trying to trade Ray only to have the deal fall apart last minute.  David West agreeing to sign here only to bail last second.   Our futile attempts to move middling assets for Kevin Love.  Our futile attempt to move up in the draft last year to select Embiid.  Our futile attempts to move up in the draft this year.   It's been rough and probably very frustrating.  Despite this, he's pulled off some great moves... getting good value out of KG and Paul's in their final days.  Getting some meh assets out of impending free agents Rondo and Green.    He typically drafts guys who outperform their draft slot.   But now he's sitting on a hill of beans and he's not surprisingly having trouble selling the beans for a golden goose.   

I still have faith that we'll be a player in free agency.  I think our front office, org, city, history, coach, etc will make us a real player.  I'm glad he's in charge.  Maybe I'm still in denial, but I'm glad Danny is running this team.   Moving into the Top 10 never seemed feasible... if it was going to take a major overpay, he was probably smart to pass on it.  Keep collecting those middling assets and hopefully he'll eventually be able to move some for an impact player.

On the other hand, he lucked into Allen/Garnett/Pierce. If we're going to excuse him for bad luck, we shouldn't then praise him for good luck.

So, take away the fortune of Garnett/Allen, and what's Ainge then?  Whatever your answer might be, that's how he needs to be evaluated, IMO.

TPs for days. I'll go back on the soapbox I was on that he was handed KG and the rest fell into place. I got on board with the rebuild and believed he did a nice job collecting very solid role players (Crowder and IT). But he has a lot to prove, and draft-wise, he hasn't done it. Point to anyone drafting during the Big 3 era (Rondo, Perk) and I'll just argue they were a product of the environment (they're also my 2 favorite Cs during our run). I would give him one more year, 2 max, to figure things out. Nothing else he has done is worth crap imo.

Does it count as good luck when most of the fan base and media ripped him for adding ankle-challenged Ray Allen and giving up on everyone's beloved Al Jefferson?

No. That's a silly comment re: Allen (who literally won Miami as chip), and Jefferson is... what? A good 1-way player that we have 6 of at 1 position, now? Crazy we could part ways with him in hindsight, right?

Quote from: tarheelsxxiii on June 26, 2015, 01:26:02 AM

Quote from: Scintan on June 26, 2015, 01:16:42 AM

Quote from: LarBrd33 on June 26, 2015, 01:09:39 AM

I somewhat feel bad for Danny.  I think he's an amazing GM.  One of the best in the league.  And he's had some dumb luck.  Nobody would have predicted that removing Jeff Green and Rajon Rondo from a 26 win team would somehow result in 40 wins and an accidental playoff berth.    Missing out on the Wiggins/Parker/Embiid draft was a bad beat.   There have been a few years of blown opportunities... him trying to trade Ray only to have the deal fall apart last minute.  David West agreeing to sign here only to bail last second.   Our futile attempts to move middling assets for Kevin Love.  Our futile attempt to move up in the draft last year to select Embiid.  Our futile attempts to move up in the draft this year.   It's been rough and probably very frustrating.  Despite this, he's pulled off some great moves... getting good value out of KG and Paul's in their final days.  Getting some meh assets out of impending free agents Rondo and Green.    He typically drafts guys who outperform their draft slot.   But now he's sitting on a hill of beans and he's not surprisingly having trouble selling the beans for a golden goose.   

I still have faith that we'll be a player in free agency.  I think our front office, org, city, history, coach, etc will make us a real player.  I'm glad he's in charge.  Maybe I'm still in denial, but I'm glad Danny is running this team.   Moving into the Top 10 never seemed feasible... if it was going to take a major overpay, he was probably smart to pass on it.  Keep collecting those middling assets and hopefully he'll eventually be able to move some for an impact player.

On the other hand, he lucked into Allen/Garnett/Pierce. If we're going to excuse him for bad luck, we shouldn't then praise him for good luck.

So, take away the fortune of Garnett/Allen, and what's Ainge then?  Whatever your answer might be, that's how he needs to be evaluated, IMO.

TPs for days. I'll go back on the soapbox I was on that he was handed KG and the rest fell into place. I got on board with the rebuild and believed he did a nice job collecting very solid role players (Crowder and IT). But he has a lot to prove, and draft-wise, he hasn't done it. Point to anyone drafting during the Big 3 era (Rondo, Perk) and I'll just argue they were a product of the environment (they're also my 2 favorite Cs during our run). I would give him one more year, 2 max, to figure things out. Nothing else he has done is worth crap imo.

Does it count as good luck when most of the fan base and media ripped him for adding ankle-challenged Ray Allen and giving up on everyone's beloved Al Jefferson?

Yes.