Marcus Smart's "ejection"

[TwinTower14]

Absolutely horrible. There's no way to prove intent on something like that. I fully expect the NBA to review that and downgrade it. Just ridiculous.

The flagrant foul rule says nothing about intent.  Unnecessary contact is a flagrant-1.  Unnecessary and excessive contact is a flagrant-2.  It was clearly unnecessary contact.   Because the elbow struck the head, I think they'll leave it at a flagrant-2. 

http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_b.html

Unnecessary contact can really describe any foul, you realize.  But intent is typically used as a way to separate unnecessary and excessive from common fouls.  Unnecessary and excessive is Harden kicking James while on the floor after the play is dead.  (Mind you, that wasn't called a flagrant 2 in game).  It was very aggressive defense and a player who was trying to fend off and create space.  The defender leaned his head into the ballhandler as he was beginning to extend his arm to create space while transferring the ball to his other hand to lay the ball up.  Quite simply, that was a basketball play, and this occurred in a split second while a player was going up for a shot.  If Smart punched him in the face and then shot it, sure, that's flagrant.  This was contact that occurred in the context of the play.  It was not excessive or unnecessary any more than your common offensive foul for charging or clearing out.

Maybe you think that's how the rule must be interpreted, but it certainly isn't at this point.

Also, the defender didn't "lean in" anywhere. Payton was, in fact, trying to avoid giving up a three-point play, which was the main reason Smart had to go for the awkward, ill-advised elbow swing to the face. This is neither common nor really a basketball play. And the decision on whether it will stay Flagrant 2 will hinge or whether they will find it relevant that little contact was actually made with Payton's head. I wouldn't hold my breath up, targeting players' head is not exactly something the league considers lightly.

I love Marcus Smart and defend him to the high hills on most cases but he clearly through his elbow into his face, thought it was the right call....

[apc]

I think it is pretty obvious he did it intentianally. He maybe didn´t want to hit Payton in the face, but the elbow is clearly moving out.

Agree, I think he was using his elbow trying to create space. The elbow was a little high and hit the face instead of chest.

 

[fairweatherfan]

I had checked out of the game for dinner but looking at the replay it looks like Smart is trying to use his off arm to create space, but Payton simultaneously swiping at the ball leads to the elbow coming up into the chin, instead of into the upper chest, which is a common move in that situation. 

I don't think he meant to hit him in the face, but that's the risk you take when you jab an elbow out at someone.  Wouldn't surprise me if it's downgraded to a Flagrant 1 though.

[SHAQATTACK]

Usually the elbowee gets irate if it was undeserved....He didn't seem like he thought it was on purpose from Smart .......I personally think Payton earned it..

It's a physical game .  I think the players know whether or not something was especially dirty or just hard playing.

Andrew Bynum was a dirty player 100 % . 

Payton had been doing some mouthing and hacking on players .......I figured he had pay back coming.

[Rosco917]

I don't feel Smart did anything that hasn't been done to him all year long. Smart plays a brand of basketball that gets on the nerves of his opponents. He defends very hard almost every play, plus he is a starter against the NBA's best players.

Cousins was annoyed to the point of just throwing him to the floor in frustration. He is learning what is allowable from the NBA opposition he plays against. Labron simply pushed him out of the way when his defense became stifling, and no offensive foul was called, welcome to the NBA rook. I've seen him get "popped in the chops" many times from many different players he was "bothering" and not say a word, because he must understand, that's the world he plays in.

The elbow Smart used may have been questionable, and I don't want this game to turn into Hockey with a round ball, But I've also witnessed players like Tony Allen, Ron Artest, Kevin Garnett do very similar stunts, and we just shrug it off. Marcus has to be tired of receiving, and decided to give back. Shame on him.

In years to come if you add the right pieces, and build a team that plays D like Marcus does, you will win many more that you loose.
       

[TwinTower14]

I don't feel Smart did anything that hasn't been done to him all year long. Smart plays a brand of basketball that gets on the nerves of his opponents. He defends very hard almost every play, plus he is a starter against the NBA's best players.

Cousins was annoyed to the point of just throwing him to the floor in frustration. He is learning what is allowable from the NBA opposition he plays against. Labron simply pushed him out of the way when his defense became stifling, and no offensive foul was called, welcome to the NBA rook. I've seen him get "popped in the chops" many times from many different players he was "bothering" and not say a word, because he must understand, that's the world he plays in.

The elbow Smart used may have been questionable, and I don't want this game to turn into Hockey with a round ball, But I've also witnessed players like Tony Allen, Ron Artest, Kevin Garnett do very similar stunts, and we just shrug it off. Marcus has to be tired of receiving, and decided to give back. Shame on him.

In years to come if you add the right pieces, and build a team that plays D like Marcus does, you will win many more that you loose.
     

I agree with you about the brand of basketball that Smart plays.  Wait until Smart gets into a long series with a team during the playoffs.  He will draw some frustration fouls from his opponent.  Let's just hope it's not Wade, because he likes to dislocate elbows...

[The One]

Very dangerous...that could have caused a concussion...or worse.

[D.o.s.]

I don't feel Smart did anything that hasn't been done to him all year long. Smart plays a brand of basketball that gets on the nerves of his opponents. He defends very hard almost every play, plus he is a starter against the NBA's best players.

Cousins was annoyed to the point of just throwing him to the floor in frustration. He is learning what is allowable from the NBA opposition he plays against. Labron simply pushed him out of the way when his defense became stifling, and no offensive foul was called, welcome to the NBA rook. I've seen him get "popped in the chops" many times from many different players he was "bothering" and not say a word, because he must understand, that's the world he plays in.

The elbow Smart used may have been questionable, and I don't want this game to turn into Hockey with a round ball, But I've also witnessed players like Tony Allen, Ron Artest, Kevin Garnett do very similar stunts, and we just shrug it off. Marcus has to be tired of receiving, and decided to give back. Shame on him.

In years to come if you add the right pieces, and build a team that plays D like Marcus does, you will win many more that you loose.
     

The problem isn't with the elbow, necessarily. The problem is with the decision making that lead to the elbow, and the ability to pull it off.

Going for the contact to draw the foul is good. This:


Is not really the way to do that.

[Chris22]

Payton initiated the contact.

Just prior Crowder was driven into the basket support with no foul called.

30 free throws for Orlando, 16 for Boston in the game.

[Atzar]

Very dangerous...that could have caused a concussion...or worse.

This.  I know we as Celtics fans want to defend Marcus Smart, but that just wasn't a good idea.  I don't think he meant to hit him in the face, but that's what happened.  Flagrant 2 was justified IMO - refs have to protect people's heads, and that's the only way they can.

Keep those elbows low, young fella.

[The One]

Payton initiated the contact.

Just prior Crowder was driven into the basket support with no foul called.

30 free throws for Orlando, 16 for Boston in the game.

IMO - doesn't justify an elbow.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Payton initiated the contact.

Just prior Crowder was driven into the basket support with no foul called.

30 free throws for Orlando, 16 for Boston in the game.

And...??

[Donoghus]

That was a legit flagrant foul.   Smart was trying to clear space for himself and threw the elbow into Peyton's head.  They HAVE to call that a flagrant.  Especially when you look at the replay.

What cares about the FT discrepancy in the game?  That has zero bearing on this call.

[sofutomygaha]

A player definitely needs to be kept off the floor after doing something like that. If the refs blew some calls before this, boo on them, but forgiving an intentional elbow to the face would have been their biggest mistake of the night.

[Celtics4ever]

Get real, I think he did it on purpose folks.   That is fine with me, too.   I love a rough guy who sends a message.   I think that Payton will think twice of getting that close to Marcus the next time.  Smart just made it too obvious.   He lowered that side of his body into him too much when he made his move and it was easy to spot.   Smart is the stronger guy and if he had extended his arm and not into him he could have easily held him off.   But he did not do that folks,  he rammed his arm into the guy's jawline.   

I have zero problems with it, the game was spiraling out of our hands anyways.   Elbows to the head is something they always take seriously and get an ejection.  If it was an elbow to the torso he might have got away with it.  He took his shot, he got caught.  Move on to the next game.

Payton initiated the contact.

And Smart finished it, and he got caught.   The mistake he made was lowering his whole body into it, it made it too obvious.  Guys who think he did nothing, do not know anything about ball or very naive.  I would guess they probably have never thrown an elbow in a game, or been in a street fight, or had martial arts or military training.