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Author Topic: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)  (Read 2291 times)

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What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« on: January 11, 2015, 03:21:06 PM »

Offline jay

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theoretically we could trade 3 starters (Sullinger, Olynyk, Bradley) and three 1sts and get a top level player. But even if we gave up that much, would it land a Kahwi Leonard or a LaMarcus Aldridge?


Is the plan to have the current core group of Sullinger, Olynyk, Zeller, Turner, Young, Smart, Bradley - develop into a group of role players and draft a top 7 player each of the next 4 years?  Starting with Smart last year, trade 3-4 picks and try to move up and get a top pick, try to get two in 2016 even, then maybe we get lucky and the Nets picks are really good in '17 and '18.

The salary situation would be really good. Sullinger and Olynyk might get Bradley size deals but we won't have any max contracts unless a player drafted turns into a star - and that would be a good thing.

So keep the core group together, try to draft a starting five over the next 2-3 years, and maybe a couple of those guys turn out to be the next big time players.

Maybe an all star player would come via sign and trade one summer, maybe 2016, and that would jumpstart the process. Winning starting in 2017 will be imperative and the fact that the Nets picks in 2017 and 2018 can get us good talent even if we win is really the cherry on top.

Stevens is obviously here for the long haul. I would like to see this group of young guys grow up together, add three studs in the next two drafts, and watch out. Ainge's plan is building toward the 2017 season and beyond. It might get ugly to watch the next 3 months but the next two offseasons are gonna be great for Celtics fans because of all the picks.

Overpaying for a Jimmy Butler or Kahwi Leonard would be nice, but I don't think it's the only way to win. Maybe that is Danny's plan all along.  Keep drafting until you get one right. Leonard and Butler weren't even Top 7 picks.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2015, 04:23:20 PM »

Offline hondobird33

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Danny is pursuing both options at the same time.  If he can get the right deal for a top player (i.e. Kevin Love) he will pull the trigger.  If not, he will continue to draft the best players available (i.e. Smart/Young). With so many draft picks it likely it will end up being a combination of both.

Due to the plethora of picks he has the ability to overpay if needed and still have excess picks to select and develop young players also keeping under the salary cap with their lower salaries.

The benefit of proven players (existing superstar) is they have shown the ability to perform on the big stage and that is what we need for banner 18!   
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2015, 04:30:41 PM »

Offline rollie mass

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i think this years draft critical ,if we land a top prospect,i mean a lock for future stardom added to smart,young ,sully ,KO. Crowder plays a part in this because for the rest of the year he and smart will set a defensive tone to bostons back court  and zeller and a resurrected turner.We need a media hype of a scrappy, unselfish team with great coach and management that has all these draft picks-maybe the illiusion  danny is creating will become a reality-build it they will come
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2015, 05:03:39 PM »

Offline Stig

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I think trading for superstar is always preferable because it's faster. But in the current situation of Celtics I think it's really hard to sign free agents or trade for individual stars for the long term: we have neither a star player nor a future star in making, and Boston is not the most attractive cities for big time players.

In my opinion the only way to add big names is to go for 2 or more of them at the same time, build for the champion will attract underachieved stars to come and if we've got 2 it will be easier to get another one. Or maybe DA can pay some under used young stud like Reggie Jackson and make this his team, then hope he works out great and go after 2 big time players the next year.

I agree you can't get a top player with a bunch of (good) role players and protected draft picks. But I think moving up draft picks is equally hard. No matter we draft those picks or move up and draft, the best situation is 50% of them works out to be good rotation players, and I would say for all the picks we have we'd be luck if one of them become an all star.

My guess is, Danny's plan is always youth + draft for stars. After all he's done that before and it brought us one champion. But at the moment he simply can't get anyone, so he has to get as many draft and young players as possible, hope some of them become attractive, and if not, he'll keep on trading them away for more draft picks. For that you can almost say he hasn't got a short term plan (not like NY, for example, is to go for 2 free agents this offseason), may be I'm just too pessimistic, but i think rebuild could be a long one.

It may be too early to say Stevens is here for the long haul, once we get a good team people will have expectation on him and if he doesn't delivery, he may have to go.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2015, 05:21:52 PM »

Offline hondobird33

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All good points.  The key is to that our top draft picks turn either into stars or are traded for stars.  The protected picks are more of a long shot but we do have the following picks that likely will be very high (i.e. lottery):

2015 - Our first round pick
2016 - Our first round pick and our BKN first round pick if they blow up team
2017 - Our first round pick that is better of ours and BKN
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #5 on: January 11, 2015, 05:25:37 PM »

Offline droopdog7

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Ten average players and draft picks do not equal a superstar.  This league is about quality, not quantity.  Our best chance of landing a superstar is through the draft and even through free agency.  We don't have what it takes to trade for one.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #6 on: January 11, 2015, 06:27:39 PM »

Offline dreamgreen

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Extremely hard at this point to say when or how we will land our next "superstar". We have young guys that can still become all-star level guys (nobody saw Jimmy Butler coming). It seems to me that Danny has decided to go young (which works for me) so getting a young star through a trade is never easy but it does happen.

I think this summer starting with the draft will be big for us.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2015, 06:49:55 PM »

Offline ekosins3

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I don't thing the whole 'we need a superstar player' thing is really a big deal.

How many superstars would we say are even in the nba right now?

I would say 4-5 superstars..Lebron, Durant, anthony davis, fill in the last two.

Where is the superstar on Memphis, Atlanta, Toronto, and some other teams. I think having 3-4 quality players with solid role players is a better approach to take than trying to find that one superstar.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2015, 07:00:54 PM »

Offline Stig

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sometime ago i put a post about players on all nba teams and if i remember correctly, my conclusion is if you are in any of the all nba teams in the last few years you can be a corner stone of a franchise.

I think those plus a few young rising stars like Bulter and Leonard are the ones we should go after. Memphis does have Gasol and Conley.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2015, 07:04:45 PM »

Offline loco_91

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It's definitely a more likely scenario than trading. With all the picks in the next few years, we can draft for upside, shrug off the busts, and land a Leonard/Butler-level player with pretty high probability.

To me, the question is: after the current trades, will we be bad enough to bottom out and draft a true franchise player should one come along? If there is an Anthony Davis-level prospect over the next few years, I hope we'll tank really hard to get him.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2015, 07:41:00 PM »

Offline jacigar

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After demolishing the structure , you need a foundation to rebuild on. I think our new base should consist of (G) Turner,Smart , Young, (F) Crowder,Olynyk,Sullinger (C) Zeller 2015 FA possibles include (C) B.Lopez (Nets),Jordan (LAC) (F/C) Monroe (DET) PF Love (Clev),SF D Green (GS) and (G) Rubio (Minn), Knight (Milw) Jackson (Okl). these players are still young enough to be part of the future. Bradley,Bass,Nelson,Thornton,Pressey and Wallace should be traded or released. Draft possibles include in 2015 (C) Okafor Turner,D.Johnson,Upshaw (F/C) Towns (SF) Winslow,S Johnson,H-Jefferson,Vezenkov (G) D Russell, T. Jones,Rojier,Van Fleet After this years retool we re-assess and start again for 2016. With our current 6 round 1 and 8 round 2 picks we are in a great position to compete in 2016/2017 have patience Rome wasn't built in a day/week/year
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2015, 08:17:17 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Quote
theoretically we could trade 3 starters (Sullinger, Olynyk, Bradley) and three 1sts and get a top level player

I fell out of my chair laughing on this comment.  These three each could probably get a second round pick.    I don't think that GMs will play ball with Ainge this time.  The picks would have to be high to move Sullinger as the other team would be doing us a favor.   Bradley is over rated and sometimes over paid.  I think KO could be a bench big in the future for us but I do not see him bringing much in terms of value.
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #12 on: January 11, 2015, 08:24:47 PM »

Offline Rosco917

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It only takes one player that is considered high quality, a star player, to sign with the Celtics, just one and that will draw another. As long as you have the cap space and the desire.

It's DA's job to make sure the team is ready for these star grade players. He has to have a solid roster with up and coming young, hungry, players just approaching their prime. The Celtics need to have a reputation of being a hard, physical team to get a win over.

Granted Boston isn't a desirable city that is coveted by NBA stars, its up to Danny and the educated Celtic fan base to draw them in.   
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2015, 11:42:32 AM »

Offline MSceltic

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We will have to build another way besides the draft in my opinion, We have way too many picks in the next three years to realistically take half of those on rookie deals, they would all become FA's at the same time ha
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Re: What if we never trade for a superstar? (Build through draft)
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2015, 03:47:21 PM »

Offline spikelovetheCelts

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Quote from: Stig on January 11, 2015, 07:00:54 PM
sometime ago i put a post about players on all nba teams and if i remember correctly, my conclusion is if you are in any of the all nba teams in the last few years you can be a corner stone of a franchise.

I think those plus a few young rising stars like Bulter and Leonard are the ones we should go after. Memphis does have Gasol and Conley.
None of these players were top 5 picks. It can be done through the draft and one FA. The Hawks have just Al. If we get one of this years bigs coming out and all our other players mature we should be fine. Teague was thought to be a bust and he is killing at Atl because they gave him playing time. Brad . Smart, Sully and AB alll were top 5 recruits in High School they are all getting better. AB's And Sully stroke are getting sweeter each game. KO will make a great 6 man. Turner was freshman of the Year. We have talent. Young can fill it from Ptown.
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"People look at players, watch them dribble between their legs and they say, 'There's a superstar.'  Well John Havlicek is a superstar, and most of the others are figments of writers' imagination."
--Jerry West, on John Havlicek
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