Looks like Tommy can't take it anymore

[Sixth Man]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

  Last year we were 17th in pace, right now we're 3rd. What makes you think he's not pushing the pace?

'...pace' is defined as "consistent and continuous speed."  How is this word defined as you are utilizing it here?  Just curious...

  As the basketball stat. There are plenty of websites you could go to if you want to learn it's meaning in that context.

Why would I do that when I can come here and ask you, the Ultimate Authority on everything under the sun ? 

[BballTim]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

  Last year we were 17th in pace, right now we're 3rd. What makes you think he's not pushing the pace?

He is not pushing the pace when he needs to push it. I rather him slow down the pace for the first three quarters , then go buckwild in the 4th.

In the 4th is where we are losing games after games.  Teams are playing "nitpick" , "iso" ball against us. Instead of giving them a chance to execute their strategy , we need to push the pace and have them chase us . On the defensive end press their ball handler, kill time and make it hard  for them to set up.

  We're not getting any stops in the 4th quarter. That impacts whether we're able to go "buckwild". Watch for that in the next game. Look at where the defense is when we get a defensive rebound. Then look at the defense after we inbound the ball after a made basket. One of those times you have a good shot at a transition basket, the other time we're generally 3 on 45 in the frontcourt by the time Rondo could start a break. All you're talking about is how quickly he runs up court while the defense is set and waiting for him.

  If you do want to run on made baskets, the first thing that needs to happen is that someone needs to grab the ball and inbound it as quickly as possible, before the defense has a chance to get back. Also watch to see if that happens, it doesn't.

They used to do it, watch the preseason games
And once they know Rondo is going to walk it up afterall they don't bother to do it anymore
that's how Rondo kills our pace

  Yes, because as far as you know whatever the Celts do in the preseason always carries over into the regular season.

[BballTim]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

  Last year we were 17th in pace, right now we're 3rd. What makes you think he's not pushing the pace?

'...pace' is defined as "consistent and continuous speed."  How is this word defined as you are utilizing it here?  Just curious...

  As the basketball stat. There are plenty of websites you could go to if you want to learn it's meaning in that context.

Why would I do that when I can come here and ask you, the Ultimate Authority on everything under the sun ? 

  I dunno, why actually figure out what you're discussing when you can just make uninformed comments and follow them with childish insults? That's for you to decide.

[BballTim]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

  Last year we were 17th in pace, right now we're 3rd. What makes you think he's not pushing the pace?

He is not pushing the pace when he needs to push it. I rather him slow down the pace for the first three quarters , then go buckwild in the 4th.

In the 4th is where we are losing games after games.  Teams are playing "nitpick" , "iso" ball against us. Instead of giving them a chance to execute their strategy , we need to push the pace and have them chase us . On the defensive end press their ball handler, kill time and make it hard  for them to set up.

  We're not getting any stops in the 4th quarter. That impacts whether we're able to go "buckwild". Watch for that in the next game. Look at where the defense is when we get a defensive rebound. Then look at the defense after we inbound the ball after a made basket. One of those times you have a good shot at a transition basket, the other time we're generally 3 on 45 in the frontcourt by the time Rondo could start a break. All you're talking about is how quickly he runs up court while the defense is set and waiting for him.

  If you do want to run on made baskets, the first thing that needs to happen is that someone needs to grab the ball and inbound it as quickly as possible, before the defense has a chance to get back. Also watch to see if that happens, it doesn't.

They used to do it, watch the preseason games
And once they know Rondo is going to walk it up afterall they don't bother to do it anymore
that's how Rondo kills our pace

According to basketball reference the on/off pace of Rondo is: 98.2 on vs. 95.6 off for a + 2.6 difference (the third highest on the team, the other two being G. Wallace and Powell, i.e. players who haven't played enough for their stats to have any real bearing). Marcus Smart is at -3 by the by.
So, what do the Rondo kills pace people have to say to that?

You watch the game, not the data, the data can be misleading
Tommy watched the game and he saw it

  Watching the game can be fairly misleading as well. You see Rondo walk the ball up some of the time and don't notice that he usually doesn't, that the team sometimes walks the ball up with Rondo on the bench or that the other teams frequently walk the ball up. What exactly is misleading about "we play at a faster pace with Rondo in the game than when he's on the bench"? We do, in spite of the claims of people who don't like Rondo, and it's fairly evident if you pay attention to the games.

[mmmmm]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

No offense, I love Tommy, but he is an old man. An old man with set in stone convictions and greener eyed glasses than anyone on earth. Why all of a sudden you put the utmost stock in the color commentator, and find any disagreeing with him (WHEN THAT ISN"T EVEN WHAT HAPPENED---READ THE ARTICLE), to be the greatest offense known to man....well....that says a lot more about you and your own biases. Give me a break. You are a broken record. And the tune you played to begin with wasn't good.

You fool, do you know how many rings he has won? As a player and a coach combined? Plus also advising for the team in the 80s that won a couple of more rings. I think he knows a little bit about the game

He is not only a color commentator.

Oh, jesus. Don't be so dense. I love Tommy. Said it above, will say it again. That was obviously playful commentary on someone who is known as the biggest homer in sports, who isn't coaching the team, who isn't in meetings, etc AND WHO RONDO SAID HE LISTENED TO. Did you read the article, or just the misreading of the OP?
You come across as way worse as looking for confirmation bias than people who have actually read the article in question and saw that it didn't say anything the OP took it to say AND who have repeatedly shown that pace is certainly not the issue here.
TOmmy and Rondo was two smart basketball guys chatting about how to improve the team. Rondo said it is harder to push the ball after a made basket.....a well known propostion in todays NBA.
You found another thread to perpetuate your hobbyhorse in.
That seems to be the whole story.
This thread has been fun for a guy with a few drinks in him.
You are still insane.

Yes Rondo is not deaf so he surely listened the words, but he refused to accept it
and he knows the "media talks" so he surely won't say "Tommy is talking trash"
Neither did he say that Tommy was right or he will accept it nor will he make any changes, though

You know the inner workings of his mind, how?
Give me a break. All you have is your theories of how Rondo's brain is working (which any reasonable person can tell you are pure conjecture, largely shaped by your own opinions and having nothing to do with Rondo himself). You didn't even read the article in question, i presume, where he said he would relay it to his guys (in exact contradiction of what you just wrote).

So, you have your mindreading and misreading. anything else you'd like to bring to the table?

Because i will say the exactly same thing if i am Rondo if i don't buy it
If i am buying it i will just say i will take it and do it
not "take it and share to the others and figure things out"
I can't read his mind but that's what i feel in his words

Umm... I believe the psychological term for what is going on here is called, "projecting".

You are projecting what YOU might think and feel and do into the head of another.

That, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with what is actually IN the head of another.

You can call it your "opinion".  Others can call it for what it actually is.   Not real.

[D.o.s.]

I think it's a good time to point out that one of the great litmus tests for determining 'opinions' against 'facts' is how arguments evolve (or don't) in the presence of new evidence.

[Sixth Man]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

  Last year we were 17th in pace, right now we're 3rd. What makes you think he's not pushing the pace?

'...pace' is defined as "consistent and continuous speed."  How is this word defined as you are utilizing it here?  Just curious...

  As the basketball stat. There are plenty of websites you could go to if you want to learn it's meaning in that context.

Why would I do that when I can come here and ask you, the Ultimate Authority on everything under the sun ? 

  I dunno, why actually figure out what you're discussing when you can just make uninformed comments and follow them with childish insults? That's for you to decide.

You richly deserve each and every insult you receive, Tim.

[chambers]

whoah this thread has become a fire storm haha.

Can the mods or Jeff please run an IP check on the OP and see if it matches any other usernames in this thread?

In other words, it appears that someone is starting threads, then replying to them with other usernames they've created, in an attempt to give their argument/point of view some more back up.

Look at the writing style, the grammar errors, the consistent use of the same style of punctuation.

It's becoming a joke.

[Vermont Green]

I think Rondo has been pushing the ball more this year than in the past.  I think he also has been more willing to make his first pass earlier in the possession than in the past.  Both pluses and credits to Rondo.

The "problem" is simply more pronounced in the 4th quarter which is not Rondo's fault, more accurately, just an exploitation of his weaknesses as a player.  In the fourth quarter, there are more time outs, fouls seem to be called a little tighter, the opposing defenses seem to hunker down more, all contributing to a slower pace.  There are also time at the end of games where the Celtics and Rondo in particular do slow it down intentionally.  All teams just tend to this if the game is close.

The problem is that once the pace is slowed down, they can sag off Rondo, dare him to shoot, and the defense will be set making it harder for Rondo to make passes.  Our offense grinds to a halt with Rondo dribbling around trying to create something.  As I said, I don't blame Rondo for this per se, it is just what you get with Rondo based on his talents and weaknesses.

[D.o.s.]

whoah this thread has become a fire storm haha.

Can the mods or Jeff please run an IP check on the OP and see if it matches any other usernames in this thread?

In other words, it appears that someone is starting threads, then replying to them with other usernames they've created, in an attempt to give their argument/point of view some more back up.

Look at the writing style, the grammar errors, the consistent use of the same style of punctuation.

It's becoming a joke.

*looks around the room nervously*

[BballTim]

I think Rondo has been pushing the ball more this year than in the past.  I think he also has been more willing to make his first pass earlier in the possession than in the past.  Both pluses and credits to Rondo.

The "problem" is simply more pronounced in the 4th quarter which is not Rondo's fault, more accurately, just an exploitation of his weaknesses as a player.  In the fourth quarter, there are more time outs, fouls seem to be called a little tighter, the opposing defenses seem to hunker down more, all contributing to a slower pace.  There are also time at the end of games where the Celtics and Rondo in particular do slow it down intentionally.  All teams just tend to this if the game is close.

The problem is that once the pace is slowed down, they can sag off Rondo, dare him to shoot, and the defense will be set making it harder for Rondo to make passes.  Our offense grinds to a halt with Rondo dribbling around trying to create something.  As I said, I don't blame Rondo for this per se, it is just what you get with Rondo based on his talents and weaknesses.

  This really isn't the case. Rondo gets a higher percentage of his assists in the 4th quarter than players like CP, Nash or Deron (the only ones I checked).

[Tr1boy]

whoah this thread has become a fire storm haha.

Can the mods or Jeff please run an IP check on the OP and see if it matches any other usernames in this thread?

In other words, it appears that someone is starting threads, then replying to them with other usernames they've created, in an attempt to give their argument/point of view some more back up.

Look at the writing style, the grammar errors, the consistent use of the same style of punctuation.

It's becoming a joke.

Chambers you are foolish.

Not everyone thinks like you or is a Rondo fanatic.

Is that so hard to believe?

[BballTim]

Rondo is a stubborn, inflexible player.  When Tommy says something it should be considered.

Next game, Rondo still walks up with the ball in the 4th and Tommy starts going crazy again.

Tommy was not like this when the big three were here. He wasn't big on the team pushing the pace bc things worked and we were winning.  Right now , things are different. Rondo does not get it

Rondo should listen to a guy that has won more rings then he can ever dream of winning. 

Some fans here still back up Rondo vs a Legend.  really?   How many rings has he won as a player and coach combined?

Wow.  Every one of those statements seems completely divorced from reality.  Did you even actually take time to _read_ the full story?   Rondo specifically stated that he puts a LOT of weight and significance to Tommy's words and advice.   Predictably, you have come up with an interpretation that twists it into Rondo not considering it.

And if you think Tommy hasn't been yelling for the team to "push the ball" since well _before_ Rondo was even drafted you just plain have not been paying attention or watching the Celtics for very long.   He's yelled for that since as long as I can remember and he did indeed do so while the Big 3 were here.

Like i have said, so what if Rondo says he will consider the advice. He is not going to listen.  I bet 20 bucks he won't do it next game. And if he does do it, i will lose the 20 bucks GLADLY.

Tommy has been pressing now more than ever for the ball to be pushed. He stated at the end of last season that Rondo has learned bad habits. That team (big three) could slow down the pace and still win. They were getting old also. 

So its not like he is 24/7 to push the pace . He knows certain teams can't play that way. But this unit can to maximize things and minimize flaws

  Last year we were 17th in pace, right now we're 3rd. What makes you think he's not pushing the pace?

'...pace' is defined as "consistent and continuous speed."  How is this word defined as you are utilizing it here?  Just curious...

  As the basketball stat. There are plenty of websites you could go to if you want to learn it's meaning in that context.

Why would I do that when I can come here and ask you, the Ultimate Authority on everything under the sun ? 

  I dunno, why actually figure out what you're discussing when you can just make uninformed comments and follow them with childish insults? That's for you to decide.

You richly deserve each and every insult you receive, Tim.

  Yeah, I guess this is the type of banter that's available to you if you don't know enough about what we're talking about to recognize what we mean by "pace".

[BballTim]

whoah this thread has become a fire storm haha.

Can the mods or Jeff please run an IP check on the OP and see if it matches any other usernames in this thread?

In other words, it appears that someone is starting threads, then replying to them with other usernames they've created, in an attempt to give their argument/point of view some more back up.

Look at the writing style, the grammar errors, the consistent use of the same style of punctuation.

It's becoming a joke.

Chambers you are foolish.

Not everyone thinks like you or is a Rondo fanatic.

Is that so hard to believe?

  You understand Chambers isn't a "Rondo fanatic", don't you?

[Tr1boy]

whoah this thread has become a fire storm haha.

Can the mods or Jeff please run an IP check on the OP and see if it matches any other usernames in this thread?

In other words, it appears that someone is starting threads, then replying to them with other usernames they've created, in an attempt to give their argument/point of view some more back up.

Look at the writing style, the grammar errors, the consistent use of the same style of punctuation.

It's becoming a joke.

Chambers you are foolish.

Not everyone thinks like you or is a Rondo fanatic.

Is that so hard to believe?

  You understand Chambers isn't a "Rondo fanatic", don't you?

Then what is his problem? He cant accept/stomach other peoples opinions/views?