Clippers and Celtics Talking Deal

[chambers]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

Willy Green is okay and Caron is a good expiring. We really would suck and be a bottom 4 team for sure. Picks make it nicer but mehhh.

[hpantazo]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

Willy Green is okay and Caron is a good expiring. We really would suck and be a bottom 4 team for sure. Picks make it nicer but mehhh.

Yea, it's an OK trade for us, but I'd hold out for Bledsoe or at least a second 1st round pick.

[esel1000]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

Willy Green is okay and Caron is a good expiring. We really would suck and be a bottom 4 team for sure. Picks make it nicer but mehhh.

Yea, it's an OK trade for us, but I'd hold out for Bledsoe or at least a second 1st round pick.

I agree with this. Bledsoe is a really nice asset. If we can't get him, I'd rather we get another pick as compensation of some sort.

I really want this trade to happen in some form however. I really don't think we can bring Doc back after all of this. If we're going to rebuild, we need to find a coach who's willing to build up this team again.

[LarBrd33]

My thoughts on the deal.

KG (12.4 mil x 2 years)
Terry (5.2 mil x 2 years)
Lee (5.2 mil x 2 years)

= 23 mil

For:

D. Jordan (11 mil x 2 years)
Butler (8 mil expiring)
W Green (1.4 mil x  2 years)
+ late first rounder

= 20.4 mil

Then we'd presumably waive Pierce so he could join the Clippers as well... leaving 5 mil on our books.

Pros:


It's full-blown tank at that point.  Rondo probably takes his time coming back from ACL surgery.  You march out a dreadful roster of PG - Rookie (Schroeder?),  SG - Bradley, SF - J Green, PF - Bass/Sully, C - Jordan.   That team probably wins about 15 games.  With Rondo it might win 25-35.   Sets us up nicely in the 2014 draft.

You could float Butler as an expiring contract at the deadline. 

It dumps Terry and Lee's contracts.   Next year you'd only have the following left:   Rondo (13 mil), Jordan (11 mil), J Green (9.4 mil), Bass (7 mil), Bradley (3.5 mil), Sully (1.4 mil), W. Green (1.4 mil), Rookie (1.6 mil), Crawford (3.2 mil).. which is only 64.5 mil under contract.  Which means we'd be able to sign a free agent.  Lol, Jk.  We'd be over the the cap and unable to sign anyone.  Which leads me to...


Cons: 

#1 It doesn't give you cap space this year.  It doesn't give you cap space next year.

#2 Jordan is a 25 year old big man who just averaged 3 points, 6 rebounds and 1 block in the playoffs.  He's wildly overpaid.

#3 - Even if we get bledsoe, he's just a backup

#4 - The draft pick is deep in a terrible draft.  Who cares.

#5 - KG and Doc make up the entire culture of this team... if they leave, we're hitting the reset button to the dark ages again and praying to the basketball gods for andrew wiggins to save us.


...

Unless you're VERY confident that this team will be one of the 3 worst in the league next year, I don't see the point in doing this trade.  The only real benefit is dumping Terry and Lee's terrible contracts, but that's not going to give us any cap room anyways.  We'd be better off just letting KG, Pierce and Doc stick around.  We'll be also-rans in the playoffs, but whatever... our situation is crap.  It is what its.... You could just try to convince KG and Pierce to retire.  The benefits would be roughly the same.

[Who]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

I'd love it if Ainge could move Bass instead of Terry or Lee.

I think Courtney Lee is a positive trade asset. I wouldn't move him in this deal if I could avoid it. On the other hand, I think Jason Terry and Brandon Bass have negative trade value. I would like to dump their contracts. Bass would be first choice because he earns more money. Terry would be an okay fall-back.

It would be a shame to lose C.Lee though if Ainge was able to move Bass/Terry instead.

[CelticConcourse]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

I'd love it if Ainge could move Bass instead of Terry or Lee.

I think Courtney Lee is a positive trade asset. I wouldn't move him in this deal if I could avoid it. On the other hand, I think Jason Terry and Brandon Bass have negative trade value. I would like to dump their contracts. Bass would be first choice because he earns more money. Terry would be an okay fall-back.

It would be a shame to lose C.Lee though if Ainge was able to move Bass/Terry instead.

Bass negative trade value? He was our best player in the Playoffs and the last twenty games of the season. Better than Pierce, Green, Lee, Bradley, KG, etc.

[Who]

Alright, it looks like this deal is not going through regardless.

Yeah, It looks that way to me too. Teams too far apart on valuations.

[wiley]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

I'd love it if Ainge could move Bass instead of Terry or Lee.

I think Courtney Lee is a positive trade asset. I wouldn't move him in this deal if I could avoid it. On the other hand, I think Jason Terry and Brandon Bass have negative trade value. I would like to dump their contracts. Bass would be first choice because he earns more money. Terry would be an okay fall-back.

It would be a shame to lose C.Lee though if Ainge was able to move Bass/Terry instead.

Agree and I think the Clippers could really use Bass next year.  He'd help them...

[BballTim]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

I'd love it if Ainge could move Bass instead of Terry or Lee.

I think Courtney Lee is a positive trade asset. I wouldn't move him in this deal if I could avoid it. On the other hand, I think Jason Terry and Brandon Bass have negative trade value. I would like to dump their contracts. Bass would be first choice because he earns more money. Terry would be an okay fall-back.

It would be a shame to lose C.Lee though if Ainge was able to move Bass/Terry instead.

Bass negative trade value? He was our best player in the Playoffs and the last twenty games of the season. Better than Pierce, Green, Lee, Bradley, KG, etc.

  Not even close.

[connor]

Chris Paul owns LAC. Every. Single. Roster. Move. last year was made by Paul. Every single one, down to Vet Min signings like Matt Barnes.

Chris Paul owns the team. So it's not like he's blaming management for having terrible pieces around him.

The entire premise of this scenario is that Pierce is bought out to sign with LAC. If that's not a part of the assumption I really don't see the point of Bledsoe+DeAndre for 37 year old KG. Now KG+Pierce? Yah I can see that, if push comes to shove. I'm operating under the assumption that Pierce isn't traded to somewhere else. Honestly I think Pierce would just retire unless he was traded to at least a semi-contender (Like Goldan State or Brooklyn).

...and yah Chris Paul resigning is always a gamble. However, I still feel that the job gets done by trading Bledsoe for Granger or Afflalo (two trades that have been PROPOSED to the Clippers).

With that said...

...my ultimate dream is to do the megatrade, then get Ray Allen after he opts out of the final year with the Heat. Re-unite the big 3.

Paul-Allen-Pierce-Griffin-KG with Crawford off the bench. We'll take your Bass salary as well.

Yes I am a sick, twisted Lakers fan. I know.

I really don't think that Granger or Affalo puts LAC over the top, but if Chris Paul is the guy who is basically running the show and one of those deals convince him to stay then I could see why they would go for it instead of the C's deal.

But if I'm Paul I'm not under the impression that the Clips are a Granger (huge injury concern anyway) or Affalo type wing away from a championship. They have no front court help behind Jordan who is useless in the 4th quarter. They'd need to move Bledsoe and Butler to get someone to bolster that before they can beat the Heat or Thunder or Spurs and I don't think there is anything out there better than KG (for the short term at least).

I think the Clippers have a bright future, but I wouldn't be surprised if Paul chose to walk to Dallas or Houston or even Atlanta if they can get Howard because all of those teams would be better than the current Clippers roster plus Granger or Affalo.

[CelticConcourse]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

I'd love it if Ainge could move Bass instead of Terry or Lee.

I think Courtney Lee is a positive trade asset. I wouldn't move him in this deal if I could avoid it. On the other hand, I think Jason Terry and Brandon Bass have negative trade value. I would like to dump their contracts. Bass would be first choice because he earns more money. Terry would be an okay fall-back.

It would be a shame to lose C.Lee though if Ainge was able to move Bass/Terry instead.

Bass negative trade value? He was our best player in the Playoffs and the last twenty games of the season. Better than Pierce, Green, Lee, Bradley, KG, etc.

  Not even close.

Prove it. I have a pretty good memory and I know Bass was our best and most consistent player.

[BballTim]

Don't rule out this trade: Jordan, Butler, Green + a 1st rounder for Doc, KG + the Terry/Lee contracts. Clips keep Bledsoe.

Bill simmons

I'd love it if Ainge could move Bass instead of Terry or Lee.

I think Courtney Lee is a positive trade asset. I wouldn't move him in this deal if I could avoid it. On the other hand, I think Jason Terry and Brandon Bass have negative trade value. I would like to dump their contracts. Bass would be first choice because he earns more money. Terry would be an okay fall-back.

It would be a shame to lose C.Lee though if Ainge was able to move Bass/Terry instead.

Bass negative trade value? He was our best player in the Playoffs and the last twenty games of the season. Better than Pierce, Green, Lee, Bradley, KG, etc.

  Not even close.

Prove it. I have a pretty good memory and I know Bass was our best and most consistent player.

  If you're going to claim that a guy who averaged 7/7 in 34 minutes a game was our best player you need more to support that than "prove he wasn't". If your memory is as good as you claim then I'd wonder about your player evaluation skills.

[CelticsFan9]

 Why are people enamored with Jordan so much?  The dude got benched for Lamar 'it took me half a season to get in shape' Odom during crunch time.  That's just embarrassing.

I'm a big Bledsoe fan, but a) the Celtics have Bradley, who is very similar to Bledsoe, b) when CP3 was injured, he put up decent stats but the team's record was bad, and c) next summer he's going to get overpaid.  I don't want the Celtics to be the team paying him.

The picks Boston would be getting aren't going to be great, unless they come like four or five years from now, or they have a rollover option.  I don't see those are having much value, even if Boston acquires them for Doc.

On that topic, I could care less what happens with Doc.  I'd be glad if he were here, but if he left, it's not like I would be upset.

I'd like KG and Pierce to retire as Celtics, but I understand that they want to win.  No harm there.  This team is done contending for now.

Overall, I really don't like the trade, but I'm not so sure Danny will find a better one in a couple months.

I just wish it would be resolved, trade or no-trade.  It's getting annoying.

Edit: Also, that trade doesn't give us cap relief, even if we find a way to unload Bass/Terry/Lee.  Isn't that the point of rebuilding?  Getting rid of bad contracts?

[indeedproceed]

Why are people enamored with Jordan so much?  The dude got benched for Lamar 'it took me half a season to get in shape' Odom during crunch time.  That's just embarrassing.

I think that sells Jordan a little short, but Yoki summed it up really well a day or two ago in another post, describing Jordan:

He's entertaining, athletic, limited and overpaid.

[Celtics Insider]

Why are people enamored with Jordan so much?

Because he scores when he gets the ball (whether that's because he only dunks or teams sag off of him, it doesn't matter), and because he's good at swatting the ball and gives us the rebounding big we've desperately needed for years.