Author Topic: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em  (Read 9468 times)

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Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2012, 09:49:30 PM »

Offline BASS_THUMPER

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ummm

scalabrine is not on that list











*sippin*


Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2012, 09:55:51 PM »

Offline jdz101

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1 KG
2 Rondo
3 Pierce
4 Bradley
5 Green
6 Terry
7 Bass
8 Lee
9 Sully
10 Darko
11 Wilcox
12 Barbosa
13 Melo
14 Joseph

15 This girl:
 


how much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck was chris bosh?

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2012, 09:58:23 PM »

Offline BASS_THUMPER

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 :o

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2012, 02:16:23 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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The Critical Guys (lose them and we're screwed)

1. KG
Boston actually took a bigger hit statistically on offense then they did on defense with KG out.  His ability to be an inside/outside scoring threat along with his IQ (always makes the right play) and passing ability make him more valuable offensively then people realise.  I'm only talking about his offense here because the impact he brings with his defense, energy and leadership goes without saying.
 
2. Rondo
Very close second behind KG, but second regardless simply becuase his impact is more more focussed towards the offensive side of the game.  I don't think Boston loses that much defensively when Rondo is off the floor, despite him being known as a very good defender.  I put Rondo above Paul becuase he makes everyone better offensively, and having 4 offensive threats on the court is more dangerous IMHO than 1 offensive threat. I rank him below KG because he can be turnover prone at times, forces some questionable shots at times, and his unpolished offensive game can sometimes be a liability (as other teams will cheat off him and double other guys). 

3. Pierce
Along with KG, Pierce is probably the most complete player on this team. Offensively he is almost unguardable becuase he can score in every possible way - he's threat from midrange, from three, can attacking of the dribble, very good post up game, will score on the fast break, an excellent finisher around the basket and great at getting to the line.  He draws so much attention on offense that he acts as a 'decoy' and draws attention away from our other scorers.  He's also an elite passer at his postition, a very good rebounder, and an underrated defender.  He is the best clutch scorer on this team. Pierce is a guy who (if he gets hot) can turn a 15 point defecit into 3 point lead in the space of abou 6 game minutes.   

Key guys (lose them and we'll really struggle)

4. Bradley
Yep, It may seem crazy but I'm putting Bradley down as the most important play after the big 3.  The pure chaos he causes on defense is invaluable to this team, and at times it gives us just as much advantage as Rondo's playmaking or Pierces scoring.  Aside from that he's improving as a scorer and as a ball handler, so he's no longer an offensive liablity.  All of this is evident in his on/off Net Rating in the playoffs last season, which was the highest of anyone on the Celtics roster (even above KG).

5. Terry
This was a REALLY close call between Terry and Green, and I'm still somewhat on the fence about it.  I'm put Terry above Green by a whisker simply because his toughness and his history of being a dominant clutch scorer will be critical for us come playoff time.  He may well be out most important offensive player after Pierce. He will be much like Ray Allen in that no team in the league will be able to leave his body when he's out there, and that makes us very hard to defend.  Outside of this he is dependable (has missed barely any games over his career) and he's the emotional leader of out second unit, and should have a similar locker room presence to what Dooling had last season.

6. Green
Green rounds out this group because of his versatility on both ends of the floor.  Terry is mainly a shooter right now, and we need a guy on our second unit who can in the post, off the dribble and can get to the line.  Green is that guy.  We also need a guy who can defend dominate offensive swingmen (like Lebron, Camello, Durant, etc) when Pierce rests, and Green gives us that as well. 

You could pretty much interchange these three guys in any order and it would be fair enough - they are all VERY important to our title hopes.

Important guys - We'd really miss them if lost

7. Sullinger
Yes I know this is crazy putting this much weight into a rookie, but he gives us two things we are in desperate need of - inside scoring and offensive rebouding.  He seems to have a knack for getting to the foul line as well, and he shot about 85% from there in the preseason.  Aside from the post game he also has shooting range out to the three point line, so opposing teams cannot leave him to double or he is more than capable of punishing them.  His defense needs work but towards the end of preseason it seemed like it was already improving a lot, and I think after a couple of months into the season he'll no longer be a liability on that end. 

8. Darko
Crazy much - Darko at #8??  You didn't read wrong.  Last season we were getting absolutely butt-whipped every time KG sat down becuase we had absolutely zero paint protection.  We have also severely missed having an 'enforcer' type guy since Perkins left, and teams had no fear attacking the rim against us.  Darko will change that.  He blocks shots, he fights for rebounds, he's big and scary (and physcho).  See what happened in the preseason when Darko was out and KG sat down?  We got slaughtered. This guy will have almost zero impact on offense, but if he keeps playing the way he did in preseason he's going to be a key piece for our second unit.   

Valuable players, but we can win without them

9.  Lee
It might seem mean to have Lee this far down on the list.  Truth is he is a jack-of-all trades and that means we're better with him.  He isn't exceptional at anything though, and that means we can live without him.  Nice (if streaky) shooter, solid defender, valuable in the fast break running with Rondo, and he has decent size for a SG which will help at times against bigger guards.  Becuase of Bradley's situation Lee would have been way further up in this list in the short term, but now that we have Barbosa it again pushes him back down.  To put it simply Lee is a good shooter, but not as good as Terry.  He's a good defender, but not as good as Bradley.  He's quick on the break, but but not quicker than Barbosa.  I really like Lee but if he goes down, we have three other SG's who can pretty much replace what he gives us. 

10. Bass
Again, it sounds mean having Bass this far down the list, but like Lee there is nothing he gives us really that another guy on our team doesn't.  He's a great midrange shooting big - so is KG.  He's athletic - so is Wilcox.  He's a decent rebounder - Wilcox is a better one.  Wilcox is also a better inside scorer.  The only key things he gives us are hustle and hard work (which I love) but otherwise we are stacked enough at PF that if he does go down we can live with it. 

11. Barbosa
Barbosa is this far down for the same reason as Lee is - he doesn't do anything that another guy can't do.  He's a better scorer probably than Lee and he's similarly quick on the fast break, but he is smaller and less capable defensively (especially against bigger guys).  I rank him above Wilcox because he can play some time at the PG spot which allows Terry to spend more time at his natural SG spot, and I think that's important.  Also gives us a second person who can play the point if Terry or (god forbid) Rondo gets hurt.

12. Wilcox
I REALLY like Wilcox.  Love the effort and energy he gave us last year, and if this was last years team he's be much further up in the list..but we are just so [dang] stacked at the frontcourt positions.  Hell in some ways you could almost argue that Wilcox could be more important than Bass, becuase he gives us athleticism in the front court without giving up size..plus he's a better rebounder and a better finisher around the basket.  Bass is probably a better defender though (maybe, if so not by much) and is a more consistent scorer. Wilcox also turns the ball over a lot more than Bass does.  Really tough call to be honest between Bass, Barbosa and Wilcox - these positions also are pretty much interchangable.

Bottom of the bench (i.e. insurance) guys

13. Collins
Collins has one talent and one talent only - frustrating opposing big men and (in the process) causing their offensive play to diminish.  This year I thik Collins will have pretty low value simply because I believe Darko will do exactly the same thing, and probably do it at least as well.  Darko also has been rebouding well and has been blocking shots consistently, while also making a solid passer from the post (Collins appears capable of neither).  Still he's a Vet and he's a servicable player who will earn his pay at some point in the season.

14. Joseph
I've put Joseph on top of Melo because I believe that he is more NBA ready at this point in their careers.  If Green or Pierce have to miss time Joseph could step up and get some time.  While he'd be unlikely to produce much in a real game, he's also unlikely to turn the ball over and become a liability. He's a bit like a poor man's Cortney Lee in that he's not exceptional at anything, but just solid at everything.   

15.Melo
I've put Joseph on top becuase right now he is less a liability.  Still Melo has a roster spot becuase he gives us one thing that no other center on this Roster (bar KG) can give us - decent Pick and Roll defense.  Downside is that right now he is still a major liability on offense, getting just as many turnovers per night as he has rebounds and blocks combined.  He has had a decent assist rate though - he'll be nice when his offensive game improves.  For now he'll be insurance in case one of our backup centers (Darko or Collins) gets hurt and the other gets in foul trouble.

Wow, so difficult to make that list!  I feel so bad listing Lee and Bass as out 9th and 10th most valuable players...just goes to show how amazingly deep this team is.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2012, 02:37:35 AM by crimson_stallion »

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #19 on: October 27, 2012, 02:46:48 AM »

Offline ImShakHeIsShaq

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1. KG
2. Pierce
3. Rondo
4. Green
5. Terry
6. Bass


Bradley
Lee
Darko
Barbosa
Wilcox
Sully
Collins
Joseph
Melo

My list is flexible when it get's to the end but no doubt in my mind about the top 6 players are as I listed them LOL. I'm always right, so everyone else, SHH!!

BTW: I bumped Sully down b/c he is absolutely terrible on defense!!! I mean I almost cringe when he is in without KG or Darko, defensively. He is good on one end and terrible on the other end, no way he is better than Bass as some say (not yet anyway)! He is interchangeable though, those ahead of him on my list (after 6) aren't that much better in my mind and most are who they are already, Sully has A LOT of room and time to grow!
« Last Edit: October 27, 2012, 02:57:21 AM by ImShakHeIsShaq »
It takes me 3hrs to get to Miami and 1hr to get to Orlando... but I *SPIT* on their NBA teams! "Bless God and bless the (Celts)"-Lady GaGa (she said gays but she really meant Celts)

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #20 on: October 27, 2012, 03:45:26 AM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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[quote author=ImShakHeIsShaq
BTW: I bumped Sully down b/c he is absolutely terrible on defense!!! I mean I almost cringe when he is in without KG or Darko, defensively. He is good on one end and terrible on the other end, no way he is better than Bass as some say (not yet anyway)!
[/quote]

But Bass is average on both ends :P hehe

The way I see it:

Sully is:
- Above average offensively (+1)
- Above average rebounder (+1)
- below average defensively (-1)
Total: +1

Bass is:
- Average offensively (0)
- Average rebounder (0)
- Average defensively (0)
Total: 0

I know most would argue that Bass is an above average offensive player but I really don't belive he is, simply because his offensive skillset is so limited.  Take away his midrange jumper and his offensive game is pretty much nonexistant.

I rate Sully above average offensively because he can score in the post, he can shoot from midrange, he has three point range and he's good at getting to the line (where he shoots at a high percentage).  Also because his offensive rebounding creates extra possessions, so that's another offensive advantage - many of his points are off putbacks, which would have otherwise become transition opportunties for the opposing team.

Of course that is just my opinion though from what I've seen of both guys :)

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #21 on: October 27, 2012, 04:13:55 AM »

Offline ianboyextreme

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Folks on here recognize that we weouldnt have made it to 7 games in the miami series without Rondo right? I mean, we might have lost the Philly series if Rondo hadnt stepped up at the end.

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #22 on: October 27, 2012, 05:12:42 AM »

Offline Celtics18

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Folks on here recognize that we weouldnt have made it to 7 games in the miami series without Rondo right? I mean, we might have lost the Philly series if Rondo hadnt stepped up at the end.

Look at it this way:  The folks who have Rondo at number 3 are the true optimists.  If Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett are playing so well--particularly come playoff time--that our MVP candidate is the team's third most valuable player, then we are the front runners to bring home #18.
DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2012, 05:59:44 AM »

Offline bfrombleacher

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1. Rondo/KG/Pierce
1 and a half. Jet
2. JG/Lee/AB/Bass
3. Sully/Darko/Wilcox
4. Barbosa/Collins
5. Joseph/Fab Melo

That's the beauty of this team.

Any given night anybody could be the best player and everyone else will fall into place, doing what's best for the team. And I bet there'll be no gripes but rather celebration.

Quote
"I tell him every day, 'You're no longer Darko. You're a Celtic,' Boston coach Doc Rivers said. "And one day, we asked him what his name was and he said, 'Celtic.'

That's why I no longer care if people don't acknowledge Rondo. He wants 18 a billion...trillion times more than he wants to be the league MVP. Same goes for everyone else on the team.

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #24 on: October 27, 2012, 07:23:44 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Without KG .   I don't want to think about where we'd be. He is important to this team if he was in a wheelchair. His presence is HUGE ...he IS the big ticket. He doesn't waste words.


Rondo he is fully on... makes this team nearly unbeatable , and he always give you a chance to win.

Maybe I'm too high on Sully,  the team looks too much like last years weak front court when he isn't on the floor. He is learning fast. He is a smooth operator around the bucket. I think he has to be in the starting lineup  at somepoint. He is that missing piece that drove me crazy watching last years team.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2012, 07:55:41 AM by SHAQATTACK »

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #25 on: October 27, 2012, 11:14:56 AM »

Offline celtics2

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1 KG
2 Pierce
3 Rondo
4 Terry
5 Lee
6 Green
7 Sullivan
8 Bass
9 Wilcox
10 Millicic
11 Barbosa
12 Collins
13 Joseph
14 Melo
15 Bradley: If he is 100% moves up to 4th

Note: cautious about Green, may need a full season to excel, if he can.

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #26 on: October 27, 2012, 11:34:19 AM »

Online Donoghus

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Garnett
Rondo
Pierce
Terry
Bradley
Green
Lee
Sullinger
Bass
Darko
Wilcox
Barbosa
Collins
Melo
Joseph


2010 CB Historical Draft - Best Overall Team

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #27 on: October 27, 2012, 11:35:43 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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1. Rondo
2. kg
3. Pierce
4. JET
5. Green
6. Lee
7. Bass
8. Barbosa
9. Bradley
10. Darko
11. Sully
12. Wilcox
13. Collins
14. KJ
15. Melo

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #28 on: October 27, 2012, 12:15:06 PM »

Offline GreenEnvy

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Garnett/Pierce/Rondo (1a, 1b, 1c, respectively. Without any one of these guys, the team is done)

Green (the only other guy who is irreplaceable. Can't imagine getting by MIA or OKC without him. Would give LAL serious matchup problems too)

Terry (desperately needed instant offense, big game player, big game shot maker)
Lee (great athlete on both sides of ball, versatile)
Milicic (need another big after KG to control the paint, can assume Perk's role)
Bass (money jumpshot, good athlete, may become big asset off bench)
Bradley (epic ball-pressurer, can hit corner three's and underrated midrange jumper)
Sullinger (a natural rebounder and post player. Undersized but knows how to create)

Wilcox (got lost in shuffle this preseason, will fight for PT)
Barbosa (nice late acquisition by DA for depth, but not expecting more than 8mpg)
Collins (this guy can help us in certain situations. He will be ready when his # is called)
Melo (can learn a lot from practicing with us and playing in Maine. Be patient)
Joseph (too much depth on the wings to see action this year, nice talent though)
CELTICS 2024

Re: 1-15. Rank 'em if you got 'em
« Reply #29 on: October 27, 2012, 01:14:22 PM »

Online Vermont Green

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The main groupings seem to be around whether it is

KG-PP-RR (and everyone else)

or KG-RR-PP

If you look at games last year where PP or KG did not play (or played subpar) and compare that to games we played without RR, it is hard to make a case for RR being more impactful than either.  That could change this year if RR actually develops a reliable shot.

My list is

Garnett
Pierce
Rondo
Everyone else