« previous next »
Pages: [1]   Go Down

Author Topic: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass  (Read 2634 times)

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« on: January 19, 2012, 11:57:39 AM »

Offline jmei

  • Baylor Scheierman
  • Posts: 17
  • Tommy Points: 2
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=8xy4reu

For Boston: allows the team to rebuild next year as a young, athletic team that can run in transition. Williams is overpaid but is young, a good defender, and athletic. Combine him with Rondo and Jsmoove (close HS friends) and you have an extremely athletic fast-break team, especially with Ray Allen trailing for the transition three. That core will have some trouble in the half-court and will struggle to stretch the floor (none of the three is a good shooter) but will improve defensively and on the boards. It will significantly cut into the Celtics' cap space but the only free agent of note this offseason is Howard and he's not going to sign in Boston. The next-best viable non-PG UFAs are guys like Spencer Hawes and Carl Landry (see http://www.sbnation.com/2011-nba-free-agency/2011/12/20/2641521/nba-free-agents-2012-ranking-dwight-howard-deron-williams for the sad list).

For Atlanta: they are reportedly trying to move salary to get under the luxury tax and this would help them to do so, in the process getting rid of William's contract. Pierce gives them another shot-creator and floor-stretcher, and Bass gives them a pick-and-pop player to help replace Al Horford. This would be a win-now move if Atlanta thinks adding Pierce makes them a legitimate contender while also shedding (some) future salary.

Thoughts? Not sure Atlanta does this trade since they take on Pierce's rather hefty future salary, but this is one of the few viable Pierce trades I've found. I'd maybe consider including a first-round pick if that's what it took.
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2012, 12:01:53 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

  • Ed Macauley
  • ***********
  • Posts: 11134
  • Tommy Points: 1304
  • I'm a Paul Heyman guy.
Quote from: jmei on January 19, 2012, 11:57:39 AM
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=8xy4reu

For Boston: allows the team to rebuild next year as a young, athletic team that can run in transition. Williams is overpaid but is young, a good defender, and athletic. Combine him with Rondo and Jsmoove (close HS friends) and you have an extremely athletic fast-break team, especially with Ray Allen trailing for the transition three. That core will have some trouble in the half-court and will struggle to stretch the floor (none of the three is a good shooter) but will improve defensively and on the boards. It will significantly cut into the Celtics' cap space but the only free agent of note this offseason is Howard and he's not going to sign in Boston. The next-best viable non-PG UFAs are guys like Spencer Hawes and Carl Landry (see http://www.sbnation.com/2011-nba-free-agency/2011/12/20/2641521/nba-free-agents-2012-ranking-dwight-howard-deron-williams for the sad list).

For Atlanta: they are reportedly trying to move salary to get under the luxury tax and this would help them to do so, in the process getting rid of William's contract. Pierce gives them another shot-creator and floor-stretcher, and Bass gives them a pick-and-pop player to help replace Al Horford. This would be a win-now move if Atlanta thinks adding Pierce makes them a legitimate contender while also shedding (some) future salary.

Thoughts? Not sure Atlanta does this trade since they take on Pierce's rather hefty future salary, but this is one of the few viable Pierce trades I've found. I'd maybe consider including a first-round pick if that's what it took.

like the trade, just not sure if Atlanta is gonna do this because this will definitely be a heist for the Celtics.

Logged
2019 CStrong Historical Draft 2000s OKC Thunder.
PG: Jrue Holiday / Isaiah Thomas / Larry Hughes
SG: Paul George / Aaron McKie / Bradley Beal
SF: Paul Pierce / Tayshaun Prince / Brian Scalabrine
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge / Shareef Abdur-Raheem / Ben Simmons
C: Jermaine O'neal / Ben Wallace
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2012, 12:02:30 PM »

Offline Green 18

  • Jordan Walsh
  • Posts: 23
  • Tommy Points: 1
ATL would probably go for KG or Allen instead of PP. Their expiring contracts would free up some cap space next summer which is what I believe they want by trading JSmoove.
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2012, 12:03:25 PM »

Offline Eja117

  • NCE
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19274
  • Tommy Points: 1254
I think I like it. I don't think I'd add much. Maybe a 2nd rounder. 
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2012, 12:13:56 PM »

Offline jmei

  • Baylor Scheierman
  • Posts: 17
  • Tommy Points: 2
Quote from: Green 18 on January 19, 2012, 12:02:30 PM
ATL would probably go for KG or Allen instead of PP. Their expiring contracts would free up some cap space next summer which is what I believe they want by trading JSmoove.

I don't think Atlanta just wants to get under the cap. They want to remain competitive while doing so. I mean, we could try a trade like this one: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6v9zue8 -- but that would just be a straight salary-dump for Atlanta in hopes that they can enter the Dwight Howard/Deron Williams sweepstakes in the offseason (they would just have Johnson, Horford, and Teague under contract for 2012-13 in that scenario, with cap space for a max contract). I would probably do that deal as well, since I'm extremely pessimistic about the players available this offseason.

Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2012, 12:20:07 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

  • NCE
  • Kevin Garnett
  • *****************
  • Posts: 17914
  • Tommy Points: 1294
The bottom line is, Smith/Williams appears to work, by the numbers, for any of the following:

KG straight up
KG + one of Stiemsma/Johnson/Bradley/Moore
one of Allen/Pierce + one of O'Neal/Bass

So it's not like we don't have packages to offer Atlanta depending on what they want. But whether they're open to trading these two is a different issue altogether.

For what it's worth, Smith has made some eyebrow-raising comments lately too, such as that he doesn't feel he has any increased responsibilities with Horford out.
Logged
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2012, 12:22:56 PM »

Offline jmei

  • Baylor Scheierman
  • Posts: 17
  • Tommy Points: 2
Quote from: Yoki_IsTheName on January 19, 2012, 12:01:53 PM

like the trade, just not sure if Atlanta is gonna do this because this will definitely be a heist for the Celtics.


The one thing that gives me hope is analysis like this: http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=52447.15#msg1118023 --which seems to indicate that Josh Smith is not a player that Atlanta GM Rick Sund values very much and is open to dealing to shake up the team. I do think that Atlanta is the most likely trade partner if Boston decides to "blow it up" and that Josh Smith is one of the few semi-available players that I'd be willing to blow up the team for.
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2012, 12:23:34 PM »

Offline letsgoblue86

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3763
  • Tommy Points: 292
Marvin Williams is awful, I'd much rather keep Pierce.  And I feel that Josh Smith wouldn't be too much of an upgrade over Brandon Bass.  Similar style of play, Josh does have a little more athleticism and a better defender.
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2012, 12:35:47 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

  • NCE
  • Kevin Garnett
  • *****************
  • Posts: 17914
  • Tommy Points: 1294
Quote from: letsgoblue86 on January 19, 2012, 12:23:34 PM
Marvin Williams is awful, I'd much rather keep Pierce.  And I feel that Josh Smith wouldn't be too much of an upgrade over Brandon Bass.  Similar style of play, Josh does have a little more athleticism and a better defender.
This trade is not about Marvin Williams, really.
Logged
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2012, 12:40:47 PM »

Offline jmei

  • Baylor Scheierman
  • Posts: 17
  • Tommy Points: 2
Quote from: kozlodoev on January 19, 2012, 12:20:07 PM
The bottom line is, Smith/Williams appears to work, by the numbers, for any of the following:

KG straight up
KG + one of Stiemsma/Johnson/Bradley/Moore
one of Allen/Pierce + one of O'Neal/Bass

So it's not like we don't have packages to offer Atlanta depending on what they want. But whether they're open to trading these two is a different issue altogether.

For what it's worth, Smith has made some eyebrow-raising comments lately too, such as that he doesn't feel he has any increased responsibilities with Horford out.

Would any trade in which we trade for Smith/Williams be accompanied by the amnesty of Paul Pierce? It's the only way this team would have a shot (however slim) at cap space before 2014-15 (when Williams/Pierce's contracts expire). Smith's contract expires one year earlier but it won't get you much cap space assuming Danny signs a few other complementary pieces. That's the main reason I have a tough time seeing a trade for Williams while Pierce is still on the roster-- you'd have $22.5m tied up in the SF position for the next three years.

PS: Marvin Williams is comparable to Jeff Green with a worse jump shot but better defense and rebounding. They're both 25, big SFs who aren't particularly great at anything but do everything OK. Williams has a better career TS%, rebounding percentage, and turns the ball over less, but other than that they're near-identical players statistically. Again, he's overpaid, but he's a useful player.

Josh Smith, on the other hand, is a borderline-elite rebounder and shot-blocker who plays good team defense. His jump shot is shaky but he has elite athleticism and a decent post game. He's only 26 and on a reasonable contract. Again, one of the few available pieces I'm willing to build a team around in the post-big-3 era.
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2012, 01:15:47 PM »

Offline southshorematt

  • Kristaps Porzingis
  • Posts: 179
  • Tommy Points: 46
Bring me Jsmoove
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2012, 12:01:31 AM »

Offline Bean_town fan

  • Joe Mazzulla
  • Posts: 129
  • Tommy Points: 21
Smith is playing great right now and chatter about him being traded has disappeared, what makes everyone hear think hes available?
Logged
Re: Trade idea: J. Smith/M. Williams for Pierce/Bass
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2012, 05:08:37 AM »

Offline FallGuy

  • Don Chaney
  • *
  • Posts: 1941
  • Tommy Points: 70
Quote from: Bean_town fan on January 20, 2012, 12:01:31 AM
Smith is playing great right now and chatter about him being traded has disappeared, what makes everyone hear think hes available?

Yep. They're not gonna deal him with Horford injured.
Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
« previous next »