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We should start rebuilding
« on: January 13, 2012, 10:10:15 AM »

Offline ctrey

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I noticed this from John Hollinger. Yes, I know he is hated on this board by and large but he raises a valid point.


John Hollinger
  (12:26 PM)



"The Sixers look like a pretty heavy favorite right now. I watched the first half of Boston-Dallas last night and it was painful; even against an old, slow team they looked old and slow, with the glaring exception of Rondo. Celtics might be on a much sharper downswing than I'd suspected."

The Celtics were on four days of rest, against an old team on the second night of a back to back. We should have ripped Dallas a new one, instead we had another "By golly they almost got that one" loss.

I do not buy this "They just need to play themselves into shape" nonsense, none of the Big Three look any heavier or less toned, they are just old. In fairness, Ray looks just fine.

We are getting murdered at the five spot. The simple fact the fan base is acting like Beiber fans over Stiemsma who could not make a number of awful NBA teams is proof of this. O'Neal is toast, Wilcox was never good and is playing out of position and Stiemsma is starting to get found out. When the center position for Dallas (Can you name the two centers for them? Yeah, thought not) puts up 16 points and 17 rebounds while we get 3 points and 5 boards from our guys there is trouble.

We need to just start the rebuild now. Making the playoffs at the 6,7 or 8 spot is a waste of time. Do not start with Knicks being an 8 seed back in 1999. The Knicks were not looking up at teams like this years Heat or Bulls who are clearly head and shoulders above everybody.

We could get a lottery pick along with the Clippers pick which will be in the 20's (Boy, the Perkins trade just is going to make people be furious for years, even though it was and still is the right move) in a great draft. Danny and the guys draft well overall and we will also have a ton of money to spend on free agents.

We need to get a team on the floor that can actually get up and down with Rondo or in the greatest of all ironies, Rondo will start asking to be dealt. (Now THAT would be funny as you know what)

We have a bunch of players that we need to take long looks at.

Now is the time to do it.

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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2012, 10:17:26 AM »

Offline Inside-Out

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NO flipping WAY.

edit - while I agree with the sentiment, no masked profanity. - Chris
« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 11:28:16 AM by Chris »
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2012, 10:22:16 AM »

Offline JSD

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Hollinger needs to revisit that 1999 Pacer team roster before he dismisses the Knicks to Celtics comparisons:

Quote
1999 Pacers:

Reggie Miller   
Rik Smits
Jalen Rose
Chris Mullin
Antonio Davis
Dale Davis
Mark Jackson
Travis Best
Sam Perkins
Austin Croshere
Derrick McKey
Al Harrington
Fred Hoiberg
Mark Pope

That squad would have went toe to toe with today's Miami or Chi.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2012, 10:30:17 AM »

Online slamtheking

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Quote from: JSD on January 13, 2012, 10:22:16 AM
Hollinger needs to revisit that 1999 Pacer team roster before he dismisses the Knicks to Celtics comparisons:

Quote
1999 Pacers:

Reggie Miller   
Rik Smits
Jalen Rose
Chris Mullin
Antonio Davis
Dale Davis
Mark Jackson
Travis Best
Sam Perkins
Austin Croshere
Derrick McKey
Al Harrington
Fred Hoiberg
Mark Pope

That squad would have went toe to toe with today's Miami or Chi.
I don't think so.  If all of those guys were in their primes at the same time, they'd be dominant.  However, the best players on that team, with the exception of Rose, were in the league for 10 years or more by that point and on the downsides of their careers. 

Miami and Chicago have their players in their primes or coming into their primes still.  The only weakness those teams have is depth.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2012, 10:38:55 AM »

Offline JSD

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Quote from: slamtheking on January 13, 2012, 10:30:17 AM
Quote from: JSD on January 13, 2012, 10:22:16 AM
Hollinger needs to revisit that 1999 Pacer team roster before he dismisses the Knicks to Celtics comparisons:

Quote
1999 Pacers:

Reggie Miller   
Rik Smits
Jalen Rose
Chris Mullin
Antonio Davis
Dale Davis
Mark Jackson
Travis Best
Sam Perkins
Austin Croshere
Derrick McKey
Al Harrington
Fred Hoiberg
Mark Pope

That squad would have went toe to toe with today's Miami or Chi.
I don't think so.  If all of those guys were in their primes at the same time, they'd be dominant.  However, the best players on that team, with the exception of Rose, were in the league for 10 years or more by that point and on the downsides of their careers.  

Miami and Chicago have their players in their primes or coming into their primes still.  The only weakness those teams have is depth.

The only persons over age 33 on that team were Chris Mullen and Sam Perkins.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2012, 10:44:27 AM »

Offline Marcus13

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We are in the process.  This is a transition-season.  We have tons of expiring contracts - just gotta wait it out
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2012, 10:45:49 AM »

Offline StartOrien

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This idea of 'The Celtics need to start rebuilding' is becoming obnoxious, and it's written by columnists who are desperate for easy material.

Of course, the Celtics should start rebuilding.This is common knowledge. The best way to rebuild is to clear the books, which is CLEARLY their intentions and that starts next year.

Past that, what should we do? How in the world are we going to move Kevin Garnett and his enormous contract? Do people think Pierce is cooked, and not just injured/out of shape? With Ray Allen in the last year of his contract, how much do people think we can get in return?

The truth is this team needs to stay the course, and we need to accept that. I still think this'll end up being a very enjoyable season, even if this team clearly isn't a legitimate contender anymore.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2012, 10:47:59 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Quote from: Marcus13 on January 13, 2012, 10:44:27 AM
We are in the process.  This is a transition-season.  We have tons of expiring contracts - just gotta wait it out
True, but there are other uses for expiring contracts than simply letting them expire. If a high-caliber player becomes available in a salary dump, I have no doubt that Ainge will pull the trigger.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2012, 10:52:38 AM »

Offline Celtics18

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Quote from: ctrey on January 13, 2012, 10:10:15 AM
I noticed this from John Hollinger. Yes, I know he is hated on this board by and large but he raises a valid point.


John Hollinger
  (12:26 PM)



"The Sixers look like a pretty heavy favorite right now. I watched the first half of Boston-Dallas last night and it was painful; even against an old, slow team they looked old and slow, with the glaring exception of Rondo. Celtics might be on a much sharper downswing than I'd suspected."

The Celtics were on four days of rest, against an old team on the second night of a back to back. We should have ripped Dallas a new one, instead we had another "By golly they almost got that one" loss.

I do not buy this "They just need to play themselves into shape" nonsense, none of the Big Three look any heavier or less toned, they are just old. In fairness, Ray looks just fine.

We are getting murdered at the five spot. The simple fact the fan base is acting like Beiber fans over Stiemsma who could not make a number of awful NBA teams is proof of this. O'Neal is toast, Wilcox was never good and is playing out of position and Stiemsma is starting to get found out. When the center position for Dallas (Can you name the two centers for them? Yeah, thought not) puts up 16 points and 17 rebounds while we get 3 points and 5 boards from our guys there is trouble.

We need to just start the rebuild now. Making the playoffs at the 6,7 or 8 spot is a waste of time. Do not start with Knicks being an 8 seed back in 1999. The Knicks were not looking up at teams like this years Heat or Bulls who are clearly head and shoulders above everybody.

We could get a lottery pick along with the Clippers pick which will be in the 20's (Boy, the Perkins trade just is going to make people be furious for years, even though it was and still is the right move) in a great draft. Danny and the guys draft well overall and we will also have a ton of money to spend on free agents.

We need to get a team on the floor that can actually get up and down with Rondo or in the greatest of all ironies, Rondo will start asking to be dealt. (Now THAT would be funny as you know what)

We have a bunch of players that we need to take long looks at.

Now is the time to do it.



I'm not sure what your plan is here.  Are you saying we should tank or are you saying we should move some players? Or are you advocating for doing both?
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DKC Seventy-Sixers:

PG: G. Hill/D. Schroder
SG: C. Lee/B. Hield/T. Luwawu
SF:  Giannis/J. Lamb/M. Kuzminskas
PF:  E. Ilyasova/J. Jerebko/R. Christmas
C:    N. Vucevic/K. Olynyk/E. Davis/C. Jefferson
Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2012, 11:19:18 AM »

Offline Junkyard Dawg

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right.  59 games left, less than a year removed from looking like the most dominant team in the nba, a year and a half from being a couple of cheap free throws from a championship.. lets clean house in order to become like the wizards sooner.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2012, 11:25:59 AM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Quote from: Junkyard Dawg on January 13, 2012, 11:19:18 AM
right.  59 games left, less than a year removed from looking like the most dominant team in the nba, a year and a half from being a couple of cheap free throws from a championship.. lets clean house in order to become like the wizards sooner.
"Year and a half removed from looking like the most dominant team in the NBA" is a gross overstatement. Try 4 years instead.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2012, 11:28:57 AM »

Offline Junkyard Dawg

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Quote
"Year and a half removed from looking like the most dominant team in the NBA" is a gross overstatement. Try 4 years instead.

I said less than a year.  and it's a fact.  we had the 2nd best record for most of the season last year, and we beat the Spurs twice.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2012, 11:31:14 AM »

Offline Chief

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Quote from: Marcus13 on January 13, 2012, 10:44:27 AM
We are in the process.  This is a transition-season.  We have tons of expiring contracts - just gotta wait it out

What is your realistic idea of what we could get with our cap space this summer?

My fear is that we use half of it to keep the band together. :'(
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #13 on: January 13, 2012, 11:32:41 AM »

Offline Chris

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Regardless of whether we SHOULD start rebuilding, its easier said than done.  

The C's do not have a lot of very movable pieces that will gain them much in the way of assets.  

This team is built to start rebuilding this summer, and whether they start before then will not be based on their performance as much as it will be based on what other teams want to offer them.  And I am skeptical anyone is going to offer much.
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Re: We should start rebuilding
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2012, 12:09:19 PM »

Offline ctrey

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You could certainly deal both Ray Allen and KG to contenders or near contenders. Ray can certainly still bring it and KG would most likely be a brilliant 6th man. I want to see them play the rookies and young players to see what we have.

Yes, I am advocating letting the season go. I do not see the benefit long term in barely making the playoffs and missing the lottery in a banner draft year.

What would a first or second round playoff loss do for us exactly?
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