Author Topic: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's (Read 7500 times)

diconzo · « **on:** June 21, 2011, 10:04:01 PM »

1) Draft a rotation player with the 25th pick, or one who could become a starter (Jeremy Tyler)
   I don't want another JR Giddens incident. Danny needs to either draft someone who can come in and play 12 minutes per game or someone with sky high potential. Nowhere in between. Either a big like Nikola Vucevic, Trey Thompkins, or someone who was lottery projected and fell. No semi-projects that will top out as a 11th man. Vucevic and Thompkins could both have successful careers, with my favorite pick for the Celtics being Vucevic or Jeremy Tyler. Tyler has potential to be KG's successor. I would rather strike out with Tyler than watch someone who should have been picked around 30th struggle and dwindle on our team for two years. It should be a dead tie between Tyler and Vucevic and should come down to if one of them gets drafted ahead of the Celtics.

2) Resign Jeff Green, avoid Josh Smith
   Smith and Green play roughly the same game. A big 3 that plays 4 in a small lineup. While Smith is a better shot blocker and could play PF more than Green, he isn't worth it for 11 million next season and the season after that(roughly). When we can have Green for about 6 million next season and have him do the same thing. Once the new CBA is in effect, Green should be Danny's number on priority. He needs to resign Green, not sign and trade. He's too valuable of a bench scorer and I think a training camp and more time under Doc and the Big 3's teachings is exactly what he needs.

3) Trust Avery Bradley a little more
   He showed us last year in the last game of the season that he could score when we ask him to. He shot 10 for 16(62%) and still had the defense he advertised at Texas. Sure it was against the end of NY's bench too, but now that he's not a rookie and has seen what to expect in the NBA, I think Doc will utilize him more this season. Just not another Carlos Arroyo experiment that cost us Chris Johnson.

4) Sign Free Agents that Compliment the Starters, so we don't have scoring droughts again
   Resign List:
   Delonte West
   Jeff Green
   Von Wafer
   Troy Murphy
   Delonte West and Jeff Green are the obvious ones, but I put Von here because he can shoot, is athletic, offense first player which is nice to have. Mediocre defense but I think it has improved since being in the Celtic system. Troy Murphy would be a great backup for KG, but I wouldn't expect the 20/10 guy from Indiana.
   Everyone else obviously isn't being resigned because they were either late season pickups, or had a bad postseason. No I don't mean to hate on Big Baby, but I don't think we have what he is looking for. If he agrees to roughly 3 million again, then yes. But I don't think he wants to live in the Big Four's shadow anymore.
   That would leave the roster at this:
PG) Rondo, West, Bradley
SG) Ray, Wafer
SF) Pierce, Green
PF) KG, Murphy
C) Jermaine
Also the 25th pick and the 55th pick. Leaving 3 spots open.
   Possible Free Agent Targets(Some MLE, Some Vet's Min):
Shane Battier SF
JR Smith SG
Jamal Crawford SG
Michael Redd SG
Peja Stojakovic SG/SF
Carl Landry PF/C
Greg Oden C
Samuel Dalembert C
Kwame Brown C
Aaron Gray C
Kenyon Martin PF
Nazr Mohammed C
Joel Przybilla C
DeShawn Stevenson SG
Wilson Chandler SG/SF
Aaron Afflalo SG
Chuck Hayes PF/C
Kris Humphries PF
Marquis Daniels- Not entirely impossible, could play next season
Reggie Evans PF
Alexis Ajinca C

5) No matter how tempting, avoid blowing up except for one scenario
   And that would be if Orlando calls up and says they're willing to negotiate for Howard. Otherwise, we can't blow this up. It might look nice on paper, but it would be a train wreck for the team and Doc. Run it through one more time, if it doesn't work, then resign the Big 3 to Veterans Minimum contracts and make a push for a new core.

jdz101 · « **Reply #1 on:** June 21, 2011, 11:44:45 PM »

Just a note. Denver seem pretty keen to keep Chandler and have offered him a contract.

diconzo · « **Reply #2 on:** June 21, 2011, 11:55:21 PM »

Quote from: jdz101 on June 21, 2011, 11:44:45 PM

Just a note. Denver seem pretty keen to keep Chandler and have offered him a contract.

Thanks! I'm pretty sure Denver will resign Chandler and Afflalo, but you never know.

manl_lui · « **Reply #3 on:** June 22, 2011, 02:18:29 PM »

the way you put it made sense...i mean Jeff was traded half way through the season, no experience in our system, and looked lost throughout...but he'll get it once training camp starts, he has a full summer to workout get in shape or whatever...

2short · « **Reply #4 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:10:08 PM »

sign and trade davis
sign vet free agent pf, true 6'8-10" guy who can defend and rebound
kick avery bradley in the butt
draft a usable center, loss of krstic does hurt us, jermaine can't be counted on for a full season
along with points made earlier ie signing green etc

jbaerg · « **Reply #5 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:46:01 PM »

TP for Jeremy Tyler suggestion, I love the kid

mctyson · « **Reply #6 on:** June 22, 2011, 03:52:35 PM »

I mostly agree with your steps. I actually think this is a good draft to have a late first-rounder in. Because there is no clear pecking order for the lottery, we'll probably see players going in spots nobody projected. This leaves a good chance a high-risk/high-reward guys slipping to the 20's - maybe the C's will get lucky like they did with Rondo.

I think the 25 pick should be one of two things: a tested college or euro player who can do one thing REALLY well (e.g. Kenneth Farid)or a high-risk project that is total upside. For the latter, DA better be [dang] sure about the risk because they can't wasted the chance of trading up/down from 25 on some euro trash that stays over the pond for 2 years and never pans out.

diconzo · « **Reply #7 on:** June 22, 2011, 04:07:17 PM »

Quote from: mctyson on June 22, 2011, 03:52:35 PM

I mostly agree with your steps. I actually think this is a good draft to have a late first-rounder in. Because there is no clear pecking order for the lottery, we'll probably see players going in spots nobody projected. This leaves a good chance a high-risk/high-reward guys slipping to the 20's - maybe the C's will get lucky like they did with Rondo.

I think the 25 pick should be one of two things: a tested college or euro player who can do one thing REALLY well (e.g. Kenneth Farid)or a high-risk project that is total upside. For the latter, DA better be [dang] sure about the risk because they can't wasted the chance of trading up/down from 25 on some euro trash that stays over the pond for 2 years and never pans out.

Yeah I've heard Tier 3 and 4 players are the best spot to be in this draft. If Kenneth Faried falls to 25 and we don't pick him, I'm going to be mad. Danny has been smart to not give any hint whatsoever as to who he's drafting because there are a lot of people picking in front of us.

Quote from: jbaerg on June 22, 2011, 03:46:01 PM

TP for Jeremy Tyler suggestion, I love the kid

Thanks,me too. I think he could start in this league if he makes the right choices.

Quote from: manl_lui on June 22, 2011, 02:18:29 PM

the way you put it made sense...i mean Jeff was traded half way through the season, no experience in our system, and looked lost throughout...but he'll get it once training camp starts, he has a full summer to workout get in shape or whatever...

He was put in a bad situation because everyone was angry about Perk being gone, also Nate was a fan favorite. I think next season he will find his niche and start being consistent.

jbaerg · « **Reply #8 on:** June 22, 2011, 04:23:46 PM »

agreed, Green is going to be a monster for the Celtics

diconzo · « **Reply #9 on:** June 22, 2011, 05:17:49 PM »

Quote from: jbaerg on June 22, 2011, 04:23:46 PM

agreed, Green is going to be a monster for the Celtics

He definitely needs to be part of the future. Rondo/?/Green/Jeremy Tyler!

/Dwight Howard!

the_green_truth · « **Reply #10 on:** June 22, 2011, 07:33:59 PM »

Much better than most of the "Trade one of the Big 4" ideas. I think the the Big 3 era still have something left in the tank to compete one last time. They just need the right piece along with luck.

mctyson · « **Reply #11 on:** June 23, 2011, 08:09:36 AM »

Quote from: the_green_truth on June 22, 2011, 07:33:59 PM

Much better than most of the "Trade one of the Big 4" ideas. I think the the Big 3 era still have something left in the tank to compete one last time. They just need the right piece along with luck.

I think another thing people are discounting is that it is not a given KG and/or Ray will walk away after next season for big dollars somewhere else. Granted they probably will (this is the NBA) but it is not a GIVEN. What if they both signed deals well below market value to be bench players or limited-minutes starters for another 2 years?

That's why I do not want to see Danny trade away the picks this year or next year just to move up in either draft. If he was going to trade a pick for a long-term investment player, I could buy it.

My preferences are: 1) Pick a player with at least one NBA-ready skill (rebounding, shooting) at 25; or 2) if that player isnt available, trade out of the 25 pick and try to pick up two 2nd rounders (or a first in 2012), then use the 2nd rounders on proven college guys who slipped (Matt Howard??); 3) give the Big 3+1 one last run together as starters; 4) in 2012, offer KG and Ray below market deals to be role players; 5) use both 1sts in 2012 (or 3 if you somehow could get lucky); 6) make a splash with whatever cap space they have in the 2012 FA pool on a prime-age (25-30) player.

Assuming no other players are moved, that makes the C's considerably younger in their core group while maybe getting lucky that KG or Ray decides to stay in Boston and solidfy the 2nd unit.

slamtheking · « **Reply #12 on:** June 23, 2011, 09:24:48 AM »

Quote from: diconzo on June 21, 2011, 10:04:01 PM

1) Draft a rotation player with the 25th pick, or one who could become a starter (Jeremy Tyler)
   I don't want another JR Giddens incident. Danny needs to either draft someone who can come in and play 12 minutes per game or someone with sky high potential. Nowhere in between. Either a big like Nikola Vucevic, Trey Thompkins, or someone who was lottery projected and fell. No semi-projects that will top out as a 11th man. Vucevic and Thompkins could both have successful careers, with my favorite pick for the Celtics being Vucevic or Jeremy Tyler. Tyler has potential to be KG's successor. I would rather strike out with Tyler than watch someone who should have been picked around 30th struggle and dwindle on our team for two years. It should be a dead tie between Tyler and Vucevic and should come down to if one of them gets drafted ahead of the Celtics.

2) Resign Jeff Green, avoid Josh Smith
   Smith and Green play roughly the same game. A big 3 that plays 4 in a small lineup. While Smith is a better shot blocker and could play PF more than Green, he isn't worth it for 11 million next season and the season after that(roughly). When we can have Green for about 6 million next season and have him do the same thing. Once the new CBA is in effect, Green should be Danny's number on priority. He needs to resign Green, not sign and trade. He's too valuable of a bench scorer and I think a training camp and more time under Doc and the Big 3's teachings is exactly what he needs.

3) Trust Avery Bradley a little more
   He showed us last year in the last game of the season that he could score when we ask him to. He shot 10 for 16(62%) and still had the defense he advertised at Texas. Sure it was against the end of NY's bench too, but now that he's not a rookie and has seen what to expect in the NBA, I think Doc will utilize him more this season. Just not another Carlos Arroyo experiment that cost us Chris Johnson.

4) Sign Free Agents that Compliment the Starters, so we don't have scoring droughts again
   Resign List:
   Delonte West
   Jeff Green
   Von Wafer
   Troy Murphy
   Delonte West and Jeff Green are the obvious ones, but I put Von here because he can shoot, is athletic, offense first player which is nice to have. Mediocre defense but I think it has improved since being in the Celtic system. Troy Murphy would be a great backup for KG, but I wouldn't expect the 20/10 guy from Indiana.
   Everyone else obviously isn't being resigned because they were either late season pickups, or had a bad postseason. No I don't mean to hate on Big Baby, but I don't think we have what he is looking for. If he agrees to roughly 3 million again, then yes. But I don't think he wants to live in the Big Four's shadow anymore.
   That would leave the roster at this:
PG) Rondo, West, Bradley
SG) Ray, Wafer
SF) Pierce, Green
PF) KG, Murphy
C) Jermaine
Also the 25th pick and the 55th pick. Leaving 3 spots open.
   Possible Free Agent Targets(Some MLE, Some Vet's Min):
Shane Battier SF
JR Smith SG
Jamal Crawford SG
Michael Redd SG
Peja Stojakovic SG/SF
Carl Landry PF/C
Greg Oden C
Samuel Dalembert C
Kwame Brown C
Aaron Gray C
Kenyon Martin PF
Nazr Mohammed C
Joel Przybilla C
DeShawn Stevenson SG
Wilson Chandler SG/SF
Aaron Afflalo SG
Chuck Hayes PF/C
Kris Humphries PF
Marquis Daniels- Not entirely impossible, could play next season
Reggie Evans PF
Alexis Ajinca C

5) No matter how tempting, avoid blowing up except for one scenario
   And that would be if Orlando calls up and says they're willing to negotiate for Howard. Otherwise, we can't blow this up. It might look nice on paper, but it would be a train wreck for the team and Doc. Run it through one more time, if it doesn't work, then resign the Big 3 to Veterans Minimum contracts and make a push for a new core.

I think this is what will happen pretty much -- essentially Danny will keep the current team and tweak the supporting cast.

A couple of things:
1) drafting a player that can play right away is great in theory, if there is such a player at #25 AND someone that Doc will actually play. See, that's the issue with rookies under Doc--they sit or play in Portland. For a rookie drafted this year to see the court, one of two things has to happen. Either the rookie is just so mind-blowing amazing on the court he's a rookie of the year candidate OR the team is so decimated by injuries that Doc has no choice. If not for the injuries last year, do you think Erden, Luke or Bradley would have seen the court -- wouldn't happen. (I'm not saying they were NBA-ready but Semih and sometimes Luke provided some good minutes on the court).
2) For reasonable FA pickups, assuming the options under the current CBA are available under the next one (which is a stretch at this point), I'd take flyers on Redd and Quisy under make-good vet min contracts if they'd take them. I'd take a run at Dalembert, Nazr, Jeff Foster or Pryzbilla as centers that might sign (Sammy will need the MLE to get him so Nazr or Pryz or more likely and are durable.) I'd love a shot at Carl Landry or Chuck Hayes for LLE (or anything left of the MLE) to provide some beef at PF. I don't think Oden is a possibility. His potential if healthy is great but I wouldn't want to take that risk for anything more than a make-good vet min contract.
3) If Danny can get a good back up PF to replace BBD, I'd hope Danny could move him in a S&T for another big man or defensive wing. Maybe a deal for Brandon Wright (has the height and tools to be serviceable and plug the 4/5 hole when needed). If not, resign him for a year if he'll take a deal.

An offseason haul of Redd, Quisy, Landry, Wright/BBD and 2 of Foster/ Nazr/ Pryz/ Dalembert would enable Doc to develop the rookie at #25 during the season so that he wouldn't need to contribue right away but might be able to help by the end of the season.

Lineup:
Rondo, Ray, PP, KG, JO
West, Bradley, Green, Redd, Quisy, Wright/BBD, Foster, Nazr, Landry (I don't think Murphy makes the cut in camp), #25. (I don't think Danny picks up anyone else in the draft and I don't think #55 will make the team this year unlike other years when the pick in the second round made the team.)
To me, that team is stacked better than last year and has a serious shot at the title. It's also not a pie-in-the-sky best possible case outcome this offseason but a fairly lowkey and possible one.

Evantime34 · « **Reply #13 on:** June 23, 2011, 09:41:37 AM »

Quote from: diconzo on June 21, 2011, 10:04:01 PM

1) Draft a rotation player with the 25th pick, or one who could become a starter (Jeremy Tyler)
I don't want another JR Giddens incident. Danny needs to either draft someone who can come in and play 12 minutes per game or someone with sky high potential. Nowhere in between. Either a big like Nikola Vucevic, Trey Thompkins, or someone who was lottery projected and fell. No semi-projects that will top out as a 11th man. Vucevic and Thompkins could both have successful careers, with my favorite pick for the Celtics being Vucevic or Jeremy Tyler. Tyler has potential to be KG's successor. I would rather strike out with Tyler than watch someone who should have been picked around 30th struggle and dwindle on our team for two years. It should be a dead tie between Tyler and Vucevic and should come down to if one of them gets drafted ahead of the Celtics.

I agree that we should grab someone that will be a rotation player. With only 6 players currently signed the likelihood is high that it happens. However, I think we end up buying a pick in the early second and using our second rounder. I think if one of those guys can be a rotation player by years end this draft will be a victory.

FrDrake · « **Reply #14 on:** June 23, 2011, 10:30:23 AM »

I am also a fan of picking up Jeremy Tyler, but am getting a sense that DA is building up Avery Bradley's stock in the media ("Bradley would be a top five pick in this draft if he didn't come out last year") to move him on draft night, probably with this year's first round pick for a more established NBA player. Then he'll draft some big man no one has ever heard of in the second round.

Author Topic: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's (Read 7500 times)

Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

diconzo

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

jdz101

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

diconzo

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

manl_lui

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

2short

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

jbaerg

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

mctyson

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

diconzo

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

jbaerg

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

diconzo

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

the_green_truth

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

mctyson

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

slamtheking

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

Evantime34

Re: Steps to a successful offseason/season for the C's

FrDrake

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