JO versus Brandon Roy

[vinnie]

I found it interesting to read this morning that three weeks after having surgery on both of his knees, Brnadon Roy is fighting to get back into the lineup for the Blazers. Granted, we do not know how his surgery compared to JO's, but we do know that Roy has a bone-on-bone situation with both his knees.

[Roy H.]

Yeah, two different injuries.  JO has a lot more weight on his knees to carry around, and he's had a lot more wear-and-tear over the years.  I would assume that not all bone-on-bone situations are created equally.

[moiso]

I found it interesting to read this morning that three weeks after having surgery on both of his knees, Brnadon Roy is fighting to get back into the lineup for the Blazers. Granted, we do not know how his surgery compared to JO's, but we do know that Roy has a bone-on-bone situation with both his knees.

I think you have brought up a nice topic.  The injuries seem similar, and thoughout their careers we know that Roy really wants to play and that JO doesn't unless he is extremely healthy.  I don't see how age is a factor in this comparison.  A knee with no cartilege us a knee with no cartilege.

[Roy H.]

I don't see how age is a factor in this comparison.  A knee with no cartilege us a knee with no cartilege.

Not being a doctor, I'm not sure if that's the case at all.

There's also the very real question of pain tolerance / pain threshold.  Some people have very high pain tolerances, just due to the way their body is wired.  Other people have low pain tolerances.  It doesn't make anybody "tougher" or "weaker" if their body reacts with a more severe degree of pain than somebody else.

In other words, let's say that, to him, Brandon Roy's knees are a 4 on a scale of 10 regarding pain.  To JO, his are a 8 on a scale of 10.  Should JO get criticized because he won't play at an 8, just because Roy will play at a 4?  Who is to say that JO wouldn't be (and hasn't been) playing at a 4 for awhile?

[Finkelskyhook]

Yeah, two different injuries.  JO has a lot more weight on his knees to carry around, and he's had a lot more wear-and-tear over the years.  I would assume that not all bone-on-bone situations are created equally.

You're right.  No two situations are created equally...But...

O'Neal has a lot more weight on his knees because he's out of shape....He came into camp that way.    He's way over his playing weight.  

O'Neal could have followed Perk's example and at least kept his weight under control while "injured". 

I suspect his conditioning and pain tolerance will be much greater next year.

[wdleehi]

Couple of other differences.


Roy is one of the top two players on his team.

JO is the third C on the Celtics.


Roy is needed more for his team. 




Different question:

If Roy is rushing back, is that best for his team that has a long term max contract? 


For the Celtics, what is more important, JO trying to gut out a few games in the middle of the season or the chance he might be able to help in the playoffs?

[Chris]

Roy is one of the top two players on his team.

JO is the third C on the Celtics.


Roy is needed more for his team. 

This is the key to me.  I think if JO was needed by the C's, he wouldn't have even had surgery, and he would just be playing off and on through the pain.  But the C's are looking to the playoffs.  They see much more value in having a healthy(er) JO in the playoffs than having him limp through the season, helping a bit here and there. 

For Portland however, they need Roy now. 

[greenpride32]

I think JO went through what Roy just did 4-5 years ago.  So let's see how Roy holds up after playing another 4-5 years in the league.  Right now it's not a fair comparison. 

How come nobody complained when KG was shutdown?  He's tough right, he couldn't have played through the pain right?

[Tai]

Yeah, two different injuries.  JO has a lot more weight on his knees to carry around, and he's had a lot more wear-and-tear over the years.  I would assume that not all bone-on-bone situations are created equally.

You're right.  No two situations are created equally...But...

O'Neal has a lot more weight on his knees because he's out of shape....He came into camp that way.    He's way over his playing weight.  

O'Neal could have followed Perk's example and at least kept his weight under control while "injured". 

I suspect his conditioning and pain tolerance will be much greater next year.

Can you please tell us how you know JO is playing over his playing weight? Is it really just because of the injury?

[MBz]

I don't see how age is a factor in this comparison.  A knee with no cartilege us a knee with no cartilege.

Not being a doctor, I'm not sure if that's the case at all.

There's also the very real question of pain tolerance / pain threshold.  Some people have very high pain tolerances, just due to the way their body is wired.  Other people have low pain tolerances.  It doesn't make anybody "tougher" or "weaker" if their body reacts with a more severe degree of pain than somebody else.

In other words, let's say that, to him, Brandon Roy's knees are a 4 on a scale of 10 regarding pain.  To JO, his are a 8 on a scale of 10.  Should JO get criticized because he won't play at an 8, just because Roy will play at a 4?  Who is to say that JO wouldn't be (and hasn't been) playing at a 4 for awhile?

Agreed.  Also I think weight/fitness needs to be brought into the discussion.  Brandon Roy only weighs 211 lbs while Jermaine O'neal is listed at 268.  O'Neal has a lot more weight on those knees than Roy does.

[moiso]

I don't see how age is a factor in this comparison.  A knee with no cartilege us a knee with no cartilege.

Not being a doctor, I'm not sure if that's the case at all.

There's also the very real question of pain tolerance / pain threshold.  Some people have very high pain tolerances, just due to the way their body is wired.  Other people have low pain tolerances.  It doesn't make anybody "tougher" or "weaker" if their body reacts with a more severe degree of pain than somebody else.

In other words, let's say that, to him, Brandon Roy's knees are a 4 on a scale of 10 regarding pain.  To JO, his are a 8 on a scale of 10.  Should JO get criticized because he won't play at an 8, just because Roy will play at a 4?  Who is to say that JO wouldn't be (and hasn't been) playing at a 4 for awhile?

Agreed.  Also I think weight/fitness needs to be brought into the discussion.  Brandon Roy only weighs 211 lbs while Jermaine O'neal is listed at 268.  O'Neal has a lot more weight on those knees than Roy does.

Bigger guys have bigger knees.  Point guards have knee problems too.  I don't see any correlation unless the player is far over what his frame dictates his weight should be.

[moiso]

Maybe JO could lose 5-10 lbs, but it's not like he's Eddie Curry out there.

[GreenEnvy]

I found it interesting to read this morning that three weeks after having surgery on both of his knees, Brnadon Roy is fighting to get back into the lineup for the Blazers. Granted, we do not know how his surgery compared to JO's, but we do know that Roy has a bone-on-bone situation with both his knees.

I think you have brought up a nice topic.  The injuries seem similar, and thoughout their careers we know that Roy really wants to play and that JO doesn't unless he is extremely healthy.  I don't see how age is a factor in this comparison.  A knee with no cartilege us a knee with no cartilege.

I'd love to know where this notion comes from. You aren't the first to insinuate this idea, but there seems to be more proof throughout his career that he will play injured than what you (and others on here) are claiming.


And this is like comparing *insert any player who ever had a foot/ankle injury* to Yao. Not all injuries are created equal, neither are the bodies they happen to.