Celtics/Rockets (trade idea for Battier)

[Eddie20]

Boston receives:

Battier...Is one of the best potential fits out there. Can come right in and play tough defense, take charges, make the right plays, and hit the open shot. A better version of 07-08 Posey. The Rockets can plug Courtney Lee in as a starter.

Houston receives:

Perkins...With Yao out, they need a big man. Although, still injured he is set to return relatively soon. Was raised and went to HS in Texas. Could be their center of the future. Celtics will be hard pressed to offer him a big contract, so he could be lost for nothing. In addition, the emergence of Erden makes it easier to part with him.

Harangody...Don't want to part with him, but his upside is pretty limited. At best he's Matt Bonner.

Wafer...Back to Houston. Likely waived. Him and Harangody were used primarily as trade fillers.


Note:

This also frees up two roster spots. This gives us the ability to sign Sheed and/or the usual mid-season buyout.

[Chris]

This is a deal (at least the Perk for Battier part) that has been brought up many times lately.  I think it makes a lot of sense for both teams under the right circumstances.

For the C's, they need to get better health from their other centers.  Both Oneals need to be completely healthy, and looking good to stay that way, and I think they may also need to be getting Sheed back to really make this truly viable.

For Houston, they need to be convinced enough that Perkins is a fit going forward to commit the money to him on an extension. 

But from a pure fit standpoint, this just makes a lot of sense...but it is certainly a risk for both teams that they are going to need to be in the right mindset to make.

[greenpride32]

I would expect any team interested in Perk to wait for his return and gauge his recovery before jumping into any deal.

Essentially what this deal amounts to is Semih and Battier or Semih and Perk for the C's.  But if Perk stays with the team I'm thinking Semih will be the odd man out if JON is healthy.

Also, since Perk is injured, he can't pass a phyiscal to complete the trade.  Not sure how that aspect is handled.  I'm sure other injured players have been traded before.  Do they just waive the phyiscal requirement?

[wdleehi]

No.


I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.



I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be. 

[Eddie20]

No.

I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.

I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be. 

That depends on your personnel and your likely opposition.

Against Orlando it would be nice to have Perk to throw at Howard, but we still would have Shaq, JO, and to a lesser extent Baby. However, versus Miami I much rather have Battier.

For all the things Perk did well, let's not forget that he also hindered our offensive flow with his illegal screens, bad hands, lack of a post up game, and lack of a decent mid-range game. The reason why we would struggle in the past when teams went small (Atlanta for example) is because Perk simply wasn't able to exploit the mismatch offensively.

[JSD]

No.


I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.



I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be.  

This above.

Our depth at the 4/5 will be the reason we win number 18 this season.

[wdleehi]

No.

I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.

I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be. 

That depends on your personnel and your likely opposition.

Against Orlando it would be nice to have Perk to throw at Howard, but we still would have Shaq, JO, and to a lesser extent Baby. However, versus Miami I much rather have Battier.

For all the things Perk did well, let's not forget that he also hindered our offensive flow with his illegal screens, bad hands, lack of a post up game, and lack of a decent mid-range game. The reason why we would struggle in the past when teams went small (Atlanta for example) is because Perk simply wasn't able to exploit the mismatch offensively.

Until I see Miami do something against Boston, I am not about to make a trade to get smaller.

There is a reason Boston added so much size this offseason.  

And for all the struggles against smaller teams, name one that beat Boston in a 7 game series?

[Chris]

No.


I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.



I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be. 

Purely hypothetically speaking, what would you say to this deal if Sheed came back, and was in as good shape as he was in the playoffs last year, and JO and Shaq were back to 100%?

[Eddie20]

No.

I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.

I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be. 

That depends on your personnel and your likely opposition.

Against Orlando it would be nice to have Perk to throw at Howard, but we still would have Shaq, JO, and to a lesser extent Baby. However, versus Miami I much rather have Battier.

For all the things Perk did well, let's not forget that he also hindered our offensive flow with his illegal screens, bad hands, lack of a post up game, and lack of a decent mid-range game. The reason why we would struggle in the past when teams went small (Atlanta for example) is because Perk simply wasn't able to exploit the mismatch offensively.

Until I see Miami do something against Boston, I am not about to make a trade to get smaller.

There is a reason Boston added so much size this offseason.  

And for all the struggles against smaller teams, name one that beat Boston in a 7 game series?

We beat Miami without Perk. Against them we'll be more than ok going with our current bigs. Perk won't be the difference in that series. Battier would have much more impact with his ability to defend James and hit the open shot as Miami will have to double down to help their bigs vs. Shaq, KG, or JO. If we have Perk in the game, you can easily play Bosh at the 5 without any threat that Perk will take advantage of him in the post.

[PosImpos]

This is a deal (at least the Perk for Battier part) that has been brought up many times lately.  I think it makes a lot of sense for both teams under the right circumstances.

For the C's, they need to get better health from their other centers.  Both Oneals need to be completely healthy, and looking good to stay that way, and I think they may also need to be getting Sheed back to really make this truly viable.

For Houston, they need to be convinced enough that Perkins is a fit going forward to commit the money to him on an extension.  

But from a pure fit standpoint, this just makes a lot of sense...but it is certainly a risk for both teams that they are going to need to be in the right mindset to make.

Yeah, I agree completely.  This deal would make a lot of sense if the circumstances are right.


Houston needs a center they can rely on for the future; they have an excess of wings.  The Celtics desperately need a backup SF who can defend and hit outside shots (and also slot in at the 4 in small ball lineups); they have 3 centers who all deserve at least 20-25 minutes a night when healthy.


As much as I love Perk, I wouldn't mind this deal for 2 reasons:

1) He'd be going to my 2nd favorite team.
2) My favorite team, the Celtics, would be acquiring my favorite player, Shane Battier.

In short, I hope this happens, assuming JO and Shaq are healthy and productive.

[Fafnir]

I think there is too much uncertainty with Perkins, and his contract situation for Houston to consider this.

I think they'll look to rebuild now that Yao's "indefinitely" out and thus will be looking to move other parts. I can see Martin/Brooks being moved as much as Battier.

[PosImpos]

I think there is too much uncertainty with Perkins, and his contract situation for Houston to consider this.

I think they'll look to rebuild now that Yao's "indefinitely" out and thus will be looking to move other parts. I can see Martin/Brooks being moved as much as Battier.

Hm, I'm really skeptical about that.  Brooks and (especially) Kevin Martin are keepers.  Both are young and have All-Star potential.  It's unlikely they'd get equal return for them.  I think it would make more sense for them to make a play to try to get Iguodala.  Brooks / Martin / Iggy would make a good wing combination for them.

[Fafnir]

I think there is too much uncertainty with Perkins, and his contract situation for Houston to consider this.

I think they'll look to rebuild now that Yao's "indefinitely" out and thus will be looking to move other parts. I can see Martin/Brooks being moved as much as Battier.

Hm, I'm really skeptical about that.  Brooks and (especially) Kevin Martin are keepers.  Both are young and have All-Star potential.  It's unlikely they'd get equal return for them.  I think it would make more sense for them to make a play to try to get Iguodala.  Brooks / Martin / Iggy would make a good wing combination for them.

I think Martin is a keeper if slightly overpaid for what he does overall.

I think Brooks is going to ask for an extension well north of what he's worth. He's a scoring point who is only efficient when he can take 5 or 6 threes a game. He's not a passer, creator, or defender. Unless you have an all around wing like a Pierce/Kobe/LeBron it is tough to build a team with one of those. Combine that with his likely salary demands....

[PosImpos]

I think there is too much uncertainty with Perkins, and his contract situation for Houston to consider this.

I think they'll look to rebuild now that Yao's "indefinitely" out and thus will be looking to move other parts. I can see Martin/Brooks being moved as much as Battier.

Hm, I'm really skeptical about that.  Brooks and (especially) Kevin Martin are keepers.  Both are young and have All-Star potential.  It's unlikely they'd get equal return for them.  I think it would make more sense for them to make a play to try to get Iguodala.  Brooks / Martin / Iggy would make a good wing combination for them.

I think Martin is a keeper if slightly overpaid for what he does overall.

I think Brooks is going to ask for an extension well north of what he's worth. He's a scoring point who is only efficient when he can take 5 or 6 threes a game. He's not a passer, creator, or defender. Unless you have an all around wing like a Pierce/Kobe/LeBron it is tough to build a team with one of those. Combine that with his likely salary demands....

Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, and for what he does I think he's paid very fairly ($10 million for a guy who can score 20-25 points a game and occasionally blow up for 40 sounds just fine to me).  My only concern with Kevin Martin is that he's fairly fragile.  But if he weren't, and were more athletic, he'd probably command a considerably heftier salary.  

The Rockets should (and, I'm guessing, will) hold onto him.


You make a fair point about Brooks, but that also means his trade value isn't likely to be all that high.  As a high volume shooter who can probably play off the ball fairly well, he would work well alongside Iggy, who likes to handle the ball but can also play off it pretty well, and can create for others.

I think they should hold onto Brooks and see if they can sign him to a reasonable extension.  If not, they can sign and trade him for something.

[wdleehi]

No.

I am against trading big for small unless there is a huge talent difference.

I think Perk is more valuable to the Celtics in the playoffs then Battier would be. 

That depends on your personnel and your likely opposition.

Against Orlando it would be nice to have Perk to throw at Howard, but we still would have Shaq, JO, and to a lesser extent Baby. However, versus Miami I much rather have Battier.

For all the things Perk did well, let's not forget that he also hindered our offensive flow with his illegal screens, bad hands, lack of a post up game, and lack of a decent mid-range game. The reason why we would struggle in the past when teams went small (Atlanta for example) is because Perk simply wasn't able to exploit the mismatch offensively.

Until I see Miami do something against Boston, I am not about to make a trade to get smaller.

There is a reason Boston added so much size this offseason.  

And for all the struggles against smaller teams, name one that beat Boston in a 7 game series?

We beat Miami without Perk. Against them we'll be more than ok going with our current bigs. Perk won't be the difference in that series. Battier would have much more impact with his ability to defend James and hit the open shot as Miami will have to double down to help their bigs vs. Shaq, KG, or JO. If we have Perk in the game, you can easily play Bosh at the 5 without any threat that Perk will take advantage of him in the post.

The Celtics have beaten Miami twice with the swing rotation they have right now.


Orlando has beaten the Celtics when the Celtics did not have the full big man rotation in a 7 game series.