Ray Allen VS Kobe Bryant Head to Head Career Stats

[Vermont Green]

Kobe isn't going to get much rest on D, he is either going to be chasing ray around the court, or trying to stay in front of rondo.

This is a great post.  If Ray can match Kobe comparable to these career numbers, were are in good shape.

I have a different take on covering Rondo though. You don't have to chase Rondo, you just sag off him and wait in the paint.  I suspect we will see that match up but I don't see it causing any problem for Kobe.  It will actually be his rest time.

Not if Rondo has the ball.

Wow, too Vermont Fans here.  The only chasing that is needed to cover Rondo is in the tranition.  Once the offence is set, Kobe will not have to work all that hard to cover Rondo.  He can go under all screnes and doesn't have to extend even beyond the foul line.  Rondo will push the ball no matter who covers him so if we listen to Tommy and run, Rondo can cause trouble but that doesn't depend on who covers him.  If we run, Kobe has to run.

[MBz]

Kobe isn't going to get much rest on D, he is either going to be chasing ray around the court, or trying to stay in front of rondo.

This is a great post.  If Ray can match Kobe comparable to these career numbers, were are in good shape.

I have a different take on covering Rondo though. You don't have to chase Rondo, you just sag off him and wait in the paint.  I suspect we will see that match up but I don't see it causing any problem for Kobe.  It will actually be his rest time.

Not if Rondo has the ball.

Wow, too Vermont Fans here.  The only chasing that is needed to cover Rondo is in the tranition.  Once the offence is set, Kobe will not have to work all that hard to cover Rondo.  He can go under all screnes and doesn't have to extend even beyond the foul line.  Rondo will push the ball no matter who covers him so if we listen to Tommy and run, Rondo can cause trouble but that doesn't depend on who covers him.  If we run, Kobe has to run.

That can be fixed easily in the half court though.  Get the ball to Ray Allen and let Rondo work off him, let Rondo set a few screens, let Rondo slash a little bit.  If Kobe is going to sag, you need to attack him.  If you let Rondo set a screen on Derek Fisher who will be covering Allen, either Kobe helps on Ray and Rondo is going to have a lot of space to get open or we're getting a good look from Ray Allen.

[Witch-King]

I posted a video in a topic much earlier in the year that noted the effectiveness of the Boston Celtics' man-to-man defense on Kobe Bryant, though it was in a topic that was comparing Kobe to Michael Jordan, and not Ray Allen:

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=34243.msg653596#msg653596

I've found it interesting how much more serious and detailed these forum topics have gotten as the Celtics have progressed through the rest of the season and into the payoffs.

It is typical for a casual fan to point out some of the similarities between Kobe Bryant and Michael Jordan, however I find the head-to-head career stats vs Ray Allen to be much more telling, hype aside.

Though Ray Allen matches up well against Kobe no-one would ever make that sort of comparison between him and Michael Jordan.

[Vermont Green]

Kobe isn't going to get much rest on D, he is either going to be chasing ray around the court, or trying to stay in front of rondo.

This is a great post.  If Ray can match Kobe comparable to these career numbers, were are in good shape.

I have a different take on covering Rondo though. You don't have to chase Rondo, you just sag off him and wait in the paint.  I suspect we will see that match up but I don't see it causing any problem for Kobe.  It will actually be his rest time.

Not if Rondo has the ball.

Wow, too Vermont Fans here.  The only chasing that is needed to cover Rondo is in the tranition.  Once the offence is set, Kobe will not have to work all that hard to cover Rondo.  He can go under all screnes and doesn't have to extend even beyond the foul line.  Rondo will push the ball no matter who covers him so if we listen to Tommy and run, Rondo can cause trouble but that doesn't depend on who covers him.  If we run, Kobe has to run.

That can be fixed easily in the half court though.  Get the ball to Ray Allen and let Rondo work off him, let Rondo set a few screens, let Rondo slash a little bit.  If Kobe is going to sag, you need to attack him.  If you let Rondo set a screen on Derek Fisher who will be covering Allen, either Kobe helps on Ray and Rondo is going to have a lot of space to get open or we're getting a good look from Ray Allen.

I think that is a very interesting way to attack that match up, it will force the Lakers to switch.  From there though, Ray has the ball with Kobe on him with half or more of the shot clock gone.  Ray with the ball is not as dangerous as Ray off screnes so I don't think the Lakers mind that and it is still not really making Kobe work any more than say an average possession.  They may even switch back after a brief double and all Kobe has to do is drop back and find Rondo.  It is not like he is going to head to the corner and hit a 3.

[wahz]

Ive posted similar stats with regard to Kobe vs PP when that was the matchup. Likewise, PP didn't just neutralize him but outplayed him and had a decent won loss record despite being on an inferior team.

So the bottom line is that the Kobe/Artest vs Ray/Pierce matchup which LA really has to win, may well have a slight edge to Boston. Then you have the Gasol/Bynum/Odom vs Perk/KG/Sheed/Baby which la has to win also and may well not win. La is left with needing Fish to outplay Rondo....funny huh?

[ManUp]

I remember that before the '08 Finals, the media tried to create a "Ray/Kobe beef" to hype up the series.

But here is a very interesting article about Ray's comments after Shaq was traded to Miami. He basically predicted everything right about Kobe (will try to average 30 points a game, show to the league who he is, selfish, doesn't like his teammates, and will ask for a trade soon ). Pretty amazing to see how Ray was spot on actually at the time.

PORTLAND -- Ray Allen was suited up for the Sonics' preseason game against the Trail Blazers last night. He just wasn't in uniform, instead watching in a sports jacket as he sat out the game.

Allen suffered from a migraine headache and gastrointestinal disorder.

Because of the illness, Allen wasn't around to answer questions after the Sonics beat the Lakers 87-80 on Tuesday, but he was asked for a day-after assessment of Kobe Bryant's performance in his first game after Shaquille O'Neal was traded and coach Phil Jackson retired.

"He's going to be very selfish," Allen said of Bryant, who scored 15 of his team's first 20 points and had 35 points in Tuesday's loss. "And he feels like he needs to show this league and the people in this country that he is better without Shaq. He can win championships without Shaq. So offensively, he's going to jump out and say, 'I can average 30 points. I can still carry the load on this team.'

"I think the point production is not going to be so much what people are going to look at because (Tracy) McGrady did it in Orlando, Allen (Iverson) did it in Philly. Can you win a championship? I think that's the question. Carrying guys on your back and making everybody better."

Can Bryant do that?

"He has the talent, he can do it," Allen said. "But is his attitude going to allow him to take a back seat and let Lamar Odom shine and let Caron Butler have his nights and bring those big guys along with him?"

Allen said Bryant's ability and willingness to incorporate others will be the gauge for the Lakers' success. Bryant was re-signed for seven years at more than $130 million this summer.

"If Kobe doesn't see he needs two and a half good players to be a legitimate playoff contender or win a championship in about a year or two he'll be calling out to Jerry Buss that 'We need some help in here,' or 'Trade me,' " Allen said. "And we'll all be saying, 'I told you so,' when he says that."

Butler, who like Allen attended UConn, is in his third year in the league.

"His successes now is going to be based on if Kobe allows him to eat," Allen said of Butler. "If Kobe allows him to sit at the dinner table with him."

Allen was asked about the personal part of his game against Bryant. At different times, Bryant bumped into Allen and talked trash. After blocking a fast-break layin attempt by Allen, Bryant stared down at Allen, who had fallen to the floor, allowing Luke Ridnour to grab the loose ball and pass to Rashard Lewis for a dunk.

"I think he talks because he feels like he has to talk," Allen said. "He's out there playing, and if he does something good I feel like he needs to pat himself on the back because to me, it seems like he's isolated out there. As much as it's five-on-five, I don't see much camaraderie going on out there with his teammates."

Allen and Bryant were drafted the same year, 1996. Allen said that's one reason he thinks Bryant tries to turn any head-to-head meeting into a one-on-one battle. Bryant scored 15 of his team's 20 points in the first quarter and finished with 35. Allen scored 18 of his team-high 25 points in the second half.

"He thinks -- in his mind -- that he's going to shoot and try to show me up at any point in time on the floor," Allen said. "But his mentality and mine are different. I've got to do what it takes to help the team win."

One exchange captured what Allen was talking about. In the third quarter, Bryant made a 3-pointer over Allen and on Seattle's ensuing possession Allen made a 3-pointer over Bryant. Bryant answered with a 3-pointer, bumped into Allen at halfcourt and started talking.

"It was typical of the way he approaches the game and the way I approach it," Allen said. "I know it was set up for me to take that shot, no matter what situation I was in because that's what he did. And I wasn't going to fall into that trap because we were winning and he put himself in the situation where he has to come from behind."

Source

Ray hit the nail on the head.

I remember that article.

[rondohondo]

Ive posted similar stats with regard to Kobe vs PP when that was the matchup. Likewise, PP didn't just neutralize him but outplayed him and had a decent won loss record despite being on an inferior team.

So the bottom line is that the Kobe/Artest vs Ray/Pierce matchup which LA really has to win, may well have a slight edge to Boston. Then you have the Gasol/Bynum/Odom vs Perk/KG/Sheed/Baby which la has to win also and may well not win. La is left with needing Fish to outplay Rondo....funny huh?

Yea I really like the C's chances in this series, how could you not? The matchups are all very even at the 2 - 5 positions . Rondo just has to be aggresive at attacking the hoop . Ray is so much more effective when Rondo is in attack mode.



On a side not, I hope we see this matchup at some point again


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i19lSd7pAiE

 

[droopdog7]

I have pretty much been telling this to any and everybody saying that Kobe will dominate Ray.  He has never done it consistently before; why is he going to do it now?  Answer is he won't.

And yes, I have watched the Kobe-Ray match up very closely since way before Ray became a Celt.  And I am not talking about the stats. I mean watching actual games.  For some reason (and yes, it is inexplicable to a degree), Ray does a better job than almost anyone else of staying in front of Kobe. 

I also agree that this is a matchup that LA expects (hopes?) to win big.  But it won't happen.

[BballTim]

Kobe isn't going to get much rest on D, he is either going to be chasing ray around the court, or trying to stay in front of rondo.

This is a great post.  If Ray can match Kobe comparable to these career numbers, were are in good shape.

I have a different take on covering Rondo though. You don't have to chase Rondo, you just sag off him and wait in the paint.  I suspect we will see that match up but I don't see it causing any problem for Kobe.  It will actually be his rest time.

Not if Rondo has the ball.

Wow, too Vermont Fans here.  The only chasing that is needed to cover Rondo is in the tranition.  Once the offence is set, Kobe will not have to work all that hard to cover Rondo.  He can go under all screnes and doesn't have to extend even beyond the foul line.  Rondo will push the ball no matter who covers him so if we listen to Tommy and run, Rondo can cause trouble but that doesn't depend on who covers him.  If we run, Kobe has to run.

  If it was that easy to cover Rondo Cleveland would have beat us in 4 or 5 games.

[droopdog7]

Kobe isn't going to get much rest on D, he is either going to be chasing ray around the court, or trying to stay in front of rondo.

This is a great post.  If Ray can match Kobe comparable to these career numbers, were are in good shape.

I have a different take on covering Rondo though. You don't have to chase Rondo, you just sag off him and wait in the paint.  I suspect we will see that match up but I don't see it causing any problem for Kobe.  It will actually be his rest time.

Not if Rondo has the ball.

Wow, too Vermont Fans here.  The only chasing that is needed to cover Rondo is in the tranition.  Once the offence is set, Kobe will not have to work all that hard to cover Rondo.  He can go under all screnes and doesn't have to extend even beyond the foul line.  Rondo will push the ball no matter who covers him so if we listen to Tommy and run, Rondo can cause trouble but that doesn't depend on who covers him.  If we run, Kobe has to run.

  If it was that easy to cover Rondo Cleveland would have beat us in 4 or 5 games.

Rondo dominates the ball.  Whoever is guarding him has to expend energy just moving their feet to keep him in front.  So even if Rondo isn't driving all game, defenders will still use more energy than someone guarding their man off the ball.