Big Three or build around Rondo?

[ForexPirate]

i think it is time for the superstars (the big 3) who have made enough money for several lifetimes, to renegotiate their contracts at a discount and extend them into the future to make up the difference.  This may allow Danny to be a player in this years free agency.  This team could be great into the future with a wade, lebron or bosch

trade perk and bbd and start building around rondo

pp, kg, and ray allen start adjusting to role playing - major roles but role playing never the less.

re-sign tony allen and maybe nate

[Brendan]

The rebuilding will center around Rondo which I think everyone here considers a given.  I think the question is when, rather than if.

The way things are looking, I don't think that's going to happen until after KG's contract expires.  I think Danny is sticking with this core until then.  He'll shuffle bench players until then but the starting lineup will stay the same at least through next year.  In KG's last year, there may be a chance Ray shifts to 6th man if Danny picks up a quality guard this year in the draft.  I don't think that shift is too likely though simply because I think Danny will resign TA for 2 years, resign Ray for 2 years and use the MLE on either Outlaw or Miller giving the C's 4 good wings (including PP).  Neither TA or Outlaw/Miller figures to replace Ray as a starter so Ray will more than likely continue to start while he's here.

What people seem to be dismissing is the possibility of KG not retiring after his contract ends.  If he's still playing well after 2 more years, I fully expect him to look for another contract for 2-3 years before retiring.  The question is, what do the C's do at that point?  He'd probably still be a good player at that point, if not a starter than as the 1st big off the bench.  Does Danny just cut him loose or resign him?  By then, Danny has resigned PP, probably for 2-3 more years after his current contract expires (and hopefully shifting to 6th man by then and looking to retire a C at the end).

The more I think about the current course, I'd be more surprised than not if Danny actually did blow up the team and trade the big 3.  He will hopefully have found some more quality in the draft and picked up some nice players but I don't think he'll be positioned to make a big splash in free agency in 2012.

I think Pierce off the bench makes more sense. I think its easier to find a SF that could play with KG, RA, and RR - then it is to find a SG to play with RR and PP. Plus Pierce off the bench would let him see minutes against weaker defenders in the middle of each half, and still be used late in the game. If Doc can get PP to accept this move and Danny can find a SF that makes it worthwhile, they will be doing a great job.

Perk is a favorite of mine - but realistically it may be easier to improve the talent by using him in a trade and bringing in a similar type guy with the MLE.

[RJ87]

Right now, my perfect summer would have the C's turning Ray and Perk (perhaps through a third team) into a sign and traded Amare, followed by the C's picking up some shooters from the wing (lets say, Travis Outlaw, Kyle Korver, and Luke Babbit), and basically becoming Los Suns East. 

I am sure this will change about 30 times before July 1st, but after watching Rondo today, and seeing Los Suns on the verge of sweeping the Spurs, I think I could really get into watching Rondo working in an a wide open game, with KG and Amare up front, and some shooters on the wings.

They may never be able to beat Lebron and whoever he ends up with in the playoffs...but I don't know if there is anyway they would be able to anyways after this year.  But I would get over that, if I could watch that kind of basketball.

I want Outlaw SO bad, lol...

But I agree with everything you said (I'd even be interested in Beasley instead of Amar'e). I've always said that Rondo is already so good and our offense really isn't "tailored" to his style of play. Imagine if we put the right pieces around him and we went more uptempo ala Steve Nash/Phoenix Suns.

[Chris]

i think it is time for the superstars (the big 3) who have made enough money for several lifetimes, to renegotiate their contracts at a discount and extend them into the future to make up the difference.  This may allow Danny to be a player in this years free agency.  This team could be great into the future with a wade, lebron or bosch

trade perk and bbd and start building around rondo

pp, kg, and ray allen start adjusting to role playing - major roles but role playing never the less.

re-sign tony allen and maybe nate

Well, this isn't the NFL, so someone like KG, who does not have an option cannot simply renegotiate.  Pierce and Ray could, but even if both of them did, it would still be impossible for them to have enough cap space to resign both of them (even for greatly reduced salaries), and sign a superstar.

Getting into this even more, Ray is a FA, and he will be taking a significant paycut, no matter where he plays next year(that is just the market).  

Pierce on the other hand can opt out of his $21.5 million option for next year, and then decide to resign for a longer term, at a lower sum.  However, it is important to remember that if he does that, all he will be doing is saving the owners cash next season (since they will still be well over the cap), and then it likely locks him in for more money in future seasons then he would probably make, if the C's waited until next summer to resign him.  

It certainly makes some sense fiscally for the C's, since they are almost certainly going to be in the luxury tax this season, so saving say, $6 million in salary in 2010 will actually save them $12 million, and there is a much greater chance of them being below the luxury tax threshold in 2011 and beyond, meaning, that even if Pierce makes up the money he is missing next year over the life of the contract, that luxury tax money is basically found money for the owners.  However, a deal like that would likely tie the C's hands a bit in the rebuilding/reloading process, since Pierce would likely end up overpaid in the deal, over the next few years.

The smartest thing cap wise is probably to just let Pierce come off the books after next season (or resign him then for a reasonable deal).  But that will take a financial commitment from ownership.

[Evantime34]

Unless KG and Sheed retire along with Ray not resigning and Pierce optiing out we are going to be seeing the big 3 until KG's contract exprires.

That's not to say we don't build around Rondo through the draft. I look for us to go after long athletic players who can run the floor and finish passes from Rondo. I feel like in a year or two players might start to take a pay cut to play with Rondo because he would make their numbers look better (by getting them layups).

[LooseCannon]

How drastically does this discussion change if the Celtics pull it out and actually win the title this season and get at least to the conference finals for the last two season's of KG's contract?

[Chris]

How drastically does this discussion change if the Celtics pull it out and actually win the title this season and get at least to the conference finals for the last two season's of KG's contract?

For me?  None.  All it might change is that they might be asking for a little more value back for their players.  But this team is what it is, and whether they win a championship this year or not, they are going to need to make a transition in the next couple of years.  But exactly when and how is going to have everything to do with value.

[rav123]

Right now, my perfect summer would have the C's turning Ray and Perk (perhaps through a third team) into a sign and traded Amare, followed by the C's picking up some shooters from the wing (lets say, Travis Outlaw, Kyle Korver, and Luke Babbit), and basically becoming Los Suns East. 

I am sure this will change about 30 times before July 1st, but after watching Rondo today, and seeing Los Suns on the verge of sweeping the Spurs, I think I could really get into watching Rondo working in an a wide open game, with KG and Amare up front, and some shooters on the wings.

They may never be able to beat Lebron and whoever he ends up with in the playoffs...but I don't know if there is anyway they would be able to anyways after this year.  But I would get over that, if I could watch that kind of basketball.

I want Outlaw SO bad, lol...

But I agree with everything you said (I'd even be interested in Beasley instead of Amar'e). I've always said that Rondo is already so good and our offense really isn't "tailored" to his style of play. Imagine if we put the right pieces around him and we went more uptempo ala Steve Nash/Phoenix Suns.

Our defense is tailored to him though. We have great interior defense which allows him to gamble for steals, and our big men hedge so well he can fight through screens weakly yet still not cost the team.

Our D could get atrocious with Amare, and for a team that builds itself on defence that may not work.

[wdleehi]

How drastically does this discussion change if the Celtics pull it out and actually win the title this season and get at least to the conference finals for the last two season's of KG's contract?

For me?  None.  All it might change is that they might be asking for a little more value back for their players.  But this team is what it is, and whether they win a championship this year or not, they are going to need to make a transition in the next couple of years.  But exactly when and how is going to have everything to do with value.

I think if they win a title, the starters earn a chance to come back and defend their titles.


The bench on the other hand should have some changes.

[makaveli]

How drastically does this discussion change if the Celtics pull it out and actually win the title this season and get at least to the conference finals for the last two season's of KG's contract?

For me?  None.  All it might change is that they might be asking for a little more value back for their players.  But this team is what it is, and whether they win a championship this year or not, they are going to need to make a transition in the next couple of years.  But exactly when and how is going to have everything to do with value.

I think if they win a title, the starters earn a chance to come back and defend their titles.


The bench on the other hand should have some changes.

Yeah, how many teams won the title, and than went rebuilding next season...No one probably

[wdleehi]

How drastically does this discussion change if the Celtics pull it out and actually win the title this season and get at least to the conference finals for the last two season's of KG's contract?

For me?  None.  All it might change is that they might be asking for a little more value back for their players.  But this team is what it is, and whether they win a championship this year or not, they are going to need to make a transition in the next couple of years.  But exactly when and how is going to have everything to do with value.

I think if they win a title, the starters earn a chance to come back and defend their titles.


The bench on the other hand should have some changes.

Yeah, how many teams won the title, and than went rebuilding next season...No one probably

Da-Bulls!

[ScoobyDoo]

Whether they win or not this year. I revamp my bench over the summer. But if they aren't dominant heading toward the treade deadline, looking like they have as good  a shot as anyone to win it, I seriously consider blowing it up and getting on with it in building around Rondo.

I guess an argument could be said that competing and making it to the second or ECF the next 2-3 years is pretty good. But then Rondo would be 26 or 27 and you're looking at 2-3 years to build around him ( or longer ) through the draft / free agents...now he's 29-30...you start next year, he'll be 27 or 28 when you could conceivably have put together the enxt team for a run with Rondo for another 7-8 years...

The ideal scenario would be to somehow, some way land  Dwade or Joe Johnson type this summer. Next to impossible, I know.

But that way, as the big three fade, you'd still have:

Perkins
Baby
TA
Rondo or Joe Johnson
Wade

Just add a few more pieces in place of TA & Baby and you are off and running...

Very important next 2-3 years for Ainge and Co. If they get lucky, a la Red used to, they might be able to be back up on top sooner than alot of us think. It all depends on making a few right moves and having a little luck.