The (alleged) fractures in the Celtics locker room

[mmbaby]

I KNOW that no one here personally knows Sheed, or is in the C's locker room or gets phone calls from the players regularly or ever! Each and every word of this is pure speculation, including from the media guys, who tend to embelish and tweek 'every' word to sell stories. (Oh, but maybe the rumour from the gossip who 'works in the restaurant industry' is legit, yes, for sure his words must be true).
The nasty and cruel almost 'hatred' here for Sheed just astounds me! It's much more than just saying you don't like his play or his anger mgmt. issues. It really is beyond reality. No one knows why he does this or that or doesn't do this or that. It's all speculation that heavily leans to the negative theories. And theories are just what they are, not facts.
I personally have honestly never been able to understand where the problem is with Sheed and some on the CBlog. Unless maybe he was expected to be a KG for us. He's a good first or second man off the bench and I feel much more comfortable with him out there than most of the bench. He is mature and steady and talented, even calm during play, though his temper gets out of hand sometimes. In some games he seems to slow down and not play as well and I always think he must be having a bad night which comes with age and wear and tear. I've never assumed he was 'lazy'. I honestly don't know where that perception comes from just observing him, and not knowing him personally. Watching KG out there this year, sometimes he 'looks' lazy. So do a lot of the guys at various times. But it is not lazy. These guys are not lazy. Lazy implies apathy. If they didn't care about the games, they, including Sheed, would not get so darn upset at the refs with calls are bad. Also, consider that these are young guys (even though some might be considered old in basketball speak) and they have egos and they are not going to go out there on national and internat. TV and not care about their game and their play. They do have pride.
Stop using Sheed as the team scapegoat. The team is losing for reasons we do not know. I read one post on another thread where someone was just furious at BBD because he 'might' not have told Doc he had the flu when he played last game and 'surely that's what caused Rhondo to have the flu now.
I guess it's the negative speculation that bothers me, when it could be more realistic and informed by sound and reasonable judgement. I guess I've written more than enough here, but am so tired of the nastiness. It's completely unnecessary and not helpful.   

[indeedproceed]

I guess it's the negative speculation that bothers me, when it could be more realistic and informed by sound and reasonable judgement. I guess I've written more than enough here, but am so tired of the nastiness. It's completely unnecessary and not helpful.   

What do you mean by 'unhelpful'? I could see how maybe it is unnecessary. Watching Celtics games is unnecessary, like posting on Celticsblog is unnecessary, or playing modern warfare 2 is unnecessary...we do those things because we want to, because they bring us satisfaction. If someone sees Sheed play in a way they think is poorly and detrimental to the team and rants about it on Cblog to try and convey emotions about an interest they share with others who share that interest..that's unnecessary. They do it because they want to, you know?

But how exactly is it 'unhelpful'?

[thirstyboots18]

I KNOW that no one here personally knows Sheed, or is in the C's locker room or gets phone calls from the players regularly or ever! Each and every word of this is pure speculation, including from the media guys, who tend to embelish and tweek 'every' word to sell stories. (Oh, but maybe the rumour from the gossip who 'works in the restaurant industry' is legit, yes, for sure his words must be true).
The nasty and cruel almost 'hatred' here for Sheed just astounds me! It's much more than just saying you don't like his play or his anger mgmt. issues. It really is beyond reality. No one knows why he does this or that or doesn't do this or that. It's all speculation that heavily leans to the negative theories. And theories are just what they are, not facts.
I personally have honestly never been able to understand where the problem is with Sheed and some on the CBlog. Unless maybe he was expected to be a KG for us. He's a good first or second man off the bench and I feel much more comfortable with him out there than most of the bench. He is mature and steady and talented, even calm during play, though his temper gets out of hand sometimes. In some games he seems to slow down and not play as well and I always think he must be having a bad night which comes with age and wear and tear. I've never assumed he was 'lazy'. I honestly don't know where that perception comes from just observing him, and not knowing him personally. Watching KG out there this year, sometimes he 'looks' lazy. So do a lot of the guys at various times. But it is not lazy. These guys are not lazy. Lazy implies apathy. If they didn't care about the games, they, including Sheed, would not get so darn upset at the refs with calls are bad. Also, consider that these are young guys (even though some might be considered old in basketball speak) and they have egos and they are not going to go out there on national and internat. TV and not care about their game and their play. They do have pride.
Stop using Sheed as the team scapegoat. The team is losing for reasons we do not know. I read one post on another thread where someone was just furious at BBD because he 'might' not have told Doc he had the flu when he played last game and 'surely that's what caused Rhondo to have the flu now.
I guess it's the negative speculation that bothers me, when it could be more realistic and informed by sound and reasonable judgement. I guess I've written more than enough here, but am so tired of the nastiness. It's completely unnecessary and not helpful.  

I am sorry you find everyone on this blog to be so negative, mmmbaby, and I agree that some are,  but any ood discussion is about an "exchange" of different opinions" and not necessarily about everyone agreeing about everything.  IMO  each side of an equation has to be respected.  I am not always right (though it pains me to admit it   ) and I suspect, neither are you.  I love this team and have high hopes for what Sheed will mean to us in the playoffs...I think, in his career, he has been one of the best low post players ever. It is also my opinion that Glen Davis  has not been that helpful this year. I also like Doc Rivers as a coach. Many disagree with me about some or all of these opinions.  

I am very grateful to have a quality blog like this one, where I can voice my opinions, and maybe I can learn something at the same time and, although I agree with you on a lot of things, I am glad for the differing opinions, positive and negative, that appear here.  

[Steve Weinman]

The nasty and cruel almost 'hatred' here for Sheed just astounds me! It's much more than just saying you don't like his play or his anger mgmt. issues. It really is beyond reality. No one knows why he does this or that or doesn't do this or that. It's all speculation that heavily leans to the negative theories. And theories are just what they are, not facts.
I personally have honestly never been able to understand where the problem is with Sheed and some on the CBlog. Unless maybe he was expected to be a KG for us. He's a good first or second man off the bench and I feel much more comfortable with him out there than most of the bench. He is mature and steady and talented, even calm during play, though his temper gets out of hand sometimes. In some games he seems to slow down and not play as well and I always think he must be having a bad night which comes with age and wear and tear. I've never assumed he was 'lazy'. I honestly don't know where that perception comes from just observing him, and not knowing him personally. Watching KG out there this year, sometimes he 'looks' lazy. So do a lot of the guys at various times. But it is not lazy. These guys are not lazy. Lazy implies apathy. If they didn't care about the games, they, including Sheed, would not get so darn upset at the refs with calls are bad. Also, consider that these are young guys (even though some might be considered old in basketball speak) and they have egos and they are not going to go out there on national and internat. TV and not care about their game and their play. They do have pride.
Stop using Sheed as the team scapegoat. The team is losing for reasons we do not know. I read one post on another thread where someone was just furious at BBD because he 'might' not have told Doc he had the flu when he played last game and 'surely that's what caused Rhondo to have the flu now.
I guess it's the negative speculation that bothers me, when it could be more realistic and informed by sound and reasonable judgement. I guess I've written more than enough here, but am so tired of the nastiness. It's completely unnecessary and not helpful.   

Good morning.  It's interesting to me that you asked for "sound and reasonable judgment" rather than "speculation" as conclusion to a post in which your defense of Rasheed Wallace was based wholly on throwing out some positive character traits whose respective values on the basketball court remain - at their absolute best - unclear.

I understand that you were addressing the blog as a whole.  I can't speak for everyone or even for "some" on CBlog.  But as far as "I personally have never been able to understand where the problem is with Sheed and some on the CBlog," here's how I see it:

Rasheed Wallace has posted a true shooting percentage of 50.4 as a Celtic, which, to put it kindly, is bad. Contributing to that mark is the three-point shooting that was supposed to help him add a floor-stretching big presence to the lineup: 28.3 percent, also bad. 

Rasheed Wallace's rebound rate this season is 11.2 percent, which is nothing short of horrific for a big man.  For some perspective on this, consider please that Mikki Moore - he of extraordinary defensive and rebounding incompetence - posted a rebound rate of 14.1 percent in his brief-but-not-brief-enough time as a Celtic.

According to 82games.com, just 16 percent of Rasheed's field-goal attempts have come from what is considered "inside." Rasheed Wallace is 83 inches tall.  This is a problem.

The Celtics are 2.3 points per 100 possessions worse offensively when Rasheed is on the court rather than off it, and they are 2.6 points per 100 possessions worse defensively when he is on the court rather than off it.  That's a net of minus-4.9 points per 100 possessions with Rasheed on the court as opposed to off it.  That's a problem.

I've watched more than enough Celtics basketball this season to have compiled the anecdotal evidence to not be shocked by any of this.  His shot selection has been poor, the shots he's taken haven't gone in, and he hasn't rebounded well.  And I could tell you also that he's looked a step - or at times, several - slow on defensive rotations throughout the year.

No question statistics don't tell us everything, but over the breadth of a season, they do a fairly accurate job of telling the story.

So all of that is just what I can verify.  I would hardly fault someone for also throwing in commentary about his technical fouls, his shouting match with Doc Rivers during the Cleveland game or the anecdotes to indicate that he *has* looked lazy on the floor this year.  But sadly, all that is merely a cherry on top of the case against Rasheed Wallace's contributions - or lack thereof - for the Celtics this season.

That's my best attempt at meeting your "sound and reasonable judgment" standard.  Calling the board out, however, for speculation while doing nothing more than throwing out your own set of adjectives (and yes, it seems odd to me that you selected "mature" for the on-court behavior of someone up near the league lead in technical fouls this season) with no evidence rings false to me.

Or maybe it's only positive speculation that you feel is warranted?

-sw

[CoachBo]

The nasty and cruel almost 'hatred' here for Sheed just astounds me! It's much more than just saying you don't like his play or his anger mgmt. issues. It really is beyond reality. No one knows why he does this or that or doesn't do this or that. It's all speculation that heavily leans to the negative theories. And theories are just what they are, not facts.
I personally have honestly never been able to understand where the problem is with Sheed and some on the CBlog. Unless maybe he was expected to be a KG for us. He's a good first or second man off the bench and I feel much more comfortable with him out there than most of the bench. He is mature and steady and talented, even calm during play, though his temper gets out of hand sometimes. In some games he seems to slow down and not play as well and I always think he must be having a bad night which comes with age and wear and tear. I've never assumed he was 'lazy'. I honestly don't know where that perception comes from just observing him, and not knowing him personally. Watching KG out there this year, sometimes he 'looks' lazy. So do a lot of the guys at various times. But it is not lazy. These guys are not lazy. Lazy implies apathy. If they didn't care about the games, they, including Sheed, would not get so darn upset at the refs with calls are bad. Also, consider that these are young guys (even though some might be considered old in basketball speak) and they have egos and they are not going to go out there on national and internat. TV and not care about their game and their play. They do have pride.
Stop using Sheed as the team scapegoat. The team is losing for reasons we do not know. I read one post on another thread where someone was just furious at BBD because he 'might' not have told Doc he had the flu when he played last game and 'surely that's what caused Rhondo to have the flu now.
I guess it's the negative speculation that bothers me, when it could be more realistic and informed by sound and reasonable judgement. I guess I've written more than enough here, but am so tired of the nastiness. It's completely unnecessary and not helpful.  

Good morning.  It's interesting to me that you asked for "sound and reasonable judgment" rather than "speculation" as conclusion to a post in which your defense of Rasheed Wallace was based wholly on throwing out some positive character traits whose respective values on the basketball court remain - at their absolute best - unclear.

I understand that you were addressing the blog as a whole.  I can't speak for everyone or even for "some" on CBlog.  But as far as "I personally have never been able to understand where the problem is with Sheed and some on the CBlog," here's how I see it:

Rasheed Wallace has posted a true shooting percentage of 50.4 as a Celtic, which, to put it kindly, is bad. Contributing to that mark is the three-point shooting that was supposed to help him add a floor-stretching big presence to the lineup: 28.3 percent, also bad.  

Rasheed Wallace's rebound rate this season is 11.2 percent, which is nothing short of horrific for a big man.  For some perspective on this, consider please that Mikki Moore - he of extraordinary defensive and rebounding incompetence - posted a rebound rate of 14.1 percent in his brief-but-not-brief-enough time as a Celtic.

According to 82games.com, just 16 percent of Rasheed's field-goal attempts have come from what is considered "inside." Rasheed Wallace is 83 inches tall.  This is a problem.

The Celtics are 2.3 points per 100 possessions worse offensively when Rasheed is on the court rather than off it, and they are 2.6 points per 100 possessions worse defensively when he is on the court rather than off it.  That's a net of minus-4.9 points per 100 possessions with Rasheed on the court as opposed to off it.  That's a problem.

I've watched more than enough Celtics basketball this season to have compiled the anecdotal evidence to not be shocked by any of this.  His shot selection has been poor, the shots he's taken haven't gone in, and he hasn't rebounded well.  And I could tell you also that he's looked a step - or at times, several - slow on defensive rotations throughout the year.

No question statistics don't tell us everything, but over the breadth of a season, they do a fairly accurate job of telling the story.

So all of that is just what I can verify.  I would hardly fault someone for also throwing in commentary about his technical fouls, his shouting match with Doc Rivers during the Cleveland game or the anecdotes to indicate that he *has* looked lazy on the floor this year.  But sadly, all that is merely a cherry on top of the case against Rasheed Wallace's contributions - or lack thereof - for the Celtics this season.

That's my best attempt at meeting your "sound and reasonable judgment" standard.  Calling the board out, however, for speculation while doing nothing more than throwing out your own set of adjectives (and yes, it seems odd to me that you selected "mature" for the on-court behavior of someone up near the league lead in technical fouls this season) with no evidence rings false to me.

Or maybe it's only positive speculation that you feel is warranted?

-sw

A spot on analysis as usual, Steve.

A couple of additional, non-stats thoughts:

This used to be my favorite phrase with Paddy O'Blount: You can't coach effort.

Such is similarly the case with Wallace. He's a step slow defensively because he's been overweight all season. Combine that with the fact that he just NEVER gives adequate defensive effort, and you have an intense defensive liability at the 4 - a position where he never should have been used, IMHO.

Sadly, it never ceases to disappoint me how much energy people devote to defending their favorite players - when in reality none of them is any more than a single piece in a team game. Hence, any sign of a locker room issue, regardless of the year or the form, is a sign of a problem. Again, people who think that a thirst for winning solves every locker room problem are wildly off-base. There isn't a team at any level that doesn't want to win. Egos frequently get in the way.

The Wallace experiment has failed, I am ready to conclude, for the reasons you state and the reasons I add.

[thirstyboots18]

Coach Bo, I am going to withhold my judgement on Sheed, as this experiment is not yet over.  I agree he has been a disappointment, and did not come here in the best of shape, but he has "been playing his way into shape"  (I hope,  ) and I am still hoping for an absolutely brilliant fireworks display of basketball intensity and skill from Sheed during the Playoffs!  (Maybe I am carrying on a little too much, ya think?    ) ha ha ha ha ha