Is Your Pick Two Team Better than When it Started?

[Slugger]

The new LA Pigs.


PG  Foye
SG  Kobe
SF  Turk
PF  Gasol
C   Gortat


Bench

SG/PG  Redick  (He works as a PG in the Triangle offense much like a Ron Harper.  Kobe and Turk are the true PGs)
PF   Tyler Hansbrough

Offensively, the team is strong.  The next couple of roll players need to bring the defense.  

The Pigs are sticking with Foye?  I thought you'd have done something there by now.

And your bench absolutely stinks.  Reddick really is a hot/cold shooter.  I think as the big games roll on, he disappears.  Hansborough may have good fundamentals, but he's simply too short and has limited hops.

[Slugger]

The "New Look" Denver Nuggets:


Starting Five:

C  -  Mehmet Okur (12.7 PPG)                  $9,000,000.00
PF - Al Harrington (17.8 PPG)                $10,026,875.00
SF - Carmelo Anthony (29.7 PPG)        $15,779,912.00
SG - Josh Howard (12.1 PPG)              $10,890,000.00
PG - Chauncey Billups (19.2 PPG)       $12,100,000.00


Bench:

PG - Jerryd Bayless (9.7 PPG)                $2,143,080.00
SG - Chris Douglas-Roberts (12.6 PPG) $736,420.00

Total Budget so far:                               $60,676,287.00

 

The Josh Howard inclusion/pick stands out like a sore thumb to me.  I think he makes that starting 5 worse.  Not a good perimeter shooter, or ball handler.

That really is a perimeter orientated offense though.  Although Melo and Harrington do get into the post, you really need a banger down there (Nene/KMart).

I think defensively it will be a real struggle.  WHilst Okur is a capable defender, he isnt a shot blocking threat. 

Also, as mentioned, rebounding is a real weakness.  Although their collective rebounding numbers may be ok, you really need that one or two glass eaters to be competitive.  The 6 rebounds that Okur, Melo and Harrington get are only by chance due to the fact that there teams have double digit rebounders that cant grab every rebound.

Can you imagine the rebounding battle between your team and CelticsClays Spurs.

Dalembert v Okur
Duncan v Harrington
Marion v Melo

The Nugs get killed

Totally disagree ... while I would concur that the Spurs are more defensively oriented, the Nuggets would destroy them on offense. My starting five AVERAGES over 90 points/game, and as far as Howard making the team worse, I just don't see that at all. I could easily say that every other's teams rebounds are "by chance" as well, but making that kind of blanket statement about ANY team is just plain wrong. One or two RBS per game per player may happen by chance, but saying all of the Nuggets' rebounds are not worked for or earned is WAY off. The Nuggets are a huge threat offensively from outside AND in the paint, if you check the numbers closely. Sorry, but this assessment just doesn't stand up under scrutiny. We ALL think our team is the best, obviously, but I no matter how you look at it, this team is a contender ... and Bayless and CDR off the bench? I'm lovin' this lineup.

Just telling it from how i see it.  Your team is good, better than mine, dont get me wrong.

I just think that you have a chance to form a great team with Chauncey and Melo, and a player like Josh Howard doesnt do that.

Offensively, you are already ahead of the pack with Billups and Melo. Okur does spread the floor, so i dont mind that pick.  I just question Howard and Harrington.

I dont think either adds to the team on either side of the ball (in the starting line-up)  Harrington at least has bench player value.


Concerning rebounding.. they are easily giving opposing teams, e.g Spurs, at least an extra 15-20 shots through their lack of rebounding.

They are going to have to score like the 80's Nuggets did.  I just fear that they will give up points at the rate that 80's team did too.  That team collectively cannot stop many teams.

[Bahku]

The "New Look" Denver Nuggets:


Starting Five:

C  -  Mehmet Okur (12.7 PPG)                  $9,000,000.00
PF - Al Harrington (17.8 PPG)                $10,026,875.00
SF - Carmelo Anthony (29.7 PPG)        $15,779,912.00
SG - Josh Howard (12.1 PPG)              $10,890,000.00
PG - Chauncey Billups (19.2 PPG)       $12,100,000.00


Bench:

PG - Jerryd Bayless (9.7 PPG)                $2,143,080.00
SG - Chris Douglas-Roberts (12.6 PPG) $736,420.00

Total Budget so far:                               $60,676,287.00

 

The Josh Howard inclusion/pick stands out like a sore thumb to me.  I think he makes that starting 5 worse.  Not a good perimeter shooter, or ball handler.

That really is a perimeter orientated offense though.  Although Melo and Harrington do get into the post, you really need a banger down there (Nene/KMart).

I think defensively it will be a real struggle.  WHilst Okur is a capable defender, he isnt a shot blocking threat. 

Also, as mentioned, rebounding is a real weakness.  Although their collective rebounding numbers may be ok, you really need that one or two glass eaters to be competitive.  The 6 rebounds that Okur, Melo and Harrington get are only by chance due to the fact that there teams have double digit rebounders that cant grab every rebound.

Can you imagine the rebounding battle between your team and CelticsClays Spurs.

Dalembert v Okur
Duncan v Harrington
Marion v Melo

The Nugs get killed

Totally disagree ... while I would concur that the Spurs are more defensively oriented, the Nuggets would destroy them on offense. My starting five AVERAGES over 90 points/game, and as far as Howard making the team worse, I just don't see that at all. I could easily say that every other's teams rebounds are "by chance" as well, but making that kind of blanket statement about ANY team is just plain wrong. One or two RBS per game per player may happen by chance, but saying all of the Nuggets' rebounds are not worked for or earned is WAY off. The Nuggets are a huge threat offensively from outside AND in the paint, if you check the numbers closely. Sorry, but this assessment just doesn't stand up under scrutiny. We ALL think our team is the best, obviously, but I no matter how you look at it, this team is a contender ... and Bayless and CDR off the bench? I'm lovin' this lineup.

Just telling it from how i see it.  Your team is good, better than mine, dont get me wrong.

I just think that you have a chance to form a great team with Chauncey and Melo, and a player like Josh Howard doesnt do that.

Offensively, you are already ahead of the pack with Billups and Melo. Okur does spread the floor, so i dont mind that pick.  I just question Howard and Harrington.

I dont think either adds to the team on either side of the ball (in the starting line-up)  Harrington at least has bench player value.


Concerning rebounding.. they are easily giving opposing teams, e.g Spurs, at least an extra 15-20 shots through their lack of rebounding.

They are going to have to score like the 80's Nuggets did.  I just fear that they will give up points at the rate that 80's team did too.  That team collectively cannot stop many teams.

The Spurs starting five out-rebound my team by a 5.6 margin, which is not much ... however, my team outscores them by 20.9 points average, a huge margin, which the extra 5.6 RBS are not going to compensate for. As far as Howard and Harrington, they're both extremely athletic and average about 30 pts between the two and about 10 RBS ... I understand where you're coming from, I just don't agree with how you come to your conclusion, cuz the numbers do not reflect it at all. I think Harrington and Howard especially would be a perfect tandem for Melo, and Okur is going to benefit in a big way by the athleticism of the other starting four. My bench as it stands adds another 22 points and 5.6 RBS ... I'm likin' it.

[Slugger]

I dont think you can assess these "teams" that we are creating by just adding up the numbers.

The fact is that there isnt a good rebounder on your team.  Who is going to do the dirty work?

If a shot is launched and missed, i guarantee that 7 or 8 times out of 10 that Spurs team is rebounding that ball.  Your team may be good offensively, but they are not getting every shot in.

Your team may shoot 55% from the field.  The Spurs on the other hand, may only shoot 50%.  However, when the Spurs miss half of their shots, they are going to get alot of second chance poinst out of their offensive rebounding.

I think you may be downplaying the importance of rebounding the ball.  Your team collectively is not a good rebounding team.  That affects the scoring capacity of both teams.

Easily fixed though through trades as you have good individual pieces.

I give you credit for your 2 bench picks.  I think they are 8th and 9th players on a good team, but nonetheless they are nice young players

[Bahku]

I dont think you can assess these "teams" that we are creating by just adding up the numbers.

The fact is that there isnt a good rebounder on your team.  Who is going to do the dirty work?

If a shot is launched and missed, i guarantee that 7 or 8 times out of 10 that Spurs team is rebounding that ball.  Your team may be good offensively, but they are not getting every shot in.

Your team may shoot 55% from the field.  The Spurs on the other hand, may only shoot 50%.  However, when the Spurs miss half of their shots, they are going to get alot of second chance poinst out of their offensive rebounding.

I think you may be downplaying the importance of rebounding the ball.  Your team collectively is not a good rebounding team.  That affects the scoring capacity of both teams.

Easily fixed though through trades as you have good individual pieces.

I give you credit for your 2 bench picks.  I think they are 8th and 9th players on a good team, but nonetheless they are nice young players

What the Spurs have over the Nuggets defensively is just not going to make up for the huge difference on offense ... and Okur, Harrington and even Melo can bang inside when they need to. I think the biggest threat would be Duncan, obviously, but this young team could play a very effective zone to take care of that. Anyway ... I'll agree to disagree, and a TP for the good discussion, Sir.

[Bahku]

UPDATE:

The "New Look" Denver Nuggets:


Starting Five:                                PPG                  Salary            RB/G

C  -  Mehmet Okur                      12.7       $  9,000,000.00         6.7
PF - Al Harrington                       17.8       $10,026,875.00         5.8
SF - Carmelo Anthony                29.7      $15,779,912.00         6.5
SG - Josh Howard                      12.1       $10,890,000.00        3.6
PG - Chauncey Billups              19.2       $12,100,000.00        3.0


Bench:

PG - Jerryd Bayless                    9.7         $2,143,080.00         1.5
SG - Chris Douglas-Roberts   12.6        $   736,420.00         4.1

Total Budget so far:                                $60,676,287.00

 
        (Wide Page Mode)

[Slugger]

I dont think you can assess these "teams" that we are creating by just adding up the numbers.

The fact is that there isnt a good rebounder on your team.  Who is going to do the dirty work?

If a shot is launched and missed, i guarantee that 7 or 8 times out of 10 that Spurs team is rebounding that ball.  Your team may be good offensively, but they are not getting every shot in.

Your team may shoot 55% from the field.  The Spurs on the other hand, may only shoot 50%.  However, when the Spurs miss half of their shots, they are going to get alot of second chance poinst out of their offensive rebounding.

I think you may be downplaying the importance of rebounding the ball.  Your team collectively is not a good rebounding team.  That affects the scoring capacity of both teams.

Easily fixed though through trades as you have good individual pieces.

I give you credit for your 2 bench picks.  I think they are 8th and 9th players on a good team, but nonetheless they are nice young players

What the Spurs have over the Nuggets defensively is just not going to make up for the huge difference on offense ... and Okur, Harrington and even Melo can bang inside when they need to. I think the biggest threat would be Duncan, obviously, but this young team could play a very effective zone to take care of that. Anyway ... I'll agree to disagree, and a TP for the good discussion, Sir.

Likewise my man.  TP

BTW, love the game your starting PG had tonight!

[indeedproceed]

New Jersey Neyts, New Look:

[Bahku]

I dont think you can assess these "teams" that we are creating by just adding up the numbers.

The fact is that there isnt a good rebounder on your team.  Who is going to do the dirty work?

If a shot is launched and missed, i guarantee that 7 or 8 times out of 10 that Spurs team is rebounding that ball.  Your team may be good offensively, but they are not getting every shot in.

Your team may shoot 55% from the field.  The Spurs on the other hand, may only shoot 50%.  However, when the Spurs miss half of their shots, they are going to get alot of second chance poinst out of their offensive rebounding.

I think you may be downplaying the importance of rebounding the ball.  Your team collectively is not a good rebounding team.  That affects the scoring capacity of both teams.

Easily fixed though through trades as you have good individual pieces.

I give you credit for your 2 bench picks.  I think they are 8th and 9th players on a good team, but nonetheless they are nice young players

What the Spurs have over the Nuggets defensively is just not going to make up for the huge difference on offense ... and Okur, Harrington and even Melo can bang inside when they need to. I think the biggest threat would be Duncan, obviously, but this young team could play a very effective zone to take care of that. Anyway ... I'll agree to disagree, and a TP for the good discussion, Sir.

Likewise my man.  TP

BTW, love the game your starting PG had tonight!

Yeah ... Chauncey had a game, man ... and I hear what you're saying inside ... I would love to have another big body like Okur in the paint, (or bigger). He's listed 6'11" 263, but I wouldn't mind a more Duncan-like player, or a "true" Center, especially on defense.

[Bahku]

UPDATE:

The "New Look" Denver Nuggets :


Starting Five:                                PPG                  Salary            RB/G        APG        Efficiency

C  -  Mehmet Okur                      12.7       $  9,000,000.00         6.7            1.8           +14.64
PF - Al Harrington                       17.8       $10,026,875.00         5.8           1.4           +15.05
SF - Carmelo Anthony                29.7      $15,779,912.00         6.5            3.3           +25.03
SG - Josh Howard                      12.1       $10,890,000.00        3.6            1.5            +  9.32
PG - Chauncey Billups              19.2       $12,100,000.00        3.0             6.1           +19.15


Bench:

PG - Jerryd Bayless                    9.7         $2,143,080.00           1.5            2.4           + 7.82
SG - Chris Douglas-Roberts   12.6        $   736,420.00           4.1            1.8           +11.77

Total Budget so far:                                $60,676,287.00

 
        (Wide Page Mode)

[Roy Hobbs]

The Josh Howard inclusion/pick stands out like a sore thumb to me.  I think he makes that starting 5 worse.  Not a good perimeter shooter, or ball handler.

Is your assessment of Josh Howard based upon just this year, or over the course of his career?  He's had an off year after adjusting to his new bench role, but career-wise, I think he's been a good player.  I mean, he was a starter on a Mavs team that was one whistle away from a championship, right?  Regarding his outside shooting, he's tended to be respectable in that regard, and on a team with Okur, Harrington, Carmelo, and Chauncey, the last thing to worry about is lack of perimeter scoring.  I think he would fit well next to Melo.

I agree that the Nuggets could use an elite rebounder, and a good wing defender would also be a good fit.  However, I think they're an excellent team.

[PLamb]

The Pick 2 Knicks - salaries includes

Starters

PG: George Hill               $1,081,680        $854,389         $1,540,463    $2,273,723
SG: Ray Allen                $18,776,860
SF: Grant Hill                   $3,000,000      $3,240,000
PF: Zach Randolph     $16,000,000    $17,333,333
C:  Nene Hilario           $10,520,000    $11,360,000       $11,600,000

Bench
 
PG: Ty Lawson            $1,438,680        $1,546,560        $1,654,440      $2,544,529
SG:
SF: Matt Barnes            $1,600,000       $1,600,000
PF: Kenyon Martin      $15,863,636     $16,795,454
C:                                                                                                                                                    .
                                      $68,280,856     $52,729,736      $14,794,903   $4,818,252




Blue = Team Option
Red = Qualifying Offer
Purple = Early Termination Option
Green = Player Option

What?

We're the New York Knicks

You were expecting a small payroll?



[/quote]

[Who]

UPDATE:

The "New Look" Denver Nuggets :


Starting Five:                                PPG                  Salary            RB/G        APG        Efficiency

C  -  Mehmet Okur                      12.7       $  9,000,000.00         6.7            1.8           +14.64
PF - Al Harrington                       17.8       $10,026,875.00         5.8           1.4           +15.05
SF - Carmelo Anthony                29.7      $15,779,912.00         6.5            3.3           +25.03
SG - Josh Howard                      12.1       $10,890,000.00        3.6            1.5            +  9.32
PG - Chauncey Billups              19.2       $12,100,000.00        3.0             6.1           +19.15


Bench:

PG - Jerryd Bayless                    9.7         $2,143,080.00           1.5            2.4           + 7.82
SG - Chris Douglas-Roberts   12.6        $   736,420.00           4.1            1.8           +11.77

Total Budget so far:                                $60,676,287.00

I'm not a fan of this team. I think it has a lot of flaws that will hold it back.

(1) Too many hands to feed offensively. Everyone is a scorer. Diminishing returns. Not enough shots + plays to go around. Only one ball.

(2) A lack of passers. Only one high quality passer in the lineup and that's Chancey Billups. Josh Howard and Al Harrington are both very poor passers. Memo Okur is a poor passer. Carmelo Anthony is solid. Jerryd Bayless is a poor passing guard and Chris Douglas Roberts is a poor passer. Every one of those players, except for maybe Memo (and that's only because of the extremes from the other players) are pure scorers.

(3) That team is going to play a lot of one-on-one basketball. Have poor ball movement and a lack of offensive fluidity. A lot of those "I haven't had a shot in awhile so I'm jack one up" types of plays.

(4) Some Scoring efficiency concerns -- Josh Howard has a TS% of 48% this season and 53% for his career. Al Harrington has a 53.8% mark this season and 52% for his career. CDR has a TS% of 52%, Bayless has a TS% of 54% this season. Those are score first players who will be eating a lot of possessions/shots. Melo, Billups and Okur are very good in this respect. It's the possessions that they aren't using that is a concern.

(5) Rebounding -- only one good rebounder on the roster and that's Carmelo Anthony. Everyone else is a below average rebounder. The lack of rebounding from the bigs is a major problem. This will be one of the worst rebounding teams in the league.

(6) Defense -- The perimeter defense will be good. Billups, Howard and Anthony is a nice combination. Bayless and CDR are serviceable. The interior defense will be shockingly poor, on track to be the worst in the league and that will leave Denver with a below average defensive team.

So I'm thinking a 7-10th place offense + bottom 10 defensive club + bottom 3 rebounding club ... based on the players selected so far. That's a .500 team.

Bakhu, I'd love to see you sacrifice some of your team's scoring prowess for more defensive minded players. It would make a big difference. You could add 10 wins to that roster pretty quickly with a talented interior defender/rebounder. Create better roster balance.

[Who]

I do like that the Nuggets can invert their offense and put Melo, Howard or Billups on the low post with regularity while keeping Al + Okur out on the perimeter. Teams don't like defending setups like that, knocks their team defense out of whack.

[Gomesfan]

as of right now I thinl the Suns are better how I have drafted versus the real team. Igoudala Martin are going to be a unstoppable triple threa . And this team is a lot younger and  they would have longevity.
pg Mo, Williams
sg Kevin Martin
sf Andre Iguodala
pf Amare' Stoudamire
c Spencer Hawes

bench: Taj Gibson