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Author Topic: Has Doc Lost This Team?  (Read 15459 times)

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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2010, 06:53:19 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Quote from: crownsy on January 21, 2010, 01:00:59 AM
Quote from: Bankshot on January 20, 2010, 10:09:16 PM
Quote from: Who on January 20, 2010, 10:08:33 PM
No

But how do you know?

How do you know he has, outside of personal opinion and over reaction to a 3 game slump?

I didn't say I knew.  My post was in the form of a question.  The question is, how do you know he hasn't lost the team?
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #31 on: January 21, 2010, 07:16:07 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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The leadership of this team is failing the team right now.


That includes the coaching staff, Pierce and Ray. 


You can not seperate them in this.  Doc wasn't the lone voice of leadership when the team was playing great.  He can't be the lone voice blamed when the team struggles. 




But, the buck will stop with him if this contuninues for the rest of the season.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #32 on: January 21, 2010, 07:57:24 AM »

Offline 2short

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Quote from: wdleehi on January 21, 2010, 07:16:07 AM
The leadership of this team is failing the team right now.


That includes the coaching staff, Pierce and Ray. 


You can not seperate them in this.  Doc wasn't the lone voice of leadership when the team was playing great.  He can't be the lone voice blamed when the team struggles. 




But, the buck will stop with him if this contuninues for the rest of the season.
finely put!
I put in another thread that doc should sit the starter(s) that aren't giving 100% or playing up to their capabilities.  If doc has lost the team then a scott skiles type might light a fire under the vets.  Bill Fitch wasn't here that long but he made the players play HARD.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #33 on: January 21, 2010, 08:01:45 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Doc can't coach a mediocre team.  If he doesn't have all his ducks lined in a row, he sucks at coaching and has no idea how to fix it.  Without KG and Daniels and a set rotation, his substitution patterns leave something to be desired. 
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"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson
Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #34 on: January 21, 2010, 09:12:54 AM »

Offline CDawg834

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I don't think it's all on Doc.  I think it's Doc in combination with the current healthy roster.  Two years ago, Doc motivated his team with the theory of Ubuntu.  That roster was led by KG who is super motivated and bought in 100%.  Makes life a lot easier as a coach when your best player buys into what you are trying to do.

Now KG has been out and away from the team during games.  With Pierce hurt, and Allen more of a quiet, lead by example type, the one constant has been Sheed.  If Rasheed Wallace is your veteran presence, that's a major problem.  Over the past few years, he has had a well-earned reputation for coasting through the regular season, then trying to turn it on in the playoffs.  He's as concerned with winning arguments with officials as he is with winning games.

The return of KG should hopefully get this team back on track.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #35 on: January 21, 2010, 09:26:28 AM »

Offline Chris

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Did Doc lose this team last year after Christmas?

This is a classic mid-season swoon.  It started due to injuries, and they haven't been able to pull out of it because well, it's January, and players get bored on a team this good.

I am not saying that the slump isn't a reason for at least a little concern, but I definitely don't think you can blame the coach.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #36 on: January 21, 2010, 09:50:31 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Quote from: Chris on January 21, 2010, 09:26:28 AM
Did Doc lose this team last year after Christmas?

This is a classic mid-season swoon.  It started due to injuries, and they haven't been able to pull out of it because well, it's January, and players get bored on a team this good.

I am not saying that the slump isn't a reason for at least a little concern, but I definitely don't think you can blame the coach.

After Christmas?  They didn't play well ON Christmas, Orlando just played worse.
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"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson
Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #37 on: January 21, 2010, 09:54:55 AM »

Offline Chris

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Quote from: Bankshot on January 21, 2010, 09:50:31 AM
Quote from: Chris on January 21, 2010, 09:26:28 AM
Did Doc lose this team last year after Christmas?

This is a classic mid-season swoon.  It started due to injuries, and they haven't been able to pull out of it because well, it's January, and players get bored on a team this good.

I am not saying that the slump isn't a reason for at least a little concern, but I definitely don't think you can blame the coach.

After Christmas?  They didn't play well ON Christmas, Orlando just played worse.

I am talking about the swoon after Christmas (which included the Christmas game) LAST YEAR. 
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #38 on: February 11, 2010, 09:04:25 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Do we need more evidence?  I know Pierce and KG are hurting, but what's with playing well the first half and then doing nothing in the second half?  They are not listening to Doc anymore.  He can yell and scream all he wants, but they are not listening.  They seem to play a totally different game in the second half than the first.  Sharing the ball in the first half to everyone playing iso ball in the second half, including Rondo. 

Like I said, I'm not sure what Doc says to them during halftime, but it's not working.

Didn't Doc talk bold the other day, basically saying he would bench who was not giving effort or playing well?  He only does that to young guys, but doesn't have the balls to do it to the vets.
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"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson
Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #39 on: February 11, 2010, 09:29:35 AM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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Nope.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #40 on: February 11, 2010, 09:35:04 AM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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I don't think Doc has lost this team at all, but I think he's not doing a good job coaching it... and as many have mentioned before, part of the problem lies in his rotations and substitution patterns. Not only that, he's often playing the wrong players at the wrong positions; Scal for example.

Little by little teams have learned how to play against us, and we just keep doing the same thing over and over with little to no adjustments. Something that used to be our strength (halftime adjustments) have become our weakness, and it started at some point during last season.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #41 on: February 11, 2010, 09:37:01 AM »

Offline EJPLAYA

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If Doc started getting nasty with players THEN he will have lost this team. Doc is doing exactly what he ought to be doing and that is letting them know that it isn't good enough and where they need to get better, but allowing them to do it. There is nothing he can say to this veteran team that will motivate them. They have to find their own way out of it.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #42 on: February 11, 2010, 09:53:03 AM »

Offline looseball

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Quote from: Bankshot on January 20, 2010, 10:05:02 PM
I'm just wondering, because they are not listening to his halftime rants.

Well, he seems to say the same things to the press after each loss, so he's probably saying the same things to his team every halftime.  If this is the case, they're probably just tuning him out.
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Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #43 on: February 11, 2010, 10:04:52 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Quote from: EJPLAYA on February 11, 2010, 09:37:01 AM
If Doc started getting nasty with players THEN he will have lost this team. Doc is doing exactly what he ought to be doing and that is letting them know that it isn't good enough and where they need to get better, but allowing them to do it. There is nothing he can say to this veteran team that will motivate them. They have to find their own way out of it.

Well, Doc himself the other day said he would bench anyone who wasn't moving the ball.  The starters weren't moving the ball, but I didn't see him bench anyone last night.  Pierce played awful and was obviously hurt, yet he plays him most of the game.  He had said that if Pierce didn't look right, he would pull him.  But he didn't.
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"If somebody would have told you when he was playing with the Knicks that Nate Robinson was going to change a big time game and he was going to do it mostly because of his defense, somebody would have got slapped."  Mark Jackson
Re: Has Doc Lost This Team?
« Reply #44 on: February 11, 2010, 10:08:21 AM »

Offline WeMadeIt17

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I think Doc and Ainge are ex players they listen to these players to much. They are saying "They are fine, trust us" and Doc and Danny believe them but to realize that these guys are just not the same anymore is so easy to see but I think this team has a pride issue right now thinking they can just go out and beat whoever when the want. THEY CANT. Plain and simple. It really kills me but i guarantee those old guys are saying come on you know we can still do it Doc and he lets them play and they dont get it done. While Rondo sits back like  :o
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