Iguodala agrees to six-year, $80 million deal with Sixers

[nickagneta]

Don't overlook the Sixers, folks.  They will have the best defensive front line in basketball.

  They don't have the best defensive front line in the division.

Dalembert: 10.4 rpg 2.3 bpg, Brand: 9.3 rpg, 2.2 bpg (in '07)

  So they're both superior defenders to KG because of their rebounding and blocks?

TP tim and WDL, to me those stats are nice, but no indication of them suddenly being a great defensive front line. It took me 2 minutes to find a "better" frontline in denver, and im sure there's alot of duo's on average at best defensive teams that put up those kinds of numbers.

In summary, yes, i think the sixers are contenders, no, i don't think there "one of the best front line defenses!" just because of this.

they very well may be in the end, but it will take some time to see.

there's multiple front lines who are much better defensivly ATM.

Except of course that Camby no longer actually plays in Denver.

to my knowledge, brand has never played a game in philly, yet his stats from last year were used like he was to show off the dalenbert/brand frontcourt.

camby's 07 stats were as a nugget, so i put him along side his partner.

But wouldn't using last year's stats to put him alongside the guy he will be playing with this year be more logically consistent with what the person who used his stats from last year and put them in conjunction with Dalembert make a whole lot more sense?

It seems odd that the person was discussing next year's front lines and you then refute has allegation with stats from a front line that won't be playing together anymore.

Anyway, I think Iguodala got paid pretty much in line with what he is worth and I agree with Who that of the players that refused contracts last summer he is by far the best and most well rounded of those players.

I also agree with iowa that Philly will be a very dangerous team next year. #2 in the conference might be reaching a bit but a 3 or 4 isn't completely out of the question so long as Brand plays like Brand pre-achilles injury. If Brand doesn't have that explosiveness that he had before the injury all bets are off.

[crownsy]

his point was that because of those rebound and block stats, from last year,  which they have yet to achieve while on the same team, that they would be the NBA's best defensive front court, which is ridiculous. as tim said, there not even the best front court in the division. They may indeed have the potential to get there, but color me unimpressed simply because they have good combined numbers.

also, whats the flaw in bringing up a front court from last year that had better stats but is recognized as a bad defensive team to point out they might not be that hot based on stats alone? were talking about last year here, not this year.

i don't see where i made a reach of any kind....but just to show thats a bad stat to base a the claim "now have the Best defensive front court in the NBA, how about this one.

Shaq: (phx) RPG 10.5 blocks 1.2 Amare: 9.1 and 2.2

combined front court average: 19.6 and 3.4, better at rebounding, slight drop off in blocks


clearly the phx suns also belong in the best defensive front court in the NBA discussion. 

me, i'll still go ahead and pick us. not saying the sixers aren't going to make a huge leap, i think they will, but to call them the best defensive front court based on that evidence? lol.

[Finkelskyhook]

Plowboy said:
"They will have the best defensive front line in basketball.  Definitely the most athletic."

I believe he meant defensively.  If they aren't the best defensive front line in the conference, they'll be a very close second.  Easily the most athletic.

To compare last year's sieve of a defense in Denver to a defensive front line of Dalembert, Brand, and Igoudala is patently absurd.  Camby was Denver's only defensive front.  Camby played about 3 positions defensively on just about every defensive rotation.  Snitch's defense borders Pierce's "effort" pre Thibodeau.  Martin hasn't played decent D since Jersey. 

[crownsy]

Plowboy said:
"They will have the best defensive front line in basketball.  Definitely the most athletic."

I believe he meant defensively.  If they aren't the best defensive front line in the conference, they'll be a very close second.  Easily the most athletic.

To compare last year's sieve of a defense in Denver to a defensive front line of Dalembert, Brand, and Igoudala is patently absurd.  Camby was Denver's only defensive front.  Camby played about 3 positions defensively on just about every defensive rotation.  Snitch's defense borders Pierce's "effort" pre Thibodeau.  Martin hasn't played decent D since Jersey. 

apperntly my point is not coming across. i am not saying they won't be a very good defensive front line, nor am i comparing them to denver. though i think they'll be third in the east,  assuming the raptors can keep JO healthy. but to say there going to be the best in basketball and base it on rebounding and blocks averages?

it makes no sense, justify it with something other than stats you can find on terrible teams. that was my point, that the justification made no sense what-so-ever.

The reason i choose denver was in fact, if you look at the post, BECAUSE they were a terrible defensive unit that obliterated the original dalembert/brand combined stat line.

again, as ive maintained through every post, the sixers made a huge leap here, and are going to be a very good team, both offensively and defensively. but if your going to annoint them "the best defensive front court in the nba!" before they even play together, bring something other than rebounds and blocks, stats that crappy defensive tandems get no problem.

[wdleehi]

Plowboy said:
"They will have the best defensive front line in basketball.  Definitely the most athletic."

I believe he meant defensively.  If they aren't the best defensive front line in the conference, they'll be a very close second.  Easily the most athletic.

To compare last year's sieve of a defense in Denver to a defensive front line of Dalembert, Brand, and Igoudala is patently absurd.  Camby was Denver's only defensive front.  Camby played about 3 positions defensively on just about every defensive rotation.  Snitch's defense borders Pierce's "effort" pre Thibodeau.  Martin hasn't played decent D since Jersey. 

Again, there are these three guys in Boston playing some really good defense.  One of them was named DPOY.   

[Birdbrain]

Well your point was pretty obvious that using Rebounds/Blocks stats as a reason to state a team is going to be great defensively makes little sense to me as well.  I mean did Brand get those rebounds while playing alongside Dalembert?  If not who knows what they'll average of course like I mentioned it really means nothing anyway.  And best defensive front line.. ugh I think I'll stick with Boston where they have the DPOY along with Perkins and Pierce which trump Philly defensively at every position.

[Finkelskyhook]

Plowboy said:
"They will have the best defensive front line in basketball.  Definitely the most athletic."

I believe he meant defensively.  If they aren't the best defensive front line in the conference, they'll be a very close second.  Easily the most athletic.

To compare last year's sieve of a defense in Denver to a defensive front line of Dalembert, Brand, and Igoudala is patently absurd.  Camby was Denver's only defensive front.  Camby played about 3 positions defensively on just about every defensive rotation.  Snitch's defense borders Pierce's "effort" pre Thibodeau.  Martin hasn't played decent D since Jersey. 

Again, there are these three guys in Boston playing some really good defense.  One of them was named DPOY.   

Totally agree.  With the exception of the DPOY, Philly's front line is younger and more athletic.  I'd take either Philly's or Boston's front line defensively.
Philly was not  a crappy team without Brand last season.

J. O'Neal is quickly becoming the Manny of the NBA.  It's not if he's healthy enough.  It's a matter of whether he feels like playing.  Either way, he's a completely undersized center and would get dominated by Brand at the 4.  Toronto's front line isn't close in the best scenario to Philly's or Boston's.

[crownsy]

Plowboy said:
"They will have the best defensive front line in basketball.  Definitely the most athletic."

I believe he meant defensively.  If they aren't the best defensive front line in the conference, they'll be a very close second.  Easily the most athletic.

To compare last year's sieve of a defense in Denver to a defensive front line of Dalembert, Brand, and Igoudala is patently absurd.  Camby was Denver's only defensive front.  Camby played about 3 positions defensively on just about every defensive rotation.  Snitch's defense borders Pierce's "effort" pre Thibodeau.  Martin hasn't played decent D since Jersey.

Again, there are these three guys in Boston playing some really good defense.  One of them was named DPOY.   

Totally agree.  With the exception of the DPOY, Philly's front line is younger and more athletic.  I'd take either Philly's or Boston's front line defensively.
Philly was not  a crappy team without Brand last season.

J. O'Neal is quickly becoming the Manny of the NBA.  It's not if he's healthy enough.  It's a matter of whether he feels like playing.  Either way, he's a completely undersized center and would get dominated by Brand at the 4.  Toronto's front line isn't close in the best scenario to Philly's or Boston's.

again, we assume. i'll wait till they play to put them above Detroit, SA, heck, even Houston.

I think they'll play very well, but thats on paper. I'll withhold anointing them a great defensive team till they play a bit.

[Roy Hobbs]

Consider me impressed. I think Iggy is a good player and all, but I don't think he is worth more than Josh Smith, Emeka, or Deng.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3532139

I think AI2 is better than all three of those guys, for pretty much the reasons Who stated above.  I also agree with him that it's not really close in my mind.

[Mr October]

Consider me impressed. I think Iggy is a good player and all, but I don't think he is worth more than Josh Smith, Emeka, or Deng.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3532139

I think AI2 is better than all three of those guys, for pretty much the reasons Who stated above.  I also agree with him that it's not really close in my mind.

Yep. Iggy is worth that tag based on what his peers are getting. Deng was awesome for 1 year. The other guys are overrated/overpaid.

...and I'll take Boston's front line defense over Philly's any day.

[Roy Hobbs]

...and I'll take Boston's front line defense over Philly's any day.

Yeah, agreed.  Philly has great defensive potential.  Boston has great defense.  There's a difference.

(I do think, however, that people tend to underrate Dalembert.)

[nickagneta]

his point was that because of those rebound and block stats, from last year,  which they have yet to achieve while on the same team, that they would be the NBA's best defensive front court, which is ridiculous. as tim said, there not even the best front court in the division. They may indeed have the potential to get there, but color me unimpressed simply because they have good combined numbers.

also, whats the flaw in bringing up a front court from last year that had better stats but is recognized as a bad defensive team to point out they might not be that hot based on stats alone? were talking about last year here, not this year.

i don't see where i made a reach of any kind....but just to show thats a bad stat to base a the claim "now have the Best defensive front court in the NBA, how about this one.

Shaq: (phx) RPG 10.5 blocks 1.2 Amare: 9.1 and 2.2

combined front court average: 19.6 and 3.4, better at rebounding, slight drop off in blocks


clearly the phx suns also belong in the best defensive front court in the NBA discussion. 

me, i'll still go ahead and pick us. not saying the sixers aren't going to make a huge leap, i think they will, but to call them the best defensive front court based on that evidence? lol.

Okay, I see where you're coming from now. TP4U for explaining, I was getting a bit mixed up there. And yes I think the Phoenix example is a better example. But rebounds and blocks, as you are illustrating so well, aren't an indicator of good defense. That is an observed thing.

And I do think that all three front line players in Philly are good defensive players and if they can create some cohesion they could be a devastating defensive front court, regardless of the rebounding or block numbers.

I'd still take Boston's, at least for the next year or so. But let's see what develops in Philly. Mo Cheeks was an awesome defensive player and his teams haven't been bad defensive teams. If that front court takes on the personality of it's coach, watch out, they could be very very good defensively.

[Mr October]

...and I'll take Boston's front line defense over Philly's any day.

Yeah, agreed.  Philly has great defensive potential.  Boston has great defense.  There's a difference.

(I do think, however, that people tend to underrate Dalembert.)

I think Dalembert get underrated as a player too... probably due to his contract. He is good. Just not good enough for the buckets of millions of dollars.

[kenmaine]

Anyway, to get back to the subject, I'm amazed at the money teams throw around. Darko is my hero
But seriously, I've been very impressed with Iguodala the past couple of years, but he did suck in the playoffs for whatever reason. Maybe the Pistons just smothered him(but I watched some of the games and to me it just looked like he sucked), or maybe he had an injury that he kept to himself, maybe personal problems, who knows?
But he is a hell of a player, and the Sixers should be good.

[crownsy]

his point was that because of those rebound and block stats, from last year,  which they have yet to achieve while on the same team, that they would be the NBA's best defensive front court, which is ridiculous. as tim said, there not even the best front court in the division. They may indeed have the potential to get there, but color me unimpressed simply because they have good combined numbers.

also, whats the flaw in bringing up a front court from last year that had better stats but is recognized as a bad defensive team to point out they might not be that hot based on stats alone? were talking about last year here, not this year.

i don't see where i made a reach of any kind....but just to show thats a bad stat to base a the claim "now have the Best defensive front court in the NBA, how about this one.

Shaq: (phx) RPG 10.5 blocks 1.2 Amare: 9.1 and 2.2

combined front court average: 19.6 and 3.4, better at rebounding, slight drop off in blocks


clearly the phx suns also belong in the best defensive front court in the NBA discussion. 

me, i'll still go ahead and pick us. not saying the sixers aren't going to make a huge leap, i think they will, but to call them the best defensive front court based on that evidence? lol.

Okay, I see where you're coming from now. TP4U for explaining, I was getting a bit mixed up there. And yes I think the Phoenix example is a better example. But rebounds and blocks, as you are illustrating so well, aren't an indicator of good defense. That is an observed thing.

And I do think that all three front line players in Philly are good defensive players and if they can create some cohesion they could be a devastating defensive front court, regardless of the rebounding or block numbers.

I'd still take Boston's, at least for the next year or so. But let's see what develops in Philly. Mo Cheeks was an awesome defensive player and his teams haven't been bad defensive teams. If that front court takes on the personality of it's coach, watch out, they could be very very good defensively.

I agree nick, an tp back at you. that team in philly is going to be interesting, and i think quite good. another team i'm looking forward to seeing us play this season