Trade Idea: Celtics - Pelicans

[Goldstar88]

Not a terrible trade by any means,but I hope it does not come to this losing Brown.  Zion can attack the rim.  But we have no center and lost our best defensive guard.   We would have three good forwards with Tatum,  Zion and Murphy.   Who is moving to SG?

I think we would have to ask for Missi as well to help our center rotation.  The trade still works.

They do not have a first this year.

Trey Murphy can play the 2 and the 3 just like JB. Celtics can sign another Center in Free agency like Rob or Porzingis. I?d prefer bringing KP back even though he is injury prone. I don?t think anyone is throwing a lot of money at him.

Starters: White, Murphy, Tatum, Zion, Porzingis

That would be the most talented starting 5 in the East.

What?s your over-under on how many games that starting five plays together?

I don?t care how many games they play in the regular season. Just need them to be available come playoff time. KP would be the player that worries me the most, but he is a complete game changer. Sign him using the MLE. Worth the risk.

I think it?s clear we?d all want them healthy for the playoffs. How could anyone expect the two would play more than 50% together.  The reward would be great if they played throughout, but I don?t see how anyone could expect them to.

No one should expect them to. Most guys are not playing a full season these days. Jokic played in 65 games this season. Cade, Luka, and Wemby played in 64. So Zion playing in 62 really is not a big deal. Just have to load manage so they are good to go come playoff time.

Are you arguing that Zion and KP aren?t uniquely injury plagued?  65 games next year for both would be more than unexpected. Playing throughout the playoffs would be equally unexpected. Worth the risk? Maybe, but the risk is substantial.

I?m arguing that you should not expect anyone to play a full season. It rarely happens anymore. So if Zion can give you 60-65 games that?s acceptable.  With his weight loss, I think he can give the Celtics that. If KP can play in half of the regular season games and be available come postseason, I would be fine with that. He is so talented that is worth the risk. Especially for MLE money.

The Celtics are not winning if they are just running it back. Team does not have enough talent.

[slamtheking]

Not a terrible trade by any means,but I hope it does not come to this losing Brown.  Zion can attack the rim.  But we have no center and lost our best defensive guard.   We would have three good forwards with Tatum,  Zion and Murphy.   Who is moving to SG?

I think we would have to ask for Missi as well to help our center rotation.  The trade still works.

They do not have a first this year.

Trey Murphy can play the 2 and the 3 just like JB. Celtics can sign another Center in Free agency like Rob or Porzingis. I?d prefer bringing KP back even though he is injury prone. I don?t think anyone is throwing a lot of money at him.

Starters: White, Murphy, Tatum, Zion, Porzingis

That would be the most talented starting 5 in the East.

What?s your over-under on how many games that starting five plays together?

I don?t care how many games they play in the regular season. Just need them to be available come playoff time. KP would be the player that worries me the most, but he is a complete game changer. Sign him using the MLE. Worth the risk.

I think it?s clear we?d all want them healthy for the playoffs. How could anyone expect the two would play more than 50% together.  The reward would be great if they played throughout, but I don?t see how anyone could expect them to.

No one should expect them to. Most guys are not playing a full season these days. Jokic played in 65 games this season. Cade, Luka, and Wemby played in 64. So Zion playing in 62 really is not a big deal. Just have to load manage so they are good to go come playoff time.

Are you arguing that Zion and KP aren?t uniquely injury plagued?  65 games next year for both would be more than unexpected. Playing throughout the playoffs would be equally unexpected. Worth the risk? Maybe, but the risk is substantial.

I?m arguing that you should not expect anyone to play a full season. It rarely happens anymore. So if Zion can give you 60-65 games that?s acceptable.  With his weight loss, I think he can give the Celtics that. If KP can play in half of the regular season games and be available come postseason, I would be fine with that. He is so talented that is worth the risk. Especially for MLE money.

The Celtics are not winning if they are just running it back. Team does not have enough talent.

your expectations on Zion's and KP's availability are unreasonable.  Zion and KP miss a lot of games because they are chronically unable to play.  expecting them to be healthy for a full post-season run is just delusional.  there's zero realism in that expectation.

[Goldstar88]

Not a terrible trade by any means,but I hope it does not come to this losing Brown.  Zion can attack the rim.  But we have no center and lost our best defensive guard.   We would have three good forwards with Tatum,  Zion and Murphy.   Who is moving to SG?

I think we would have to ask for Missi as well to help our center rotation.  The trade still works.

They do not have a first this year.

Trey Murphy can play the 2 and the 3 just like JB. Celtics can sign another Center in Free agency like Rob or Porzingis. I?d prefer bringing KP back even though he is injury prone. I don?t think anyone is throwing a lot of money at him.

Starters: White, Murphy, Tatum, Zion, Porzingis

That would be the most talented starting 5 in the East.

What?s your over-under on how many games that starting five plays together?

I don?t care how many games they play in the regular season. Just need them to be available come playoff time. KP would be the player that worries me the most, but he is a complete game changer. Sign him using the MLE. Worth the risk.

I think it?s clear we?d all want them healthy for the playoffs. How could anyone expect the two would play more than 50% together.  The reward would be great if they played throughout, but I don?t see how anyone could expect them to.

No one should expect them to. Most guys are not playing a full season these days. Jokic played in 65 games this season. Cade, Luka, and Wemby played in 64. So Zion playing in 62 really is not a big deal. Just have to load manage so they are good to go come playoff time.

Are you arguing that Zion and KP aren?t uniquely injury plagued?  65 games next year for both would be more than unexpected. Playing throughout the playoffs would be equally unexpected. Worth the risk? Maybe, but the risk is substantial.

I?m arguing that you should not expect anyone to play a full season. It rarely happens anymore. So if Zion can give you 60-65 games that?s acceptable.  With his weight loss, I think he can give the Celtics that. If KP can play in half of the regular season games and be available come postseason, I would be fine with that. He is so talented that is worth the risk. Especially for MLE money.

The Celtics are not winning if they are just running it back. Team does not have enough talent.

your expectations on Zion's and KP's availability are unreasonable.  Zion and KP miss a lot of games because they are chronically unable to play.  expecting them to be healthy for a full post-season run is just delusional.  there's zero realism in that expectation.

This is what load management is for. Spurs load managed Wemby all season long. Seemed to work out pretty well for them. Zion has only played one season so far since losing 50 pounds and he suited up for 62 games. Leaving that fact out of the equation is silly. If he played 50 pounds lighter for the last 4 years, he would have played in more games.

[Who]

The New Orleans Pelicans have reportedly been linked to being in the hunt to trade for Boston Celtics star forward Jaylen Brown.

"The Pelicans have been mentioned by various league executives with Jaylen Brown interest, as well," NBA insider Jake Fischer said on Bleacher Report's live show on Tuesday.

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

So the Dejounte + Trey + picks package rather than a Zion one. Although ...

Pelicans star forward Zion Williamson is also not off the table for any potential deals, Robinson reported.

"The Pelicans prefer to keep Zion, but they aren't married to him if they can offload him," Robinson quoted from a source in his report.

The only two "untouchables" currently on the Pelicans? roster are rising sophomores Jeremiah Fears and Derek Queen, according to Robinson.

Should we be concerned at all that NOP is open to trading Zion after he lost 50lbs and supposedly did everything necessary to convince NOP he was serious about his career / winning?

[Goldstar88]

The New Orleans Pelicans have reportedly been linked to being in the hunt to trade for Boston Celtics star forward Jaylen Brown.

"The Pelicans have been mentioned by various league executives with Jaylen Brown interest, as well," NBA insider Jake Fischer said on Bleacher Report's live show on Tuesday.

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

So the Dejounte + Trey + picks package rather than a Zion one. Although ...

Pelicans star forward Zion Williamson is also not off the table for any potential deals, Robinson reported.

"The Pelicans prefer to keep Zion, but they aren't married to him if they can offload him," Robinson quoted from a source in his report.

The only two "untouchables" currently on the Pelicans? roster are rising sophomores Jeremiah Fears and Derek Queen, according to Robinson.

Should we be concerned at all that NOP is open to trading Zion after he lost 50lbs and supposedly did everything necessary to convince NOP he was serious about his career / winning?

I?m not sure they like the fit with Queen and Zion.

[Who]

The New Orleans Pelicans have reportedly been linked to being in the hunt to trade for Boston Celtics star forward Jaylen Brown.

"The Pelicans have been mentioned by various league executives with Jaylen Brown interest, as well," NBA insider Jake Fischer said on Bleacher Report's live show on Tuesday.

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

So the Dejounte + Trey + picks package rather than a Zion one. Although ...

Pelicans star forward Zion Williamson is also not off the table for any potential deals, Robinson reported.

"The Pelicans prefer to keep Zion, but they aren't married to him if they can offload him," Robinson quoted from a source in his report.

The only two "untouchables" currently on the Pelicans? roster are rising sophomores Jeremiah Fears and Derek Queen, according to Robinson.

Should we be concerned at all that NOP is open to trading Zion after he lost 50lbs and supposedly did everything necessary to convince NOP he was serious about his career / winning?

I?m not sure they like the fit with Queen and Zion.

Ahh, okay. I wonder what type of PF or C they want to pair Queen with. I would've thought Zion was a good fit for Queen. Zion being a mobile PF on both offense & defense. More of a floor spreader to allow Queen more room in the paint? More of a defender to help Queen? Hmm ...

[jambr380]

Ahh, okay. I wonder what type of PF or C they want to pair Queen with. I would've thought Zion was a good fit for Queen. Zion being a mobile PF on both offense & defense. More of a floor spreader to allow Queen more room in the paint? More of a defender to help Queen? Hmm ...

I'm sure they'd love to have Tatum lol

But they really just need somebody who can shoot better from outside. Queen is mostly a Center, so as long as they have a big wing, it should still work. That team overall is pretty bad at shooting 3s. Along with the obvious in Brown, they'd benefit a lot from Hauser tbh

[slamtheking]

Not a terrible trade by any means,but I hope it does not come to this losing Brown.  Zion can attack the rim.  But we have no center and lost our best defensive guard.   We would have three good forwards with Tatum,  Zion and Murphy.   Who is moving to SG?

I think we would have to ask for Missi as well to help our center rotation.  The trade still works.

They do not have a first this year.

Trey Murphy can play the 2 and the 3 just like JB. Celtics can sign another Center in Free agency like Rob or Porzingis. I?d prefer bringing KP back even though he is injury prone. I don?t think anyone is throwing a lot of money at him.

Starters: White, Murphy, Tatum, Zion, Porzingis

That would be the most talented starting 5 in the East.

What?s your over-under on how many games that starting five plays together?

I don?t care how many games they play in the regular season. Just need them to be available come playoff time. KP would be the player that worries me the most, but he is a complete game changer. Sign him using the MLE. Worth the risk.

I think it?s clear we?d all want them healthy for the playoffs. How could anyone expect the two would play more than 50% together.  The reward would be great if they played throughout, but I don?t see how anyone could expect them to.

No one should expect them to. Most guys are not playing a full season these days. Jokic played in 65 games this season. Cade, Luka, and Wemby played in 64. So Zion playing in 62 really is not a big deal. Just have to load manage so they are good to go come playoff time.

Are you arguing that Zion and KP aren?t uniquely injury plagued?  65 games next year for both would be more than unexpected. Playing throughout the playoffs would be equally unexpected. Worth the risk? Maybe, but the risk is substantial.

I?m arguing that you should not expect anyone to play a full season. It rarely happens anymore. So if Zion can give you 60-65 games that?s acceptable.  With his weight loss, I think he can give the Celtics that. If KP can play in half of the regular season games and be available come postseason, I would be fine with that. He is so talented that is worth the risk. Especially for MLE money.

The Celtics are not winning if they are just running it back. Team does not have enough talent.

your expectations on Zion's and KP's availability are unreasonable.  Zion and KP miss a lot of games because they are chronically unable to play.  expecting them to be healthy for a full post-season run is just delusional.  there's zero realism in that expectation.

This is what load management is for. Spurs load managed Wemby all season long. Seemed to work out pretty well for them. Zion has only played one season so far since losing 50 pounds and he suited up for 62 games. Leaving that fact out of the equation is silly. If he played 50 pounds lighter for the last 4 years, he would have played in more games.

unsupported assumption to try to make your trade idea more palatable.  one season does not make a trend

[slamtheking]

The New Orleans Pelicans have reportedly been linked to being in the hunt to trade for Boston Celtics star forward Jaylen Brown.

"The Pelicans have been mentioned by various league executives with Jaylen Brown interest, as well," NBA insider Jake Fischer said on Bleacher Report's live show on Tuesday.

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

So the Dejounte + Trey + picks package rather than a Zion one. Although ...

Pelicans star forward Zion Williamson is also not off the table for any potential deals, Robinson reported.

"The Pelicans prefer to keep Zion, but they aren't married to him if they can offload him," Robinson quoted from a source in his report.

The only two "untouchables" currently on the Pelicans? roster are rising sophomores Jeremiah Fears and Derek Queen, according to Robinson.

Should we be concerned at all that NOP is open to trading Zion after he lost 50lbs and supposedly did everything necessary to convince NOP he was serious about his career / winning?

I?m not sure they like the fit with Queen and Zion.

Ahh, okay. I wonder what type of PF or C they want to pair Queen with. I would've thought Zion was a good fit for Queen. Zion being a mobile PF on both offense & defense. More of a floor spreader to allow Queen more room in the paint? More of a defender to help Queen? Hmm ...

or a more likely reason is that they are tired of tying up a lot of money on a player who has significant issues staying healthy enough to play. 

[Vermont Green]

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

Brown for Murray and Murphy plus draft capital does not interest me all that much, to be honest, plus it adds $2.7M in salary.  If you could then flip some of the draft capital and use the $27M TPE (which you would not have to use for this trade or you could generate a new one) to trade for a starting center, then the team could look pretty good I guess.  This center would have to fit the $27M TPE, that does not buy much of a center these days (Myles Turner, Naz Reid, Nic Claxton).

White
Murray
Murphy
Tatum
Turner, Reid, or Claxton?

And still no speedy PG that so many are looking to add.  I am not sold on this.

[Who]

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

Brown for Murray and Murphy plus draft capital does not interest me all that much, to be honest, plus it adds $2.7M in salary.  If you could then flip some of the draft capital and use the $27M TPE (which you would not have to use for this trade or you could generate a new one) to trade for a starting center, then the team could look pretty good I guess.  This center would have to fit the $27M TPE, that does not buy much of a center these days (Myles Turner, Naz Reid, Nic Claxton).

White
Murray
Murphy
Tatum
Turner, Reid, or Claxton?

And still no speedy PG that so many are looking to add.  I am not sold on this.

Dejounte Murray is a speedy PG. Strong defender.

D White will be the two guard.

-------------

I wouldn't want Naz Reid as a starting center. He is a weak defender. Cannot anchor a defense. He is either a PF or a 6th man. I don't think he can start at C. Too many air-head type moments on off-ball defense.

We can probably get Myles Turner for the TPE straight up if MIL start rebuilding after trading Giannis. Without sending them any picks. Why would they want to keep him? Better to free up cap space. I don't think there is much of a market for him. Not much competition to drive up the price.

It would take draft picks to get Nic Claxton. Probably 2 firsts.

----------------

Agreed. Not sold on it either. If I am going to trade Jaylen and break up the Tatum / Jaylen duo, I need a sure thing. Those 2 have had too much success together to break them up for anything less.

So I wouldn't do a Zion for Jaylen trade either. Too much of a question mark health wise.

[slamtheking]

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

Brown for Murray and Murphy plus draft capital does not interest me all that much, to be honest, plus it adds $2.7M in salary.  If you could then flip some of the draft capital and use the $27M TPE (which you would not have to use for this trade or you could generate a new one) to trade for a starting center, then the team could look pretty good I guess.  This center would have to fit the $27M TPE, that does not buy much of a center these days (Myles Turner, Naz Reid, Nic Claxton).

White
Murray
Murphy
Tatum
Turner, Reid, or Claxton?

And still no speedy PG that so many are looking to add.  I am not sold on this.

nor are any of those centers all that much better than Q, if at all since they have flaws like Q.  looks like a weaker line-up to me overall. 

[Who]

I don't understand what Derik Queen has shown to make Zion expendable.

[slamtheking]

NBA insider Brandon 'Scoop B.' Robinson confirmed Fischer's report of the Pelicans' interest in Brown and said the framework of a potential deal to get him to New Orleans is guard Dejounte Murray, wing Trey Murphy III and "significant draft capital."

Brown for Murray and Murphy plus draft capital does not interest me all that much, to be honest, plus it adds $2.7M in salary.  If you could then flip some of the draft capital and use the $27M TPE (which you would not have to use for this trade or you could generate a new one) to trade for a starting center, then the team could look pretty good I guess.  This center would have to fit the $27M TPE, that does not buy much of a center these days (Myles Turner, Naz Reid, Nic Claxton).

White
Murray
Murphy
Tatum
Turner, Reid, or Claxton?

And still no speedy PG that so many are looking to add.  I am not sold on this.

Dejounte Murray is a speedy PG. Strong defender.

D White will be the two guard.

-------------

I wouldn't want Naz Reid as a starting center. He is a weak defender. Cannot anchor a defense. He is either a PF or a 6th man. I don't think he can start at C. Too many air-head type moments on off-ball defense.

We can probably get Myles Turner for the TPE straight up if MIL start rebuilding after trading Giannis. Without sending them any picks. Why would they want to keep him? Better to free up cap space. I don't think there is much of a market for him. Not much competition to drive up the price.

It would take draft picks to get Nic Claxton. Probably 2 firsts.

----------------

Agreed. Not sold on it either. If I am going to trade Jaylen and break up the Tatum / Jaylen duo, I need a sure thing. Those 2 have had too much success together to break them up for anything less.

So I wouldn't do a Zion for Jaylen trade either. Too much of a question mark health wise.

Murray was a speedy PG before going to Atlanta and didn't look nearly as promising as he did in SA.  He seems slower and less effective as a result of those injuries.  Taking on Murray is similar to taking on Zion --> hoping an injured player is able to bounce back to their best form when it's not terribly likely.  taking them is more of a benefit to NO to clear their books of problematic contracts.  would require significant draft capital coming to the C's and NOP only has their own first rounders to deal which won't be great picks once they have Jaylen

[slamtheking]

I don't understand what Derik Queen has shown to make Zion expendable.

it's called "cheap, cost-controlled talent".