Time for a change?

[slamtheking]

Suns could be an interesting trade partner

Green, Allen, Maluach for Brown
Or
Booker, Brooks for Brown, White

I could see why the Suns would do the first one, but why would they do the second one?

I can't see why the Celtics would do either.

Don't worry. They won't.

agreed 2 crappy trades that don't make the C's better.

first one is basically throwing away our second best, all-NBA player for lesser parts and the second one gives away our second and third best players (who are both top 2-way players) for a high level scorer with average D at best and a defensive player with average offense at best.

[celticinorlando]

Vuc walks.

Brad adds a serviceable big (to start) and a guard to bolster the bench with the exceptions they have.

Resign PP, Queta and they shop JB but in the end they extend Brown (which is a whole other discussion to have). Walsh gets picked up.

So same team as last season with a healthy Tatum, another big and a guard...plus their top draft pick. They manage the cap for one more year.

Hopefully 2027 they splurge.

[Moranis]

Vuc walks.

Brad adds a serviceable big (to start) and a guard to bolster the bench with the exceptions they have.

Resign PP, Queta and they shop JB but in the end they extend Brown (which is a whole other discussion to have). Walsh gets picked up.

So same team as last season with a healthy Tatum, another big and a guard...plus their top draft pick. They manage the cap for one more year.

Hopefully 2027 they splurge.

And they lose in the 1st or 2nd round again and waste another year while their tradeable players lose value.

[smicker16]

Vuc walks.

Brad adds a serviceable big (to start) and a guard to bolster the bench with the exceptions they have.

Resign PP, Queta and they shop JB but in the end they extend Brown (which is a whole other discussion to have). Walsh gets picked up.

So same team as last season with a healthy Tatum, another big and a guard...plus their top draft pick. They manage the cap for one more year.

Hopefully 2027 they splurge.

I think this is what happens too. I think they will test the market for Brown but there will not be any clear upgrades. I think they would only trade him for a true upgrade like Giannis or for some legit younger but already established players like Harper or Castle. And I do not see either of those really happening so I think they run it back with some smaller tweaks. Do not think a package focused on picks is what Brad would want.

[Phantom255x]

Vuc walks.

Brad adds a serviceable big (to start) and a guard to bolster the bench with the exceptions they have.

Resign PP, Queta and they shop JB but in the end they extend Brown (which is a whole other discussion to have). Walsh gets picked up.

So same team as last season with a healthy Tatum, another big and a guard...plus their top draft pick. They manage the cap for one more year.

Hopefully 2027 they splurge.

And they lose in the 1st or 2nd round again and waste another year while their tradeable players lose value.

Not gonna lie, I don't hate that approach though. Because right now the Spurs/Thunder and even the Knicks to me are better. The best shot the C's have is to reset the repeater tax next year, keep building with the guys, and then splurge similar to 2024 and make one last push with Jaylen + Tatum. I don't think trading Jaylen for Giannis is gonna ultimately push us beyond OKC/SAS/NY right now, they need multiple moves and probably a crafty or innovative move mixed in (similar to Stevens trading for White in 2022 and Brogdon 2023, or obviously getting BOTH KP + Jrue in 2024)

I'm currently occupied with classes lol (thankfully we're done after tomorrow!) but I'll start to think of specific names/ideas more then but personally I'd keep Jaylen and make moves around the Jays (White, Hauser, Walsh can be traded/offloaded).

[Moranis]

Vuc walks.

Brad adds a serviceable big (to start) and a guard to bolster the bench with the exceptions they have.

Resign PP, Queta and they shop JB but in the end they extend Brown (which is a whole other discussion to have). Walsh gets picked up.

So same team as last season with a healthy Tatum, another big and a guard...plus their top draft pick. They manage the cap for one more year.

Hopefully 2027 they splurge.

And they lose in the 1st or 2nd round again and waste another year while their tradeable players lose value.

Not gonna lie, I don't hate that approach though. Because right now the Spurs/Thunder and even the Knicks to me are better. The best shot the C's have is to reset the repeater tax next year, keep building with the guys, and then splurge similar to 2024 and make one last push with Jaylen + Tatum. I don't think trading Jaylen for Giannis is gonna ultimately push us beyond OKC/SAS/NY right now, they need multiple moves and probably a crafty or innovative move mixed in (similar to Stevens trading for White in 2022 and Brogdon 2023, or obviously getting BOTH KP + Jrue in 2024)

I'm currently occupied with classes lol (thankfully we're done after tomorrow!) but I'll start to think of specific names/ideas more then but personally I'd keep Jaylen and make moves around the Jays (White, Hauser, Walsh can be traded/offloaded).

The Celtics can acquire Giannis for Brown and still reset the repeater tax.   

[Moranis]

The Celtics in 24 are  the only champions since the 1980's to win a championship without a MVP or DPOY on the roster (i.e. a player on the team had won it already).  The odds of that happening again are thus very small.  So either Tatum needs to win the league MVP, White needs to win DPOY, or they need to trade for that player. 

Also, the Knicks are the only team left that doesn't have a dpoy or mvp on their roster.  The Cavs have both (harden and mobley), the Thunder have the 2 time mvp, and the spurs have the dpoy.  So that string will likely continue again this year. 

[slamtheking]

The Celtics in 24 are  the only champions since the 1980's to win a championship without a MVP or DPOY on the roster (i.e. a player on the team had won it already).  The odds of that happening again are thus very small.  So either Tatum needs to win the league MVP, White needs to win DPOY, or they need to trade for that player. 

Also, the Knicks are the only team left that doesn't have a dpoy or mvp on their roster.  The Cavs have both (harden and mobley), the Thunder have the 2 time mvp, and the spurs have the dpoy.  So that string will likely continue again this year.

that still sticks in your craw doesn't it? 

[Moranis]

The Celtics in 24 are  the only champions since the 1980's to win a championship without a MVP or DPOY on the roster (i.e. a player on the team had won it already).  The odds of that happening again are thus very small.  So either Tatum needs to win the league MVP, White needs to win DPOY, or they need to trade for that player. 

Also, the Knicks are the only team left that doesn't have a dpoy or mvp on their roster.  The Cavs have both (harden and mobley), the Thunder have the 2 time mvp, and the spurs have the dpoy.  So that string will likely continue again this year.

that still sticks in your craw doesn't it?

no I am glad they won, it just doesn't make it very repeatable.  Winning one is awesome, but it is just going to be one.  History matters. There are one off teams about every 15 to 20 years that are the exception, but those teams don't win 2 and are lucky to win 1.  The. Celtics making 2 Finals, winning one, with Tatum and Brown at the top of the roster already has far exceeded historical precedence. It was great, but is extremely unlikely to happen again. 

[smicker16]

The Celtics in 24 are  the only champions since the 1980's to win a championship without a MVP or DPOY on the roster (i.e. a player on the team had won it already).  The odds of that happening again are thus very small.  So either Tatum needs to win the league MVP, White needs to win DPOY, or they need to trade for that player. 

Also, the Knicks are the only team left that doesn't have a dpoy or mvp on their roster.  The Cavs have both (harden and mobley), the Thunder have the 2 time mvp, and the spurs have the dpoy.  So that string will likely continue again this year.

I do not think the Cavs are the best example as I think MVP is the bigger factor and Harden is well past that person now. However I agree with the overall premise and this is why I would want to trade Brown for Giannis but I just do not think he is going to end up having enough value to make that happen. In which case I feel the best alternative option is keeping him and hope we have another playoff run facing some injured teams. I do not see another near MVP caliber player they will be able to trade Jaylen for. Like if they trade Brown for Mobley I do not think that moves the needle enough even though he was a former DPOY. Not saying the Cavs would even do that but just as an example.

Best case is Brown and a 1st or two for Giannis but that has some risks and I still do not think that is enough for the Bucks.

My expectation is I will probably end up hoping Hugo, Queta, Walsh and Baylor really develop after this season to help us get back to 2024 levels which could see us in the finals in a weak East and then who knows what happens.

[Who]

I don't think Giannis will win another MVP.

I don't think he is on the same level of SGA, Jokic or Wemby.

[gift]

The Celtics in 24 are  the only champions since the 1980's to win a championship without a MVP or DPOY on the roster (i.e. a player on the team had won it already).  The odds of that happening again are thus very small.  So either Tatum needs to win the league MVP, White needs to win DPOY, or they need to trade for that player. 

Also, the Knicks are the only team left that doesn't have a dpoy or mvp on their roster.  The Cavs have both (harden and mobley), the Thunder have the 2 time mvp, and the spurs have the dpoy.  So that string will likely continue again this year.

that's not as meaningful as it sounds. the MVP is often the best player in the league (increasing their odds of winning MVP), but it often is just a top 5 player that happens to have a good story that year. Tatum is capable of being the top 5 guy in a given year and whether or not the narrative rewards him with an MVP is arbitrary to championship odds (relative to other top 5s of similar value). i'd love for Tatum to have that type of season, but it doesn't really matter. he checks that box already when it comes to championship prerequisites. his MVP chances and the strength of his teams will correlate somewhat.

[Vermont Green]

The Celtics in 24 are  the only champions since the 1980's to win a championship without a MVP or DPOY on the roster (i.e. a player on the team had won it already).  The odds of that happening again are thus very small.  So either Tatum needs to win the league MVP, White needs to win DPOY, or they need to trade for that player. 

Also, the Knicks are the only team left that doesn't have a dpoy or mvp on their roster.  The Cavs have both (harden and mobley), the Thunder have the 2 time mvp, and the spurs have the dpoy.  So that string will likely continue again this year.

Someone else already said it but if we trade for Giannis, then BOS will have a past MVP and be able to win a title per the criteria.  And the fact that Tatum and Brown won a title together very recently without being an MVP or DPOY weakens the thesis quite a bit.  It is not like some random team did it in the past, these specific players did it recently.

I don't dispute that winning a title with Tatum-Brown or Tatum-Giannis is going to be harder going forward than it was in 2024.  But the alternative is to go through a period of seasons where the team is totally bad in the hopes that maybe they will come out of it and be good.  SAS and OKC were bad for a lot of seasons.  DET too.  BKN, SAC and several other teams are still bad.  PHI has been bad for a really long time and still is not title good.

The way I see it, Tatum-Brown or Tatum-Giannis have a chance to win a title in the next say 3 seasons.  If you blow it up, you will be bad for up to 5 seasons, and after all that, you may not even have a better chance to win a title than you do right now.  There is a guarantee that the team will be bad, but no guarantee that the team after 5 seasons will be title good.  That process is inevitable, I am just not in any hurry to start it.