Celtics News

[Vermont Green]

Interesting fact: Tatum is the only guy to do it and not win finals MVP

Exactly.  What does a guy have to do to win Series MVP?

[Roy H.]

Interesting fact: Tatum is the only guy to do it and not win finals MVP

Exactly.  What does a guy have to do to win Series MVP?

I thought that JT would win it, but my guess that voters weighed Games 1 through 3 more heavily than Games 4 and 5.  In the course of going up 3-0, JB was outplaying JT both as a scorer and defender.

I double-checked the numbers to see if I was recalling correctly.  Through three games (3-0):

JB: 24.3 points, 6.0 rebounds, 5.7 assists, 2.0 steals, 1.3 blocks, 55.1% FG%, 25.0% 3PT%

JT: 21.7 points, 8.7 rebounds, 7.3 assists, 0.7 steals, 0.3 blocks, 35.9% FG%, 29.6% 3PT%

[Vermont Green]

Interesting fact: Tatum is the only guy to do it and not win finals MVP

Exactly.  What does a guy have to do to win Series MVP?

I thought that JT would win it, but my guess that voters weighed Games 1 through 3 more heavily than Games 4 and 5.  In the course of going up 3-0, JB was outplaying JT both as a scorer and defender.

I double-checked the numbers to see if I was recalling correctly.  Through three games (3-0):

JB: 24.3 points, 6.0 rebounds, 5.7 assists, 2.0 steals, 1.3 blocks, 55.1% FG%, 25.0% 3PT%

JT: 21.7 points, 8.7 rebounds, 7.3 assists, 0.7 steals, 0.3 blocks, 35.9% FG%, 29.6% 3PT%

You could be right about the voters, I don't know what they were thinking.  But if you watch the games, and have an even medium level of understanding of the game, it is easy to see that defenses focus on Tatum first and foremost.  Dallas did this.  Double team him every time.  Tilt the defense in his direction every time.  They do that because they believe that Tatum is the best player on the floor and he is.  He was the best player on the floor in the finals too.

Tatum just being on the floor makes it easier for everyone else, including Brown.  Brown played well, he defended well, always does, but even in these first 3 games, Tatum got 45% more rebounds per game and 28% more assists.  I am not big on assists as a raw stat, but it is an indicator.  Tatum's rebounding is uber important because of the Celtic's small ball.  Tatum was the best player on the floor.  He is more important to the team winning now and was in the finals.

[Roy H.]

Interesting fact: Tatum is the only guy to do it and not win finals MVP

Exactly.  What does a guy have to do to win Series MVP?

I thought that JT would win it, but my guess that voters weighed Games 1 through 3 more heavily than Games 4 and 5.  In the course of going up 3-0, JB was outplaying JT both as a scorer and defender.

I double-checked the numbers to see if I was recalling correctly.  Through three games (3-0):

JB: 24.3 points, 6.0 rebounds, 5.7 assists, 2.0 steals, 1.3 blocks, 55.1% FG%, 25.0% 3PT%

JT: 21.7 points, 8.7 rebounds, 7.3 assists, 0.7 steals, 0.3 blocks, 35.9% FG%, 29.6% 3PT%

You could be right about the voters, I don't know what they were thinking.  But if you watch the games, and have an even medium level of understanding of the game, it is easy to see that defenses focus on Tatum first and foremost.  Dallas did this.  Double team him every time.  Tilt the defense in his direction every time.  They do that because they believe that Tatum is the best player on the floor and he is.  He was the best player on the floor in the finals too.

Tatum just being on the floor makes it easier for everyone else, including Brown.  Brown played well, he defended well, always does, but even in these first 3 games, Tatum got 45% more rebounds per game and 28% more assists.  I am not big on assists as a raw stat, but it is an indicator.  Tatum's rebounding is uber important because of the Celtic's small ball.  Tatum was the best player on the floor.  He is more important to the team winning now and was in the finals.

I don't necessarily disagree with your characterization of Tatum's impact on the opposing defense.  He's our best player.  But, should MVP always go to a team's best player? 

If you go back and watch Games 1 through 3, JB elevated his play, while JT had a couple of below average games.  Games 4 and 5 impacted the stats and made JT's overall series look more impressive, but I do think that in the most important games, JB set the tone on offense and frustrated Luka on defense.  (And again, I was surprised by the JB pick, and just assumed like everybody else that JT would win.)

The one thing I hate about JB getting it as that dumb anti-Tatum fans have used it against him, in a "sure, you won a title but you weren't even the best player on the team so it means less" sort of a man.  It's nonsense. 

[Donoghus]

The one thing I hate about JB getting it as that dumb anti-Tatum fans have used it against him, in a "sure, you won a title but you weren't even the best player on the team so it means less" sort of a man.  It's nonsense.

However, it did send some of the Anti-JB fans into recluse.

[byennie]

The Finals MVP debate seems to go nowhere because of the historical comps. It was just a unique series. There are very rarely champions with two players so similar. Scoring outputs were nearly identical, they are both wings, one guy had a few more rebounds and assists, the other made some hard-to-measure defensive contributions. You can split hairs about which games were most important, and so on.

Honestly the most LOGICAL outcome would have been Co-MVPs, because it's too easy to make a case for each.

It's not uncommon either in various MVP races, to come in 2nd with a performance that might have been 1st another year.

[Neurotic Guy]

Interesting fact: Tatum is the only guy to do it and not win finals MVP

Exactly.  What does a guy have to do to win Series MVP?

I thought that JT would win it, but my guess that voters weighed Games 1 through 3 more heavily than Games 4 and 5.  In the course of going up 3-0, JB was outplaying JT both as a scorer and defender.

I double-checked the numbers to see if I was recalling correctly.  Through three games (3-0):

JB: 24.3 points, 6.0 rebounds, 5.7 assists, 2.0 steals, 1.3 blocks, 55.1% FG%, 25.0% 3PT%

JT: 21.7 points, 8.7 rebounds, 7.3 assists, 0.7 steals, 0.3 blocks, 35.9% FG%, 29.6% 3PT%

You could be right about the voters, I don't know what they were thinking.  But if you watch the games, and have an even medium level of understanding of the game, it is easy to see that defenses focus on Tatum first and foremost.  Dallas did this.  Double team him every time.  Tilt the defense in his direction every time.  They do that because they believe that Tatum is the best player on the floor and he is.  He was the best player on the floor in the finals too.

Tatum just being on the floor makes it easier for everyone else, including Brown.  Brown played well, he defended well, always does, but even in these first 3 games, Tatum got 45% more rebounds per game and 28% more assists.  I am not big on assists as a raw stat, but it is an indicator.  Tatum's rebounding is uber important because of the Celtic's small ball.  Tatum was the best player on the floor.  He is more important to the team winning now and was in the finals.

If Cs repeat I think it will be pretty unlikely that JT will not win series MVP.  Then we?ll see how JB responds.  I think Jayson is a more complete player this year and I love how he finishes at the rim, and his passing has been great. Still agonizing to watch the dribble and inevitable three, but he?s a fantastic player and I?m glad he?s here. And I thought for sure he?d locked up last year?s Finals MVP. was really surprised when they called JB.  Not taking away that JB was great - love his game and glad he?s here too.

[4THQTR]

The Finals MVP debate seems to go nowhere because of the historical comps. It was just a unique series. There are very rarely champions with two players so similar. Scoring outputs were nearly identical, they are both wings, one guy had a few more rebounds and assists, the other made some hard-to-measure defensive contributions. You can split hairs about which games were most important, and so on.

Honestly the most LOGICAL outcome would have been Co-MVPs, because it's too easy to make a case for each.

It's not uncommon either in various MVP races, to come in 2nd with a performance that might have been 1st another year.

Yes, I am not trying to argue that Tatum was robbed or there weren?t reasonable arguments for JB. It?s just amazing that we have a guy who can dominate stats across the board like Tatum and still have another guy who can win Finals and ECF MVP alongside him in JB. Goes to show you just how awsome JB also was these two series!

[Redz]

Yes, Dallas put a ton of defensive focus on Tatum, which put more of the scoring burden on JB.  JB took that weight and excelled.  Tatum gets knocked for deferring, but it led to wins.  It?s a sacrifice he made, and it cost him the MVP.  MVP don?t get MVP for deferring to others.  It?s just how it goes. 

I did think Tatum was going to get the MVP with recency bias when he took over in the clincher, but that was really his only dominant scoring stretch. 

[Goldstar88]

You tell them, Brad!

Brad Stevens dismisses possibility of becoming Indiana University head coach

Jeff Goodman: BREAKING: Boston Celtics president of basketball operations Brad Stevens told @TheFieldOf68 that he is not a candidate for the Indiana University job. I thoroughly appreciate being a Celtic and love the people I get to work with every day, Stevens told @TheFieldOf68.   via Twitter GoodmanHoops

[mobilija]

The Finals MVP debate seems to go nowhere because of the historical comps. It was just a unique series. There are very rarely champions with two players so similar. Scoring outputs were nearly identical, they are both wings, one guy had a few more rebounds and assists, the other made some hard-to-measure defensive contributions. You can split hairs about which games were most important, and so on.

Honestly the most LOGICAL outcome would have been Co-MVPs, because it's too easy to make a case for each.

It's not uncommon either in various MVP races, to come in 2nd with a performance that might have been 1st another year.

Yes, I am not trying to argue that Tatum was robbed or there weren?t reasonable arguments for JB. It?s just amazing that we have a guy who can dominate stats across the board like Tatum and still have another guy who can win Finals and ECF MVP alongside him in JB. Goes to show you just how awsome JB also was these two series!

TP!
JB taking a huge step in his efficiency and being locked in defensively was a difference for us last year. His improvement was one of the biggest things that propelled us to a championship.

Hat tip to adding Porzingis, Jrue and Hauser development. But JB, 😘

[Phantom255x]

I don't really care anyways because what mattered is we won it all, but I think if Tatum had even just one other game where he put up 20+ points he wins FMVP. He had two games with 31 points, but the other three were all below 20. I think some voters factored that in.

Yeah I fully understand and acknowledge Dallas double and triple-teaming Tatum defensively but he still had some easy shots and bunnies that he bricked the first two games.

But whatever. In a way this might be a good thing for everyone. Maybe JT is motivated for another Finals run and to be ECFMVP and FMVP this season.

[Goldstar88]

Jaylen Brown has landed a new partnership deal with Oakley. While the company is primarily focused on its longtime distinctive eyewear, the deal is of note because of Brown?s flexibility to pursue any deal of his choosing. In launching his own footwear and apparel brand, 741 Performance, Brown is not bound to the typical category clauses that most athletes are boxed out from when they sign a traditional, layered shoe deal. Brown has already hinted at a potential 741 x Oakley collaboration, which would continue the strong start to branding that his upstart company had in Year 1.  via boardroom.tv

[Vermont Green]

Not to beat the finals MVP debate to death but I am old enough to remember the BOS-HOU finals in 1981.  You may recall that Cedric Maxwell won MVP over Larry Bird.  It was a similar situation in my mind.  Bird was clearly the best player.  HOU decided that Bird was not going to beat them and that opened up things for Maxwell.  HOU was conceding space to Maxwell in an effort to make sure Bird did not beat them.  Maxwell played great, he hit the shots that were there for him, and we won the title.

Maxwell   17.7 pts /  9.5 rebs / 2.8 asst / 0.2 stl / 1.0 blk
Bird        15.3 pts / 15.3 rebs / 7.0 asst / 2.3 stl / 0.5 blk

Of course Bird did not lead in all 3 of the traditional box score stats like Tatum did, but it is very much the same kind of thing.  Bird created the gravity that affected the defense that allowed Maxwell more open shots, more space.  Maxwell responded and made HOU pay.  Dennis Johnson got a lot of point in the playoffs that way too.  DJ was always the one that the other team decided they would let beat them over Bird or McHale.

I feel that Tatum deserved the finals MVP.  Brown was not undeserving, I just feel that Tatum was the most important player which to me is synonymous with most valuable.  Let's hope Tatum wins it this year.

[Goldstar88]

Jaylen Brown explains why he refers to himself as the Celtics captain.

One, I?m the longest-tenured Celtic. I?ve been here the longest, so even though we don?t necessarily have it written down, the team moves to the things me and Jayson do, Brown said, per Bobby Manning. I feel like my team relies on me to be the leader, the vocal leader. I?ve taken that role, and defensively, being the head of the snake, taking on those matchups, my team feeds off that.

So, it?s understood I guess.