Can Jrue get the C's an NBA Title

[Roy H.]

It all comes down to health, and getting some minimal level of production from the new bench guys.

I wouldn't trade our roster for anybody's.

[cman88]

It all comes down to health, and getting some minimal level of production from the new bench guys.

I wouldn't trade our roster for anybody's.

Yeah I agree with this. Hopefully our guys on the bench can contribute.

I'm fully expecting 2 of Tatum/brown/holiday/KP in the floor at all times IMO.

[Roy H.]

It all comes down to health, and getting some minimal level of production from the new bench guys.

I wouldn't trade our roster for anybody's.

Yeah I agree with this. Hopefully our guys on the bench can contribute.

I'm fully expecting 2 of Tatum/brown/holiday/KP in the floor at all times IMO.

And having Horford and/or White to play with two of those four is a nice luxury to have.

[Moranis]

He will have to play well for Boston to win the title, but as it always is with these things, it will come down to Tatum.  Tatum has to elevate his game to another level and stay at that level consistently throughout the playoffs.  If Tatum does that, Boston will have an excellent shot.  If Tatum doesn't, then Boston won't win the title.  Your best player has to be great and has to play like an all time great for the entire playoff run.  That is how you win championships.  secondary, tertiary, etc. players certainly help and can help elevate the game of the primary, but you have always needed the primary player to play like it.

[Roy H.]

One thing I love about this team:  if Tatum is having an off game, everything won't fall on Brown now.  No disrespect to Smart, Horford, White or Brogdon, but particularly in the playoffs we lacked a guy who could step up into a primary scoring role consistently if Tatum or Brown was playing poorly.

Between Jrue and KP, I think we've solved that issue.

[Vermont Green]

It is interesting to me that it is Jrue Holiday who is at some level carrying the expectation to "get the C's an NBA title".  He is a new player so I get it but why not Porzingis?

The way I am trying to look at it is what was missing from last season's team that prevented us from winning the title.  What needs to be added or fixed to make the team better?  And whatever that was, can Jrue Holiday and/or Porzingis address the need?  The problem is that I am not sure that what went wrong against MIA had anything to do with personnel.

Last season, Rob Williams only started 20 regular season games and 4 playoff games.  He was not a starter.  If the assumption is that the Celtics will be primarily a 1-big team, like last season, Porzingis becomes the 1 primary big and I see that as an upgrade over Horford.  Horford becomes the primary back up.  Porzingis + Horford seems like an improvement over Horford + Williams.

As to combo guards, last season, due to the smaller line up approach, the guards were Smart + White + Brogdon.  Now, if you assume a similar positional rotation, the combo guards will be Holiday + White + Pritchard.  I see Holiday as an upgrade on Smart, Smart was good, Holiday is just better.  But now we have Pritchard getting Brogdon's minutes.  That is not an upgrade.  So is this guard rotation an upgrade?  Probably not if Pritchard plays as much as Brogdon did.

Our wings are about the same, Tatum + Brown + Hauser, any improvement here will have to come from individual development.

The last grouping is what I consider big depth.  Last season it was Grant + Griffin + Kornet.  In my mind, Grant has been replaced with Brissett and Griffin at this point is being replaced with Wenyen Gabriel.  That gives us Brissett + Gabriel + Kornet.  It is hard to gauge how important this grouping is.  During the regular season, Horford and Porzingis will miss games so this group is going to see minutes.  Not so much in the playoffs.  Brissett and Gabriel may turn out to be important new pieces.

So the net of all this is that from a purely personnel standpoint, I think we are only slightly better.  Holiday is important but so aren't Porzingis, Brissett, and Gabriel (or whoever ends up in that role).  I think there were some buy in issues last season due to the abrupt coaching change right at the start of the season that ended up rearing its head in the MIA series.  Hopefully the team is over all of that.

[keevsnick]

One thing I love about this team:  if Tatum is having an off game, everything won't fall on Brown now.  No disrespect to Smart, Horford, White or Brogdon, but particularly in the playoffs we lacked a guy who could step up into a primary scoring role consistently if Tatum or Brown was playing poorly.

Between Jrue and KP, I think we've solved that issue.

In theory sure. I will point out that Porzingis has almost zero playoff experience and Jrue has been pretty bad offensively in the playoffs most of his career. So I'd still leave a small "?" on this come playoff time.

[KG Living Legend]

He will have to play well for Boston to win the title, but as it always is with these things, it will come down to Tatum.  Tatum has to elevate his game to another level and stay at that level consistently throughout the playoffs.  If Tatum does that, Boston will have an excellent shot.  If Tatum doesn't, then Boston won't win the title.  Your best player has to be great and has to play like an all time great for the entire playoff run.  That is how you win championships.  secondary, tertiary, etc. players certainly help and can help elevate the game of the primary, but you have always needed the primary player to play like it.

 Moranis hits the nail on the head. Tatum has to go from a top five ish player to top three or even the best player in the league status. .

 Hard to pass Joker right now but I'd like to see Tatum claim second best player in the world status with a title run.

[GetLucky]

EDIT: wrong thread

[cman88]

He will have to play well for Boston to win the title, but as it always is with these things, it will come down to Tatum.  Tatum has to elevate his game to another level and stay at that level consistently throughout the playoffs.  If Tatum does that, Boston will have an excellent shot.  If Tatum doesn't, then Boston won't win the title.  Your best player has to be great and has to play like an all time great for the entire playoff run.  That is how you win championships.  secondary, tertiary, etc. players certainly help and can help elevate the game of the primary, but you have always needed the primary player to play like it.

 Moranis hits the nail on the head. Tatum has to go from a top five ish player to top three or even the best player in the league status. .

 Hard to pass Joker right now but I'd like to see Tatum claim second best player in the world status with a title run.

I agree, but at the same time these moves are made to make it easier for tatum/brown. I mean you saw how seamless KP was able to score in the 1st preseason game with the attention they get. I dont think tatum needs to be top 2. just Top 5 and maybe more aggressive.

and Jrue was an all-star last year. so you are losing depth for more upside talent who can score on their own rights. your hope is 2 of the 4 are going off at least each night.

I do agree though it's time for Tatum to take more of a "go kill you" type role. I mean i dont want to see these 0 through 3rd quarter games anymore. or sitting in a corner while smart takes 15 shots.

but in a way thats why I think they traded Smart. amazing role player but I do think he played "above" his role at times. and being the elder statesman JT/jb deferred.

this is clearly their team now.

[Kernewek]

I think the biggest factor is still going to be whether Tatum has another level of efficiency he can reach and being able to score in the halfcourt consistently. Then the second biggest is whether Porzingis can stay healthy for an entire playoff series and physically hold up against guys like Adebayo, Embiid, Giannis, and Jokic.

That being said, there were definitely playoff games where I said to myself, if Marcus could hit the open three more regularly this game would be over. The defenses were always designed to tempt him to take the shot, and that will be a less effective strategy with Holiday there. I know Holiday has had his bad shooting games in the playoffs as well, but his catch-and-shoot numbers suggest he should be better in that spot.

This is where I fall as well, in terms of who is going to be contributing to a title and how they fit into what we've seen so far.

[Alleyoopster]

Teams have found ways of defending the Celtics.

Joe and his braintrust will have to find better ways of springing Jason and Jaylen free to shoot open jumpers. Teams simply collapse on them whenever they try to drive to the hoop.

Coaching may be a major reason this team wins or loses this year. They still need better rebounders and help in the middle.

[Vermont Green]

I expect Holiday is going to play a key role if/when the Celtics win the title.  But obviously, if Tatum were to suffer a season ending injury, Holiday is not going to lead the team to the title, whereas if Holiday gets injured, Tatum can keep us very much in the hunt for a title.

Look at DEN last season.  Jokic is clearly the key, he is their Batman, but it was the play of Murray as Robin that got them over the top.  I like what the Celtics have in that on any given night, Brown or Porzingis or Holiday can be "Robin".  Most teams don't have that kind of versatility, but we still need Tatum to be Batman, at least on most nights.

And even the Batman role, we have multiple guys who can play well enough to be Batman on any given night if Tatum is having an off night.  Or collectively, the Robins can make up for a Tatum bad night.  But that won't work on an extended basis, we need Tatum of course, he is our best player.  But I feel Tatum, the say 5th best player in the league, first team all NBA, is plenty good enough at that level to lead this team to a title.

[Phantom255x]

A lot is really gonna come down to health, especially with our frontcourt. That said, Holiday is a very underrated player and I think his championship/playoff experience will help a lot too, especially as we get deeper into the playoffs.

I love Smart and will miss him, but Holiday is a better player and much better scorer. And truth be told, there were a lot of issues last year but I also felt one issue was Smart definitely didn't seem to be playing DPOY-caliber like he usually does. Opposing guards had no problem scoring on him. It made him pretty meh out there since he's not usually scoring 14+ PPG either, and he wasn't as impactful as he was during the 2022 run.

Now in fairness, Holiday also didn't look as good during the Heat series defensively. But I'd also argue that during the regular season while Giannis was out, and Middleton too, he stepped up and carried that whole team and had a ton of clutch moments and big wins. Smart doesn't have that kinda impact.

[cman88]

A lot is really gonna come down to health, especially with our frontcourt. That said, Holiday is a very underrated player and I think his championship/playoff experience will help a lot too, especially as we get deeper into the playoffs.

I love Smart and will miss him, but Holiday is a better player and much better scorer. And truth be told, there were a lot of issues last year but I also felt one issue was Smart definitely didn't seem to be playing DPOY-caliber like he usually does. Opposing guards had no problem scoring on him. It made him pretty meh out there since he's not usually scoring 14+ PPG either, and he wasn't as impactful as he was during the 2022 run.

Now in fairness, Holiday also didn't look as good during the Heat series defensively. But I'd also argue that during the regular season while Giannis was out, and Middleton too, he stepped up and carried that whole team and had a ton of clutch moments and big wins. Smart doesn't have that kinda impact.

smart as much as i love him also was the longest tenured celtic and viewed himself as much on offense. There were games he's taking more shots than tatum/brown and id bang my head against the wall.

Holiday is coming into a team where hes the "new guy" he might be more apt to buy into his "role"

the biggest question on the season is our bench and are they ready to contribute more? pritchard/hauser/brisett/kornet. we need these guys to elevate their games and prove they can pick up for what we lost with brogdon/grant/timelord etc.