Brown Needs To Go

[Who]

I don't think much of Atlanta in general. Trae Young is their only player that I regard as having high end talent. He is the only player there I would consider trading Jaylen Brown for.

I see D Murray and J Collins as good starters but not stars.

[dannyboy35]

Just watching an old Patrick Ewing game. He caught the ball out at the three point line the corner and decided to drive on his man (slow footed Kevin Duckworth) and dribbled the ball off his leg.

Amazing how similar Ewing looked to Jaylen Brown on that play.

Clunky. That is the word. Clunky driving the ball.

   Yeah, I think it’s not that Jaylen isn’t coordinated but there has to be sone awareness on where to put the ball. Sometimes you just have to accept you need to pick the ball up. No shame in that. Joker as a center can really handle it but knows he’s gotta pick up his dribble sometimes. Dribbling has to have a purpose.

[dannyboy35]

  I wish Jaylen would continue to do the things he does well but less creating and more stuff off pin downs . Stick to that great midrange . But know when to pick it up or retreat. Part of this falls on the system though and coaching. I wish Jaylen made it a goal to try to make an all defensive team.

[Vermont Green]

My position is that they should only trade Brown if it is a really good trade for the Celtics, full stop.  So all my proposed trades are going to be good for the Celtics.

Atlanta seems like a viable trade partner.  My Atlanta trade is as follows:

Brown
Muscala

for

Murray
Bey
Okongwu

This does not fully address our roster imbalance as the key piece coming back (Murray) is another combo guard, but we get a solid back up wing (Bey) and a young big, so overall, I am OK with this.  Smart or White may need to go in a subsequent trade to address roster balance.

I think another potential trade partner is Toronto:

Brown
White

for

Siakam
Barnes
Achiuwa

I am not thrilled to give up White (I think many would prefer to send out Smart and that is fine, it still works) but we add a lot of versatility and get bigger.  I think both Siakam and Barnes would do well with Tatum.  I know that TOR including Barnes is a stretch but if they want Brown, they are going to have to give something up.

The final trade I have thought of is a straight up Brown for Towns.  Towns has the same contract issues later that Brown would have, we end up with two really big contracts.  Towns is a risk, he has had some inconsistency, but I think if you got him on the right team, he would be the star that he has shown flashes of being (more than flashes really).

[keevsnick]

My position is that they should only trade Brown if it is a really good trade for the Celtics, full stop.  So all my proposed trades are going to be good for the Celtics.

Atlanta seems like a viable trade partner.  My Atlanta trade is as follows:

Brown
Muscala

for

Murray
Bey
Okongwu

This does not fully address our roster imbalance as the key piece coming back (Murray) is another combo guard, but we get a solid back up wing (Bey) and a young big, so overall, I am OK with this.  Smart or White may need to go in a subsequent trade to address roster balance.

I think another potential trade partner is Toronto:

Brown
White

for

Siakam
Barnes
Achiuwa

I am not thrilled to give up White (I think many would prefer to send out Smart and that is fine, it still works) but we add a lot of versatility and get bigger.  I think both Siakam and Barnes would do well with Tatum.  I know that TOR including Barnes is a stretch but if they want Brown, they are going to have to give something up.

The final trade I have thought of is a straight up Brown for Towns.  Towns has the same contract issues later that Brown would have, we end up with two really big contracts.  Towns is a risk, he has had some inconsistency, but I think if you got him on the right team, he would be the star that he has shown flashes of being (more than flashes really).

The Brown for Murray stuff just puzzles me at this point. Brown is waaaay better than Murray, we just saw him kick his butt all over the basketball court for 6 games. Jaylen Brown held Murray to 3-16 shooting when guarding him, Jaylen Brown put up 11-18 shooting when being guarded by him. Look, I know we have short memories as fans but this was like 4 weeks ago.

As for Brown/Siakam, that isn't happening. The Raptors are not, literally 0% chnace, trading Barnes and Siakam for one season of Jaylen Brown. And that's what it would be, since trading both Siakam and Barnes means the resulting team probably isn't good enough to get Jaylen to stay. They refused to trade Barnes for 4 years of KD last off season, they aren't moving him now.

Even straight Brown for Siakam probably isn't happening. That swap maybe makes the Raptors a little better, but good enough to get Brown to re-sign? Ehhhhh, probably not. Meanwhile Siakam has the same problem Brown has, he's an expiring. The difference is Boston has the "hammer" of a super-max offer they can use on Brown, they don't have that for Siakam, so he's a MUCH  bigger flight risk. And older.

A five year deal for Brown is his ages 28-32, for Siakam its 30-34. That matters a little as well.

[dannyboy35]

  I definitely want to keep Jaylen. I’d really like to move on from Marcus.

[celticinorlando]

As much as I want Brown gone, he's not going anywhere.

I think Brogdan is the one that gets moved this summer.

[LilRip]

Almost everybody outside this board wants JB. Given that, do you keep him or use him as a valuable trade chip?

I wouldn’t mind trading him but I don’t want random parts for JB. I want a better fit allstar or a borderline allstar AND a rotation player (or decent pick/s). I also don’t mind keeping him, but something in the team has to change (coaching staff?)

[boscel33]

  I definitely want to keep Jaylen. I’d really like to move on from Marcus.

Amen and TP!

[gouki88]

Read a few stories coming out of ATL and listening to my family in GA, JB is their #1 target this off season.

One proposal I found was:

Boston In:  Collins, Griffin, Johnson, two 1st's
ATL In:  JB

An alternative had Bey in for Griffin.

I liked Bey in 2020, thought the C's might go with him over Nesmith, but they didn't.  IMO, Collins would make RWill expendable and would be an upgrade.  Johnson and Griffin, I'll admit, really don't know a lot about them. 

That all said, not sure.  If I were to think on it, I'd probably lean Collins, Griffin, Johnson and the 1st's because.  Getting Bey and Johnson I think are getting essentially the same players, while I think getting Griffin and Johnson gives the C's a SG and a SF.

Adding Collins to the mix improves the big scoring over RWill, including from the outside.

My 1st reaction was "who the heck are Johnson and Griffin?" My 2nd reaction was "should I know who these guys are?"

Then looking up the Hawks roster to find out who they are. Can you tell me more about them? What do you like about them? How good do you think they are? Do you see them as good bench pieces or long term starters down the road?

I clearly know very little about them.

Johnson has not come along as hoped, but Griffin is good. Son of Adrian, he's an elite shooter who is a good athlete with solid defence. Could probably be a Caleb Martin type

[ozgod]

Tracy McGrady says fans who want to ship Jaylen out are crazy.

Seven-time NBA all-star Tracy McGrady thinks the Celtics should keep Jaylen Brown long-term, despite his struggles in this year’s playoffs.

Brown and Jayson Tatum are too good of a duo to break up, McGrady said during an appearance on Showtime Basketball’s “What’s Burnin.”

“You don’t dismantle that. I’m sorry. Hell yeah, you keep that. They’re 25 and 26 year olds,” McGrady said. “Why would you get rid of that? I don’t understand. Why would you get rid of two guys who played for an NBA championship, went to four Eastern Conference Finals. At some point these guys are going to raise a banner.”

McGrady offered some criticism of Boston fans who think Celtics coach Joe Mazzulla should be fired and that Brown should be traded.

“That’s Boston,” McGrady said. “If they’re not hanging banners, everybody needs to be fired. They want to trade Jaylen Brown, they want to do all this stuff, they’re crazy. There’s no way I’m getting rid of Jaylen Brown.”

McGrady pointed to older stars leaving the league as a big part of why the Celtics should keep Brown and Tatum.

“Lebron is on his way out,” McGrady said. “Steph is getting older. KD and those guys are getting older. These guys are 25 and 26 years old. You’re not going to find a better duo than these two.”

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2023/06/02/tracy-mcgrady-celtics-fans-who-want-to-trade-jaylen-brown-are-crazy/

Are we as fans overreacting to a bad game and series? Or are we confident we can find another All-NBA/All-Star player that has less of Jaylen's flaws pretty easily once we get rid of him?

[Surferdad]

Tracy McGrady says fans who want to ship Jaylen out are crazy.

Seven-time NBA all-star Tracy McGrady thinks the Celtics should keep Jaylen Brown long-term, despite his struggles in this year’s playoffs.

Brown and Jayson Tatum are too good of a duo to break up, McGrady said during an appearance on Showtime Basketball’s “What’s Burnin.”

“You don’t dismantle that. I’m sorry. Hell yeah, you keep that. They’re 25 and 26 year olds,” McGrady said. “Why would you get rid of that? I don’t understand. Why would you get rid of two guys who played for an NBA championship, went to four Eastern Conference Finals. At some point these guys are going to raise a banner.”

McGrady offered some criticism of Boston fans who think Celtics coach Joe Mazzulla should be fired and that Brown should be traded.

“That’s Boston,” McGrady said. “If they’re not hanging banners, everybody needs to be fired. They want to trade Jaylen Brown, they want to do all this stuff, they’re crazy. There’s no way I’m getting rid of Jaylen Brown.”

McGrady pointed to older stars leaving the league as a big part of why the Celtics should keep Brown and Tatum.

“Lebron is on his way out,” McGrady said. “Steph is getting older. KD and those guys are getting older. These guys are 25 and 26 years old. You’re not going to find a better duo than these two.”

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2023/06/02/tracy-mcgrady-celtics-fans-who-want-to-trade-jaylen-brown-are-crazy/

Are we as fans overreacting to a bad game and series? Or are we confident we can find another All-NBA/All-Star player that has less of Jaylen's flaws pretty easily once we get rid of him?

Yes many of us are over-reacting. I listened to the interview of McGrady by Rachel and thought he was spot-on. He gave an unbiased opinion that rang true to me. All season long, it was often acknowledged by other talking heads that JT/JB is the best duo in the league. They were one win away from the Finals and most people recognize G7 could have gone the other way if not for injuries to Tatum, Brogdon and Robert Williams III (he was sick, throwing up).

[Who]

Tracy McGrady says fans who want to ship Jaylen out are crazy.

Seven-time NBA all-star Tracy McGrady thinks the Celtics should keep Jaylen Brown long-term, despite his struggles in this year’s playoffs.

Brown and Jayson Tatum are too good of a duo to break up, McGrady said during an appearance on Showtime Basketball’s “What’s Burnin.”

“You don’t dismantle that. I’m sorry. Hell yeah, you keep that. They’re 25 and 26 year olds,” McGrady said. “Why would you get rid of that? I don’t understand. Why would you get rid of two guys who played for an NBA championship, went to four Eastern Conference Finals. At some point these guys are going to raise a banner.”

McGrady offered some criticism of Boston fans who think Celtics coach Joe Mazzulla should be fired and that Brown should be traded.

“That’s Boston,” McGrady said. “If they’re not hanging banners, everybody needs to be fired. They want to trade Jaylen Brown, they want to do all this stuff, they’re crazy. There’s no way I’m getting rid of Jaylen Brown.”

McGrady pointed to older stars leaving the league as a big part of why the Celtics should keep Brown and Tatum.

“Lebron is on his way out,” McGrady said. “Steph is getting older. KD and those guys are getting older. These guys are 25 and 26 years old. You’re not going to find a better duo than these two.”

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2023/06/02/tracy-mcgrady-celtics-fans-who-want-to-trade-jaylen-brown-are-crazy/

Are we as fans overreacting to a bad game and series? Or are we confident we can find another All-NBA/All-Star player that has less of Jaylen's flaws pretty easily once we get rid of him?

It depends on the trade package. If it improves the team, you do it. If makes the team worse, you do not.

There is no need to get rid of Jaylen. He is not a negative asset. He is a positive contributor to the team. If there is no good trade to be made, give him his extension and keep him.

For some it is just an over-reaction to a bad series. Sadness and anger run rampant as they tend to do after a major letdown. But for many others it is not.

I do not view these trade discussions as an over-reaction to a bad series. That is too simple a take. But more as part of a continuing discussion about Jaylen's flaws and actual on-court value. Also, about whether Jaylen and Tatum are the best fit for one another. They fit well enough as seen by the team's success but can they, and in particular Tatum, do better with a different running mate who may suit their skill-set better.

Jaylen should not be discarded easily but he also should not be untouchable. He is a very good player. Whether he is top 20 or in the 20-30 range, he is highly valuable. Although I do think, even if he is in that 17-20 range, that Jaylen is more comparable to the talent at the back end of the top 30 (26-30) than he is to the 10-14 range talent wise.

[Surferdad]

Tracy McGrady says fans who want to ship Jaylen out are crazy.

Seven-time NBA all-star Tracy McGrady thinks the Celtics should keep Jaylen Brown long-term, despite his struggles in this year’s playoffs.

Brown and Jayson Tatum are too good of a duo to break up, McGrady said during an appearance on Showtime Basketball’s “What’s Burnin.”

“You don’t dismantle that. I’m sorry. Hell yeah, you keep that. They’re 25 and 26 year olds,” McGrady said. “Why would you get rid of that? I don’t understand. Why would you get rid of two guys who played for an NBA championship, went to four Eastern Conference Finals. At some point these guys are going to raise a banner.”

McGrady offered some criticism of Boston fans who think Celtics coach Joe Mazzulla should be fired and that Brown should be traded.

“That’s Boston,” McGrady said. “If they’re not hanging banners, everybody needs to be fired. They want to trade Jaylen Brown, they want to do all this stuff, they’re crazy. There’s no way I’m getting rid of Jaylen Brown.”

McGrady pointed to older stars leaving the league as a big part of why the Celtics should keep Brown and Tatum.

“Lebron is on his way out,” McGrady said. “Steph is getting older. KD and those guys are getting older. These guys are 25 and 26 years old. You’re not going to find a better duo than these two.”

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2023/06/02/tracy-mcgrady-celtics-fans-who-want-to-trade-jaylen-brown-are-crazy/

Are we as fans overreacting to a bad game and series? Or are we confident we can find another All-NBA/All-Star player that has less of Jaylen's flaws pretty easily once we get rid of him?

It depends on the trade package. If it improves the team, you do it. If makes the team worse, you do not.

There is no need to get rid of Jaylen. He is not a negative asset. He is a positive contributor to the team. If there is no good trade to be made, give him his extension and keep him.

For some it is just an over-reaction to a bad series. Sadness and anger run rampant as they tend to do after a major letdown. But for many others it is not.

I do not view these trade discussions as an over-reaction to a bad series. That is too simple a take. But more as part of a continuing discussion about Jaylen's flaws and actual on-court value. Also, about whether Jaylen and Tatum are the best fit for one another. They fit well enough as seen by the team's success but can they, and in particular Tatum, do better with a different running mate who may suit their skill-set better.

Jaylen should not be discarded easily but he also should not be untouchable. He is a very good player. Whether he is top 20 or in the 20-30 range, he is highly valuable. Although I do think, even if he is in that 17-20 range, that Jaylen is more comparable to the talent at the back end of the top 30 (26-30) than he is to the 10-14 range talent wise.

I agree with your post and I'll add that he is All-NBA so you can arguably make him top-15, so he's closer to 10-14 range than 26-30 range.

[keevsnick]

Tracy McGrady says fans who want to ship Jaylen out are crazy.

Seven-time NBA all-star Tracy McGrady thinks the Celtics should keep Jaylen Brown long-term, despite his struggles in this year’s playoffs.

Brown and Jayson Tatum are too good of a duo to break up, McGrady said during an appearance on Showtime Basketball’s “What’s Burnin.”

“You don’t dismantle that. I’m sorry. Hell yeah, you keep that. They’re 25 and 26 year olds,” McGrady said. “Why would you get rid of that? I don’t understand. Why would you get rid of two guys who played for an NBA championship, went to four Eastern Conference Finals. At some point these guys are going to raise a banner.”

McGrady offered some criticism of Boston fans who think Celtics coach Joe Mazzulla should be fired and that Brown should be traded.

“That’s Boston,” McGrady said. “If they’re not hanging banners, everybody needs to be fired. They want to trade Jaylen Brown, they want to do all this stuff, they’re crazy. There’s no way I’m getting rid of Jaylen Brown.”

McGrady pointed to older stars leaving the league as a big part of why the Celtics should keep Brown and Tatum.

“Lebron is on his way out,” McGrady said. “Steph is getting older. KD and those guys are getting older. These guys are 25 and 26 years old. You’re not going to find a better duo than these two.”

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2023/06/02/tracy-mcgrady-celtics-fans-who-want-to-trade-jaylen-brown-are-crazy/

Are we as fans overreacting to a bad game and series? Or are we confident we can find another All-NBA/All-Star player that has less of Jaylen's flaws pretty easily once we get rid of him?

Boston fans overreact? When has THAT ever happened?