Celtics Regular Season News

[Roy H.]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

[Phantom255x]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

So as much as I'd love to keep him beyond this season, if Grant commands 20M+ AAV then he's the one guy I'm fine letting go. I'm sure we can find a cheaper, suitable PF/C replacement in the offseason (or Draft) but this is also considering the idea of keeping White long term here. Possibly Brogdon too. But we can't pay everyone. Grant could be the odd man out in this scenario. Same with Pritchard possibly this offseason

[Celtics2021]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

I think it depends a bit what happens with the new CBA.  There could be a moderate cap spike in years 2-4 of Grant’s deal, if they raise the cap in advance of a new media deal, or just a huge one in year 3 if they don’t agree to smoothing.  With no smoothing, the cap might approach $190 million in year 3, and you can pay a guy like Grant $20 million in such a scenario, if you can afford it in the first two years.

[Phantom255x]

FWIW, Magic Number for the C's to clinch a play-in tournament spot is 9. For the 6 seed and an actual guaranteed playoff spot, 14 

[Atzar]

Not sure how Grant figures he's worth the same as a guy averaging 22 and doing a decent impression of a go-to scorer this season.  Grant is useful.  I like him.  I appreciate his ability to do a passable job on some really difficult defensive assignments.  But he averages 9/5/2 and his defense isn't THAT good. 

It's not like he pops off when guys are missing and he gets pushed into a larger role either.  Typically he just becomes turnover-prone when he tries to do too much with the ball in his hands. 

The flip side is that we can't replicate his skillset with this roster unless we ask too much from Al.  We NEED a guy with the defensive physicality to help check our biggest playoff threats, and those players aren't readily available in free agency for the money we'll be able to spend. 

[Vermont Green]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

Not sure if this is actual inside information or just conjecture by Stein but in any case, it sounds like it is probably accurate.  Grant Williams may well have asked for $20M thinking he was comparable to Keldon Johnson (which was probably an over pay in its own right).  Weren't the reports that the Celtics offered 4@$12.5M (about $50M total)?  Grant probably figures he can get at least that as a RFA and he probably will.  So why not test the market?

But I agree, if someone offers him much more than that, the smart move for the Celtics is to let him go, no matter what their overall  budget may or may not be.

On the other hand, Grant is a more important player than his box score reflects.  He is versatile, reliable, and durable.  A great combination for a bench player.  But he is also undersized for his position, and pretty one-dimensional on offense.  He probably should have taken the $50M.  There is a chance that he is not even offered that.  He might not see anything better than a tax payer MLE.

[Goldstar88]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

Not sure if this is actual inside information or just conjecture by Stein but in any case, it sounds like it is probably accurate.  Grant Williams may well have asked for $20M thinking he was comparable to Keldon Johnson (which was probably an over pay in its own right).  Weren't the reports that the Celtics offered 4@$12.5M (about $50M total)?  Grant probably figures he can get at least that as a RFA and he probably will.  So why not test the market?

But I agree, if someone offers him much more than that, the smart move for the Celtics is to let him go, no matter what their overall  budget may or may not be.

On the other hand, Grant is a more important player than his box score reflects.  He is versatile, reliable, and durable.  A great combination for a bench player.  But he is also undersized for his position, and pretty one-dimensional on offense.  He probably should have taken the $50M.  There is a chance that he is not even offered that.  He might not see anything better than a tax payer MLE.

He’s delusional if he believes that. Johnson is a much better player. Grants been worse than he was last year, overall. Decent role player, but I don’t think he’s worth more than $10m annually.

[tonydelk]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

Not sure if this is actual inside information or just conjecture by Stein but in any case, it sounds like it is probably accurate.  Grant Williams may well have asked for $20M thinking he was comparable to Keldon Johnson (which was probably an over pay in its own right).  Weren't the reports that the Celtics offered 4@$12.5M (about $50M total)?  Grant probably figures he can get at least that as a RFA and he probably will.  So why not test the market?

But I agree, if someone offers him much more than that, the smart move for the Celtics is to let him go, no matter what their overall  budget may or may not be.

On the other hand, Grant is a more important player than his box score reflects.  He is versatile, reliable, and durable.  A great combination for a bench player.  But he is also undersized for his position, and pretty one-dimensional on offense.  He probably should have taken the $50M.  There is a chance that he is not even offered that.  He might not see anything better than a tax payer MLE.

He’s delusional if he believes that. Johnson is a much better player. Grants been worse than he was last year, overall. Decent role player, but I don’t think he’s worth more than $10m annually.

Grant is playing decent minutes and no matter where he goes he will not be a top 2 option.  You could expect with more shots he can put up 13 and 6 with good D.  That is not a 20m type player.  At 20m you need to affect the game more then he does.  Look at Smart.  Is Grant as or more valuable then Smart?  Not even close.  With the way he's playing some idiot team may pay him 15m per year but I think he ends up at 10-12.  He's a good role player and nothing more. 

[Vermont Green]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

Not sure if this is actual inside information or just conjecture by Stein but in any case, it sounds like it is probably accurate.  Grant Williams may well have asked for $20M thinking he was comparable to Keldon Johnson (which was probably an over pay in its own right).  Weren't the reports that the Celtics offered 4@$12.5M (about $50M total)?  Grant probably figures he can get at least that as a RFA and he probably will.  So why not test the market?

But I agree, if someone offers him much more than that, the smart move for the Celtics is to let him go, no matter what their overall  budget may or may not be.

On the other hand, Grant is a more important player than his box score reflects.  He is versatile, reliable, and durable.  A great combination for a bench player.  But he is also undersized for his position, and pretty one-dimensional on offense.  He probably should have taken the $50M.  There is a chance that he is not even offered that.  He might not see anything better than a tax payer MLE.

He’s delusional if he believes that. Johnson is a much better player. Grants been worse than he was last year, overall. Decent role player, but I don’t think he’s worth more than $10m annually.

Grant is playing decent minutes and no matter where he goes he will not be a top 2 option.  You could expect with more shots he can put up 13 and 6 with good D.  That is not a 20m type player.  At 20m you need to affect the game more then he does.  Look at Smart.  Is Grant as or more valuable then Smart?  Not even close.  With the way he's playing some idiot team may pay him 15m per year but I think he ends up at 10-12.  He's a good role player and nothing more.

Unfortunately for Grant, he is kind of stuck in never-never land.  He doesn't have enough upside for a bad team (who likely would have cap space) to spend money on but he is a good target for a contending team looking for some depth.  The problem is that the contending teams aren't going to have the cap space to offer to Grant.

The taxpayer MLE next season is only $7M.  Non-taxpayer MLE is $11M but if a team uses that, they essentially end up hard capped.  A contending team is not going to hard cap themselves for Grant Williams, I don't expect.  Teams with cap space can make offers to Grant but only after they renounce all of their own FAs who may have cap holds.  That ends up being a hard cap in essence also.

Like I said, Grant probably should have taken the $50M (if in fact that was offered).

[radiohead]

JT is set to compete in the 3 point shoot out this All Star Weekend. I was hoping Sam would be invited.

[Phantom255x]

JT is set to compete in the 3 point shoot out this All Star Weekend. I was hoping Sam would be invited.

They wanted to give everyone else a fair shot 

[Celtics2021]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

Not sure if this is actual inside information or just conjecture by Stein but in any case, it sounds like it is probably accurate.  Grant Williams may well have asked for $20M thinking he was comparable to Keldon Johnson (which was probably an over pay in its own right).  Weren't the reports that the Celtics offered 4@$12.5M (about $50M total)?  Grant probably figures he can get at least that as a RFA and he probably will.  So why not test the market?

But I agree, if someone offers him much more than that, the smart move for the Celtics is to let him go, no matter what their overall  budget may or may not be.

On the other hand, Grant is a more important player than his box score reflects.  He is versatile, reliable, and durable.  A great combination for a bench player.  But he is also undersized for his position, and pretty one-dimensional on offense.  He probably should have taken the $50M.  There is a chance that he is not even offered that.  He might not see anything better than a tax payer MLE.

He’s delusional if he believes that. Johnson is a much better player. Grants been worse than he was last year, overall. Decent role player, but I don’t think he’s worth more than $10m annually.

Grant is playing decent minutes and no matter where he goes he will not be a top 2 option.  You could expect with more shots he can put up 13 and 6 with good D.  That is not a 20m type player.  At 20m you need to affect the game more then he does.  Look at Smart.  Is Grant as or more valuable then Smart?  Not even close.  With the way he's playing some idiot team may pay him 15m per year but I think he ends up at 10-12.  He's a good role player and nothing more.

Unfortunately for Grant, he is kind of stuck in never-never land.  He doesn't have enough upside for a bad team (who likely would have cap space) to spend money on but he is a good target for a contending team looking for some depth.  The problem is that the contending teams aren't going to have the cap space to offer to Grant.

The taxpayer MLE next season is only $7M.  Non-taxpayer MLE is $11M but if a team uses that, they essentially end up hard capped.  A contending team is not going to hard cap themselves for Grant Williams, I don't expect.  Teams with cap space can make offers to Grant but only after they renounce all of their own FAs who may have cap holds.  That ends up being a hard cap in essence also.

Like I said, Grant probably should have taken the $50M (if in fact that was offered).

Teams with likely more than $20 million in cap space:

Houston (where Grant was born)
San Antonio
Utah (Ainge drafted Grant)
Orlando
Charlotte (Grant went to high school in Charlotte)
OKC
Detroit
Indiana

Some of the above have over $40 million in cap space.  None of the big name free agents (Kyrie, Harden, Middleton) are likely to end up on any of those teams.  Will Grant get his $20 million?  Probably not.  Will Grant get more than the full MLE?  Certainly yes.  Are there non-contenders that Grant might have interest in for personal reasons?  Yeah, definitely.

[Vermont Green]

Teams with likely more than $20 million in cap space:

Houston (where Grant was born)
San Antonio
Utah (Ainge drafted Grant)
Orlando
Charlotte (Grant went to high school in Charlotte)
OKC
Detroit
Indiana

Some of the above have over $40 million in cap space.  None of the big name free agents (Kyrie, Harden, Middleton) are likely to end up on any of those teams.  Will Grant get his $20 million?  Probably not.  Will Grant get more than the full MLE?  Certainly yes.  Are there non-contenders that Grant might have interest in for personal reasons?  Yeah, definitely.

I agree, I could see some of those teams offering at least the full MLE, but I am not sure why they would go much higher than that for Grant Williams.  I guess a sign and trade with one of these teams is also a possibility, these teams won't be likely to be getting over the hard cap anyway.

As I said at the start, I understand Grant wanting to test the market.  He likely won't lose any money for doing that (but he could).  Assuming that the Celtics would match up to say 4 years/$50M, I think it is unlikely he gets an offer north of that (but usually players get more than I think they will get).  And in any case, I think the Celtics would try to finagle a sign and trade as an option to matching.  At a minimum, we could end up with a trade exemption and/or maybe a useful veteran player that the team signing Grant has no use for.

[Celtics2021]

Teams with likely more than $20 million in cap space:

Houston (where Grant was born)
San Antonio
Utah (Ainge drafted Grant)
Orlando
Charlotte (Grant went to high school in Charlotte)
OKC
Detroit
Indiana

Some of the above have over $40 million in cap space.  None of the big name free agents (Kyrie, Harden, Middleton) are likely to end up on any of those teams.  Will Grant get his $20 million?  Probably not.  Will Grant get more than the full MLE?  Certainly yes.  Are there non-contenders that Grant might have interest in for personal reasons?  Yeah, definitely.

I agree, I could see some of those teams offering at least the full MLE, but I am not sure why they would go much higher than that for Grant Williams.  I guess a sign and trade with one of these teams is also a possibility, these teams won't be likely to be getting over the hard cap anyway.

As I said at the start, I understand Grant wanting to test the market.  He likely won't lose any money for doing that (but he could).  Assuming that the Celtics would match up to say 4 years/$50M, I think it is unlikely he gets an offer north of that (but usually players get more than I think they will get).  And in any case, I think the Celtics would try to finagle a sign and trade as an option to matching.  At a minimum, we could end up with a trade exemption and/or maybe a useful veteran player that the team signing Grant has no use for.

My real hope is that the Celtics sign Grant to a 5-year deal instead of the four-year extension he was eligible for in the fall.  As far as getting $20 million a year, that is likely a negotiating position to get closer to the $16 million a year I think he’ll end up at.

[Roy H.]

Several teams sniffing around on Grant Williams' situation in Boston

Yet rumbles persist that various teams are monitoring the situation and curious about Williams’ future there. Williams is poised to become a restricted free agent this summer and said to be seeking a contract in the Keldon Johnson-in-San Antonio, $20-million-annually range. – via Marc Stein @ marcstein.substack.com

Yeah, I don't find Stein to be particularly plugged in anymore, but if some team is dumb enough to pay Grant $20 million per season happy trails to him.  We can replace most of his production easily enough, particularly with Muscula and Gallo.

Teams can't survive paying $20 million per season to guys who put up 8 points and 5 rebounds while playing good but not great defense.  He's been shooting below 40% from 3PT for about the last two months, as well, including 35.1% 3PT% since January 1.

Not sure if this is actual inside information or just conjecture by Stein but in any case, it sounds like it is probably accurate.  Grant Williams may well have asked for $20M thinking he was comparable to Keldon Johnson (which was probably an over pay in its own right).  Weren't the reports that the Celtics offered 4@$12.5M (about $50M total)?  Grant probably figures he can get at least that as a RFA and he probably will.  So why not test the market?

But I agree, if someone offers him much more than that, the smart move for the Celtics is to let him go, no matter what their overall  budget may or may not be.

On the other hand, Grant is a more important player than his box score reflects.  He is versatile, reliable, and durable.  A great combination for a bench player.  But he is also undersized for his position, and pretty one-dimensional on offense.  He probably should have taken the $50M.  There is a chance that he is not even offered that.  He might not see anything better than a tax payer MLE.

He’s delusional if he believes that. Johnson is a much better player. Grants been worse than he was last year, overall. Decent role player, but I don’t think he’s worth more than $10m annually.

Grant is playing decent minutes and no matter where he goes he will not be a top 2 option.  You could expect with more shots he can put up 13 and 6 with good D.  That is not a 20m type player.  At 20m you need to affect the game more then he does.  Look at Smart.  Is Grant as or more valuable then Smart?  Not even close.  With the way he's playing some idiot team may pay him 15m per year but I think he ends up at 10-12.  He's a good role player and nothing more.

Unfortunately for Grant, he is kind of stuck in never-never land.  He doesn't have enough upside for a bad team (who likely would have cap space) to spend money on but he is a good target for a contending team looking for some depth.  The problem is that the contending teams aren't going to have the cap space to offer to Grant.

The taxpayer MLE next season is only $7M.  Non-taxpayer MLE is $11M but if a team uses that, they essentially end up hard capped.  A contending team is not going to hard cap themselves for Grant Williams, I don't expect.  Teams with cap space can make offers to Grant but only after they renounce all of their own FAs who may have cap holds.  That ends up being a hard cap in essence also.

Like I said, Grant probably should have taken the $50M (if in fact that was offered).

Teams with likely more than $20 million in cap space:

Houston (where Grant was born)
San Antonio
Utah (Ainge drafted Grant)
Orlando
Charlotte (Grant went to high school in Charlotte)
OKC
Detroit
Indiana

Some of the above have over $40 million in cap space.  None of the big name free agents (Kyrie, Harden, Middleton) are likely to end up on any of those teams.  Will Grant get his $20 million?  Probably not.  Will Grant get more than the full MLE?  Certainly yes.  Are there non-contenders that Grant might have interest in for personal reasons?  Yeah, definitely.

I don't understand why a rebuilding / lower rung team would want to give a big chunk of its flexibility for a 7th or 8th man.  It doesn't mean it won't happen, but it would be a poor decision.  They're better off renting their cap space or saving it to re-sign their own players, rather than give up 10% - 15% of their cap to an undersized backup PF.

I mean, Grant ranks 164th in scoring out of 255 qualifying players.  He's 91st in rebounding.  He's 92nd in 3PTM.  And yet, he wants to be paid like a third starter.