Is Smart our 5th best defender?

[colincb]

Smart’s not 5th on the team as far as advanced defensive +/- stats:

RAPTOR has Smart as our 4th best defender after AH, DW and TL.
REAL +/- has Smart as our 4th best defender after AH, TL, and JT.
EPM had has Smart as our 2nd best defender after DW.

Smart’s within hailing distance of the others (and GW is not)

1. I think you’d have to throw White out of these stats because his stats are for SAS and BOS. He’s a very good defender though from what I’ve seen of him and his advanced stats on D are consistently good.
2. Smart often draws the toughest assignment.
3. Smart is the most versatile defender.
4. My understanding is that he is the loudest voice when the Cs are on D.

Overall, he’s the defensive leader on the best defensive team in the NBA, so I don’t have a big problem with the DPOY nod. regardless of the advanced stats.

[Vermont Green]

We shut down Durant not because of Tatum alone but because we doubled him on almost every possession.  Kind of like when an NFL team doubles the best receiver or the best pass rusher.  Meanwhile, Smart took care of Kyrie more or less on his own.   I see Tatum as a top defender in the league, absolutely, but he did not stop Durant on his own.

I see Smart as the best defender on a team of good defenders.  I don't base this on a bunch of advanced stats (although I would be interested in what those stats reflect) but I see Tatum as a better defender than Brown by a bit and I actually don't consider either Horford or RWilliams as great defenders; really good, but not in the Smart or even the Tatum league.

I know that RWilliams is being viewed as a DPOY level defender but kind of like his offense, I see his defense as one dimensional.  He can block shots at the bucket with the best of them and that is valuable.  But I don't see his one on one defense or his switching defense as all that exceptional.  On this team, where the other 4 players are all good defenders, he can sit back and block shots and have a big impact.  But when I think of Kevin Garnett or even Kevin McHale, I see much better all around defenders.

[Goldstar88]

IMO, he’s the Third best defender, maybe tied with Horford. It’s close. I put Timelord and Tatum ahead of Smart due to their height, length and athleticism. Saying Grant is better than Smart is blasphemous.

[Vermont Green]

Smart’s not 5th on the team as far as advanced defensive +/- stats:

RAPTOR has Smart as our 4th best defender after AH, DW and TL.
REAL +/- has Smart as our 4th best defender after AH, TL, and JT.
EPM had has Smart as our 2nd best defender after DW.

Smart’s within hailing distance of the others (and GW is not)

1. I think you’d have to throw White out of these stats because his stats are for SAS and BOS. He’s a very good defender though from what I’ve seen of him and his advanced stats on D are consistently good.
2. Smart often draws the toughest assignment.
3. Smart is the most versatile defender.
4. My understanding is that he is the loudest voice when the Cs are on D.

Overall, he’s the defensive leader on the best defensive team in the NBA, so I don’t have a big problem with the DPOY nod. regardless of the advanced stats.

I admit that I am not an expert on how these advanced stats are compiled but if you are looking at an on/off type of stat, wouldn't the performance of the replacement have a much to do with the stat as the performance of the principle?  For example, if Al Horford is replaced by Enes Freedom, that will improve Horford's stat, correct?

Anyway, in this case, the advanced stats provide some good information but I think you really have to watch the games to make any final conclusion on who is a better defender.  And it is always hard to compare a guard to a big so this is always going to be subjective.

[liam]

Smart’s not 5th on the team as far as advanced defensive +/- stats:

RAPTOR has Smart as our 4th best defender after AH, DW and TL.
REAL +/- has Smart as our 4th best defender after AH, TL, and JT.
EPM had has Smart as our 2nd best defender after DW.

Smart’s within hailing distance of the others (and GW is not)

1. I think you’d have to throw White out of these stats because his stats are for SAS and BOS. He’s a very good defender though from what I’ve seen of him and his advanced stats on D are consistently good.
2. Smart often draws the toughest assignment.
3. Smart is the most versatile defender.
4. My understanding is that he is the loudest voice when the Cs are on D.

Overall, he’s the defensive leader on the best defensive team in the NBA, so I don’t have a big problem with the DPOY nod. regardless of the advanced stats.

I admit that I am not an expert on how these advanced stats are compiled but if you are looking at an on/off type of stat, wouldn't the performance of the replacement have a much to do with the stat as the performance of the principle?  For example, if Al Horford is replaced by Enes Freedom, that will improve Horford's stat, correct?

Anyway, in this case, the advanced stats provide some good information but I think you really have to watch the games to make any final conclusion on who is a better defender.  And it is always hard to compare a guard to a big so this is always going to be subjective.

It's good that there are so many excellent defenders on the team that you even make it a conversation.  This is a team full of rabid defenders.

[jambr380]

Should change the title to: The Team defense is GREAT!!!

Yes, for sure. I didn’t mean to be rude, but the answer to the original thread title is a definite no. In no way is there even an argument that Smart is the 5th best defender on the team. Your conversation throughout the thread shows a much better understanding of our team defense as a whole.

[ETNCeltics]

Smart did a great job keeping Kyrie under wraps. But one thing even many Celtic fans underrate is that in all our switching, Tatum or Brown are rarely at a disadvantage. They're tall enough and big enough that only the biggest players are a real mismatch for them, and athletic enough that only the quickest guards are a mismatch.

But Smart is a PG, only  6-3 and the Celtics have no fear of having him guard Lebron or Kawhi or even Kevin Durant. His versatility and toughness as a defensive guard is what really separates him from most other guards.

[Neurotic Guy]

So how about some analysis on what these 5 defenders will do v. Milwaukee and also the Heat - should the Cs get to the ECF.  I’m more concerned about the Heat than Philly and I’d like to know how folks think they’ll defend this deep team of shooters and scorers. How would you scheme if you were Ime?

[liam]

So how about some analysis on what these 5 defenders will do v. Milwaukee and also the Heat - should the Cs get to the ECF.  I’m more concerned about the Heat than Philly and I’d like to know how folks think they’ll defend this deep team of shooters and scorers. How would you scheme if you were Ime?

I don't think the Heat have anyone we need to double team and we can switch everything and play man to man. It will be different than the Nets where we left non-shooters open.

[celticsclay]

So how about some analysis on what these 5 defenders will do v. Milwaukee and also the Heat - should the Cs get to the ECF.  I’m more concerned about the Heat than Philly and I’d like to know how folks think they’ll defend this deep team of shooters and scorers. How would you scheme if you were Ime?

I don't think the Heat have anyone we need to double team and we can switch everything and play man to man. It will be different than the Nets where we left non-shooters open.

I think bam may be the biggest one on one cover challenge. He is miles faster than Horford or theis. Timelord can guard him though. I also trust our scheme to shut him down. This seems like really getting ahead of ourselves

[gouki88]

No, the Defensive Player of the Year is not the 5th best defender on his team

[liam]

So how about some analysis on what these 5 defenders will do v. Milwaukee and also the Heat - should the Cs get to the ECF.  I’m more concerned about the Heat than Philly and I’d like to know how folks think they’ll defend this deep team of shooters and scorers. How would you scheme if you were Ime?

I don't think the Heat have anyone we need to double team and we can switch everything and play man to man. It will be different than the Nets where we left non-shooters open.

I think bam may be the biggest one on one cover challenge. He is miles faster than Horford or theis. Timelord can guard him though. I also trust our scheme to shut him down. This seems like really getting ahead of ourselves

Grant Williams is a good match-up on Bam. He's been playing against him for a long time. I thought in the lock down season that Brad should've played Grant more in that Heat series.

[The Oracle]

So much of what Smart does just doesn't show up in a standard box score.  People shouldn't give much credence to a bunch of faulty defensive metrics that cant remotely begin to capture his or anyone else's true impact.

Smart drew 46 offensive fouls nobody else on the team had more than Grant's 22, Tatum and Brown combined for 24.

Smart had 206 deflections, the next best was Brown and Tatum tied with 117 each.

Smart finished tied for 4th in the league in loose balls recovered with 75.  This on a team that outside of him didn't create a ton of loose balls.

On top of things like the above Smart orchestrates the best defense in the league.  Without him this defense doesn't exist, everyone else is infinitely more replaceable defensively.

[Kiorrik]

My 2 cents

I feel our defensive efforts are bigger than the sum of its parts.

This means a couple of things;
 - We have some defenders that look HEAPS better than they are
 - Some people's work goes underrepresented

Example; JT's defense on KD wasn't just HIS defense. Even when it was just 1on1, JT knew he had people waiting to collapse behind him ... and KD knew that too! This means KD has several options taken away from him, not because JT is there, but because JT is there *and there's 2 guys on each side of JT that can and will collapse at a moments notice*.

This is partly because Rob/Grant all our guys have tools to offer on help defense. Smart up top by reaching in and stealing a ball. Rob down low with potential blocks.

It also allows JT to gamble for a steal a bit more often; as there's always 2 guys waiting to collapse and cover for him.

I think Marcus Smart is the best individual defender at his position, in the league. He's got the tools and skills to keep up with the fastest guards in the league. This is a big deal with how fast/deadly guards are these days, and how refs favour them.

On top of that, in a switch, his speed and athleticism allow him to ball deny anyone who's bigger than him. This works a bit like the steals - it is possible because there's going to be help in defending if the pass still makes it to the person he's defending.



TLDR: imo our defensive schemes make insanely good use of our individual skills, as our team covers eachothers weaknesses, making us all look like defensive masterminds.

[GreenlyGreeny]

Umm…Marcus Smart just won NBA Defensive Player of the Year, so asking whether Smart is our 5th best defender probably makes about as much sense as asking whether Tatum is our third best offensive player?

Timelord may one day be better than Marcus. Could we be so lucky? But he is not yet there.