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Author Topic: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Horford....  (Read 9340 times)

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Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Horford....
« on: April 26, 2022, 02:29:03 PM »

Offline otherdave

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Mr Grant Williams at the four - he defends, hits the three, blocks shots, takes the charge.  Ime played him 30 minutes a game in the Brooklyn series. Do I wish Grant was two or three inches taller?  I sure do, but you can't have everything. One more year learning from Big Al and Grant should be good to go, and ready for the starting lineup!

But what say all of you?
« Last Edit: April 27, 2022, 09:19:22 AM by otherdave »
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2022, 02:40:59 PM »

Offline Big333223

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I think the way the NBA is going, Grant will be a perfect fit as a PF.

I'm imagining next season, Al is still the starter but their minutes basically flip (Al playing around 20 mpg and Grant playing around 30) and then Grant takes over as the starter.

Last season was tough for Grant because he put on weight to play bigger and it didn't go well. This year he took the weight off to be able to play faster and it worked. Now that we know that that works and he has that mentality, I'm excited to see his growth going forward.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2022, 02:42:01 PM »

Offline colincb

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Al has three inches on Grant, who is 6'6.

Al's a center who can play PF. Grant's a PF who really can't play center.

Al's also a much better player, especially when you look at his advanced stats and his 5-time All Star status.

So no.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2022, 02:50:01 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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Horford was an all-star caliber player.

G-Will is a role player. He isn't tall/long/explosive enough to beat his opponents 1-on-1, hence he cannot consistently create his own shot. He relies on his teammates to create shots for him. With all due respect to G-Will, there is no comparison between him and Horford.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2022, 02:53:10 PM »

Online Goldstar88

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I really don’t like Grant as a starter. He’s a nice role player; but he’s too small and not athletic enough to be a starting caliber PF.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2022, 02:54:23 PM »

Online Roy H.

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I hope not.  GW is good as a backup, but I don't want him as a full-time starter.  I'd rather have Tatum slide over if we can't find an adequate Al replacement (whenever he's ready to move on).
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2022, 02:56:04 PM »

Offline ETNCeltics

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Quote from: colincb on April 26, 2022, 02:42:01 PM
Al has three inches on Grant, who is 6'6.

Al's a center who can play PF. Grant's a PF who really can't play center.

Al's also a much better player, especially when you look at his advanced stats and his 5-time All Star status.

So no.

Al isn't an all-star any longer, he's a role player. At this point, Horford is a marginally better player than Williams. Better in some aspects of the game, not as good in others.

Defensively, we would lose a little with Al gone, but GW is no slouch. His #s while guarding Kevin Durant were very good.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2022, 03:02:28 PM »

Offline perks-a-beast

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Quote from: ETNCeltics on April 26, 2022, 02:56:04 PM
Quote from: colincb on April 26, 2022, 02:42:01 PM
Al has three inches on Grant, who is 6'6.

Al's a center who can play PF. Grant's a PF who really can't play center.

Al's also a much better player, especially when you look at his advanced stats and his 5-time All Star status.

So no.

Al isn't an all-star any longer, he's a role player. At this point, Horford is a marginally better player than Williams. Better in some aspects of the game, not as good in others.

Defensively, we would lose a little with Al gone, but GW is no slouch. His #s while guarding Kevin Durant were very good.

Al is arguably our 2nd most important player right now. I wouldn’t call that a role player.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2022, 03:05:49 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Not sure he's Al's replacement but Batman is just 23 and he's improved significantly in his time here.  If he hasn't peaked (which I doubt he has) I think he's a starter or 25-30 mpg guy down the road.  His height may be an issue but he's developing an interesting offensive game - good 3-pt shooter and he has some intriguing moves to the hoop and inside strength and finishing skill.  Defensively I'll leave it to more knowledgeable than me -- he sure seems to move very well for his size and is strong and smart. How much he'll be exposed by bigger 4's IDK.   Not sure why he can't be a better rebounder and better passer a la Draymond Green. 
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2022, 03:06:23 PM »

Offline tonydelk

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Definitely not a substitute.  Al, is a unicorn.  Not many bigs in the league that can do what he can do.  It's why he's ben a max player and All-star.  Grant will never be an allstar. 
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2022, 03:13:43 PM »

Offline colincb

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Quote from: ETNCeltics on April 26, 2022, 02:56:04 PM
Quote from: colincb on April 26, 2022, 02:42:01 PM
Al has three inches on Grant, who is 6'6.

Al's a center who can play PF. Grant's a PF who really can't play center.

Al's also a much better player, especially when you look at his advanced stats and his 5-time All Star status.

So no.

Al isn't an all-star any longer, he's a role player. At this point, Horford is a marginally better player than Williams. Better in some aspects of the game, not as good in others.

Defensively, we would lose a little with Al gone, but GW is no slouch. His #s while guarding Kevin Durant were very good.

Here are the three main advanced +/- stats for the 2021-22 season

AH   Rating    NBA Rank
RAPTOR    3.70    25
REAL +/-    5.94    14
EPM            3.00    42   
      
GW   Rating    NBA Rank
RAPTOR    (0.90)   162
REAL +/-    (3.54)   353
EPM           (1.30)   253
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2022, 03:23:20 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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Quote from: Neurotic Guy on April 26, 2022, 03:05:49 PM
Not sure he's Al's replacement but Batman is just 23 and he's improved significantly in his time here.  If he hasn't peaked (which I doubt he has) I think he's a starter or 25-30 mpg guy down the road.  His height may be an issue but he's developing an interesting offensive game - good 3-pt shooter and he has some intriguing moves to the hoop and inside strength and finishing skill.  Defensively I'll leave it to more knowledgeable than me -- he sure seems to move very well for his size and is strong and smart. How much he'll be exposed by bigger 4's IDK.   Not sure why he can't be a better rebounder and better passer a la Draymond Green.

It is true that both DGreen and GWill are 6'-6" but Green seems more athletic and with longer arms than GWill.  Green is a career 7 reb guy (GWill 3 reb) and 5.4 assists (GWill 1.0 assists).  So in theory, I guess but I don't think GWill has the same skill and athleticism that Green has.

I like GWill as a back up PF.  He has thrived in that role.  It looks like we are going to be able to get another year out of Al so this discussion can be tabled for a year.  In the meantime, I am sure that the team will be on the look out for a decent young PF who has more starting potential than Grant Williams.
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2022, 04:00:23 PM »

Offline ConnerHenry

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Grant's contract negotiations are going to be interesting for sure
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Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2022, 05:24:25 PM »

Online Goldstar88

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Quote from: colincb on April 26, 2022, 03:13:43 PM
Quote from: ETNCeltics on April 26, 2022, 02:56:04 PM
Quote from: colincb on April 26, 2022, 02:42:01 PM
Al has three inches on Grant, who is 6'6.

Al's a center who can play PF. Grant's a PF who really can't play center.

Al's also a much better player, especially when you look at his advanced stats and his 5-time All Star status.

So no.

Al isn't an all-star any longer, he's a role player. At this point, Horford is a marginally better player than Williams. Better in some aspects of the game, not as good in others.

Defensively, we would lose a little with Al gone, but GW is no slouch. His #s while guarding Kevin Durant were very good.

Here are the three main advanced +/- stats for the 2021-22 season

AH   Rating    NBA Rank
RAPTOR    3.70    25
REAL +/-    5.94    14
EPM            3.00    42   
      
GW   Rating    NBA Rank
RAPTOR    (0.90)   162
REAL +/-    (3.54)   353
EPM           (1.30)   253

Thank you for posting that. TP.  Not comparable.
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Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
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At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.
Re: Maybe the C's already have their long term replacement for Al Hortford....
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2022, 05:41:04 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Quote from: Vermont Green on April 26, 2022, 03:23:20 PM
Quote from: Neurotic Guy on April 26, 2022, 03:05:49 PM
Not sure he's Al's replacement but Batman is just 23 and he's improved significantly in his time here.  If he hasn't peaked (which I doubt he has) I think he's a starter or 25-30 mpg guy down the road.  His height may be an issue but he's developing an interesting offensive game - good 3-pt shooter and he has some intriguing moves to the hoop and inside strength and finishing skill.  Defensively I'll leave it to more knowledgeable than me -- he sure seems to move very well for his size and is strong and smart. How much he'll be exposed by bigger 4's IDK.   Not sure why he can't be a better rebounder and better passer a la Draymond Green.

It is true that both DGreen and GWill are 6'-6" but Green seems more athletic and with longer arms than GWill.  Green is a career 7 reb guy (GWill 3 reb) and 5.4 assists (GWill 1.0 assists).  So in theory, I guess but I don't think GWill has the same skill and athleticism that Green has.

I like GWill as a back up PF.  He has thrived in that role.  It looks like we are going to be able to get another year out of Al so this discussion can be tabled for a year.  In the meantime, I am sure that the team will be on the look out for a decent young PF who has more starting potential than Grant Williams.

I don’t want to overdo the comparison as Green is unique. Depending on where you look, Green has a couple inches in wingspan and Grant an inch in height.  Also assists go up when you pass to Curry, Thompson and others.
My point would have been better to just suggest Grant will improve his  stats as a rebounder and passer.  He also is improved as an inside scorer. Strong, smart, hard worker - I think he will continue to improve.
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