C’s Trade Deadline Move(s)

[Atzar]

i am not sure lillard is all that good a fit with the celtics. lillard is 31 years old, a weak defender, and needs the ball to be in his hands since his overwhelming value is scoring a lot.

is having a 24 pga scorer with poor defense that helpful? is he even as good as kyrie?

i would prefer a player who can set up others for scoring, play decent defense, and still score credibly.

I'm in this camp too.

Kyrie was a score-first point guard who only defended when he wanted to.  Didn't really work out here.  Kemba was a score-first point guard who struggled to defend.  Didn't really work out here.  Do we really want to do this a third time with Lillard?  I don't disagree with the idea that we need an upgrade at starting point guard, but maybe playing the same movie three times expecting a different ending isn't the best decision.  Maybe it's time to look for a guard with a different skillset.

[keevsnick]

Modest Deadline Goals:

1) Trade Schroder for a small asset, a good 2nd round pick. CLE has HOU's 2nd round pick which will likely be like 31-35.

2) Find a rotation shooter. Somebody who shoots above average form 3 on volume. Don't know who this is, but it should be achievable.

Maybe you can eve do those two things in the same deal.

[Moranis]

Just for fun, let's revamp the entire roster (I believe all trades are reasonable value though all would be unlikely to happen alone, let alone all of them)

Richardson, Hernangomez, Nesmith, Langford, 22 1st, 24 1st (top 4) for McCollum, Snell

Brown, Smart for Simmons, Curry, Maxey

Horford, G. Williams for Love, Sexton, Windler

New Roster

PG - Schroder, Maxey, Pritchard (Sexton replaces Schroder long term)
SG - McCollum, Curry
SF - Tatum, Snell, Windler
PF - Simmons, Love
C - R. Williams, Freedom, Fernando

1 open spot for buy out market

[slamtheking]

i am not sure lillard is all that good a fit with the celtics. lillard is 31 years old, a weak defender, and needs the ball to be in his hands since his overwhelming value is scoring a lot.

is having a 24 pga scorer with poor defense that helpful? is he even as good as kyrie?

i would prefer a player who can set up others for scoring, play decent defense, and still score credibly.

I'm in this camp too.

Kyrie was a score-first point guard who only defended when he wanted to.  Didn't really work out here.  Kemba was a score-first point guard who struggled to defend.  Didn't really work out here.  Do we really want to do this a third time with Lillard?  I don't disagree with the idea that we need an upgrade at starting point guard, but maybe playing the same movie three times expecting a different ending isn't the best decision.  Maybe it's time to look for a guard with a different skillset.

for me, the bigger issue with Lillard is the cost of the next contract he's expecting.  it's so far past ridiculous it'd cripple whatever franchise he's playing for.  the fact he's on the wrong side of 30, a shoot-first PG and lazy if not bad defender are all reasons to say no thanks.

[Celtic]

i am not sure lillard is all that good a fit with the celtics. lillard is 31 years old, a weak defender, and needs the ball to be in his hands since his overwhelming value is scoring a lot.

is having a 24 pga scorer with poor defense that helpful? is he even as good as kyrie?

i would prefer a player who can set up others for scoring, play decent defense, and still score credibly.

I'm in this camp too.

Kyrie was a score-first point guard who only defended when he wanted to.  Didn't really work out here.  Kemba was a score-first point guard who struggled to defend.  Didn't really work out here.  Do we really want to do this a third time with Lillard?  I don't disagree with the idea that we need an upgrade at starting point guard, but maybe playing the same movie three times expecting a different ending isn't the best decision.  Maybe it's time to look for a guard with a different skillset.

Lillard is a leader though, something this team desperately needs and Kyrie never was. I also believe Dame will create shots for the J's. He's mature and has never had wing talent like them with him.

[Who]

Why I like Lillard

The Celtics have limited trade assets outside of Jaylen and Tatum to add a 3rd star. It is precisely because Lillard is over 30, a score-first PG and on a massive contract that Boston is able to get him. If he was under 30 and on a lower deal, it would cost Tatum to get him.

These are the guys you get with limited trade assets -- guys with flaws.

I like Lillard because he is a ball-handler and that is something Boston desperately need. He is a shot-creator, an efficient scorer and a highly productive scorer to give Boston 3 high quality scorers. Boston needs those skills. They need his maturity and leadership. They need his never-give-up attitude.

He is not a nutcase like Kyrie who is difficult to play with / coach. He is not a broken down injured mirage of his past self like Kemba. He is not a plus defender but he is fine. He is not a liability to the extent that IT or Kemba were.

This is a guy who has a lot to offer and has a chance to actually be available for the mediocre trade package Boston has to offer outside the Jays. Not many other stars are going to be available for such a ho-hum trade offer.

[Wretch]

i am not sure lillard is all that good a fit with the celtics. lillard is 31 years old, a weak defender, and needs the ball to be in his hands since his overwhelming value is scoring a lot.

is having a 24 pga scorer with poor defense that helpful? is he even as good as kyrie?

i would prefer a player who can set up others for scoring, play decent defense, and still score credibly.

I'm in this camp too.

Kyrie was a score-first point guard who only defended when he wanted to.  Didn't really work out here.  Kemba was a score-first point guard who struggled to defend.  Didn't really work out here.  Do we really want to do this a third time with Lillard?  I don't disagree with the idea that we need an upgrade at starting point guard, but maybe playing the same movie three times expecting a different ending isn't the best decision.  Maybe it's time to look for a guard with a different skillset.

Lillard is a leader though, something this team desperately needs and Kyrie never was. I also believe Dame will create shots for the J's. He's mature and has never had wing talent like them with him.

Lillard is an Alpha scorer not a leader, a leader would try to play better defense. Obviously he's limited defensively due to his size but the Blazers teams have been ambivalent, at best, towards defense for a while.

[Atzar]

i am not sure lillard is all that good a fit with the celtics. lillard is 31 years old, a weak defender, and needs the ball to be in his hands since his overwhelming value is scoring a lot.

is having a 24 pga scorer with poor defense that helpful? is he even as good as kyrie?

i would prefer a player who can set up others for scoring, play decent defense, and still score credibly.

I'm in this camp too.

Kyrie was a score-first point guard who only defended when he wanted to.  Didn't really work out here.  Kemba was a score-first point guard who struggled to defend.  Didn't really work out here.  Do we really want to do this a third time with Lillard?  I don't disagree with the idea that we need an upgrade at starting point guard, but maybe playing the same movie three times expecting a different ending isn't the best decision.  Maybe it's time to look for a guard with a different skillset.

Lillard is a leader though, something this team desperately needs and Kyrie never was. I also believe Dame will create shots for the J's. He's mature and has never had wing talent like them with him.

Here's the thing though:  Kemba never had wing talent like this either, but playing with better players didn't suddenly turn him into a distributor he was not in Charlotte.  He was still Kemba.  Maturity was never a concern for him, but his game was still his game.  I'd rather not trade for Lillard on the assumption that he'll start doing something he has never done.  Again; we've seen that movie already.

Maybe I'm selling him short.  Maybe he can get the most out of talented teammates in a way that Kyrie couldn't.  Maybe he can co-exist next to other guys who need the ball in a way that Kemba couldn't (and in fairness, his catch-and-shoot numbers have historically been very good... so there is cause for some optimism there).  I just think he's not the type of guard we should ideally be looking for.  Throw in the assets it would cost us to acquire him and the contract concerns that slamtheking mentioned, and he's not a guy I'd be targeting. 

[Vermont Green]

Lillard would make us better instantly but how do we get him?  Trade Horford and Schroeder?  Throw in picks or stashes?

[Who]

Lillard would make us better instantly but how do we get him?  Trade Horford and Schroeder?  Throw in picks or stashes?

Yeah, Horford for matching salaries and loads of picks. 3 first rounders, possibly an additional two swaps on two first rounders. Probably another rotation player (Timelord? Smart? Is Josh Richardson enough?). Maybe a prospect or two (Pritchard is from the area, maybe Nesmith or Romeo as well).

Basically everything we can throw against the Kitchen wall outside of Jaylen and Tatum.

[Atzar]

Lillard would make us better instantly but how do we get him?  Trade Horford and Schroeder?  Throw in picks or stashes?

Yeah, Horford for matching salaries and loads of picks. 3 first rounders, possibly an additional two swaps on two first rounders. Probably another rotation player (Timelord? Smart? Is Josh Richardson enough?). Maybe a prospect or two (Pritchard is from the area, maybe Nesmith or Romeo as well).

Basically everything we can throw against the Kitchen wall outside of Jaylen and Tatum.

If I were really set on acquiring Lillard, then I'd try like hell to sell them on the idea of putting Smart's defense next to McCollum.  I think Rob Williams would fit tremendously well with Lillard at both ends of the court and I'd want to keep him out of the deal, if possible. 

Portland might not accept that though.  Getting value requires value, after all.  And Smart's new contract is, in my opinion, a hell of a weight around his neck where trade value is concerned.

EDIT:  And if they're trading Lillard, they probably aren't trying to build around McCollum anyway.  He's probably next (or first) out the door.  So there's that, too.

[Who]

Trade Schroder, otherwise do nothing.

Yeah, that's my thinking too.  The 'Schroder rental' is proving to have value in itself, for example, he's starting tonight since Smart has a bruise and PP is not back yet.  The only other alternative to Schroder at PG would be Romeo (yikes).  So I've reached the conclusion that C's won't even make a small trade.

I would like them to move Juancho and Fernando (along with a 2nd or two) to see if there are pieces that either fit better or may have more worth in the future. 



Honestly, outside of Tatum, Brown, Rob and Smart; I would be fine with any move that fits better with that group.   (like to keep Grant and Prichard) 


Smart and Rob can be part of a bigger move that brings back a better player that fits better.

I am ready to move on from Smart. We need shooters.

I am not sure how capable we are of fielding both Smart & a non-shooter in Rob Williams together in the same lineup without impairing the offense / spacing.

[hwangjini_1]

after reading the posts above concerning ingles i had to check and yes, sure enough he is still 34 years old, just as he was at the start of the season.

he has had about 4 nice-to-good years in his career (none of which saw him average 13 ppg or 6 apg), and this year is not one of them. i dont think he pushes the celtics over the top this year. and i am even surer he wont push the celtics over the top next year when he is 35.

i hope PBS does better than this.

[#1P4P]

With Jalen Brunson becoming an UFA this season, he’s going to be looking for a multi year offer, lead PG duties, and starting role. Dallas won’t promise him the primary ball handler role nor starting PG position.

This kid has won 2 NCAA titles, was still drafted in the 2nd round, and is still coming off the bench despite playing well; he must have a boulder-sized chip on his shoulder.

Brunson is 25, can direct an offense, protects the ball, gets into the paint with ease, great shooter inside the arch, and can play well on/off ball. He’s a lefty giving off serious Mike Conley vibes.

I don’t know much about his defense, but if it checks out, Brad should gauge interest and offer him what he wants. Dallas might prefer to keep him until the off-season, but they will trade him if the offer’s right.

I like this idea.  I'm not sure why Dallas doesn't want to hand him the keys, considering who they have on their roster.  Obviously, elite shooting would look great next to Doncic, but Brunson is a player.

I was under the impression that Dallas loves Brunson and that he was close to untouchable in the past during trade talks. They overpaid Tim Hardaway Jr last summer. I expect them to do the same with Brunson. Pay whatever they need to in order to keep him.

Brunson giving strong competition to (the underperforming) Porzingis as Dallas 2nd best player. On a Mavs team with very little talent outside of Doncic, I can't imagine Dallas letting Brunson walk this summer or trading him now without getting a king's ransom in return.

I reckon they'd need an All-Star talent coming back in order to move Brunson.

I think Brunson is the Mavs second best player because you never know what you'll get with Porzingas.  But Brunson is always in and out of the starting lineup so I'm not sure if Dallas likes him as much as we do.

Luka is an elite playmaker and they've preferred to start him at the 1, Porzingis at the 4, a Center, and 2 wings, while Brunson is the 6th man. Even though Brunson understand that Luka is special, he's not going to continue to stunt his growth as a NBA PG to appease Dallas.

The Mavs are probably preparing a solid offer for him and are letting him know that he's in their future plans, but he's an Unrestricted FA, free to sign with another team. Touch base through his agent and if he's open to it, inform the Mavericks to facilitate a deal before the trade deadline or during the offseason.

The only trade target I value higher than Brunson is VanVleet, but is he available and what is the asking price? I think VanVleet or Brunson will address the biggest weaknesses of the team and move us in the right direction.

[RodyTur10]

Why I like Lillard

The Celtics have limited trade assets outside of Jaylen and Tatum to add a 3rd star. It is precisely because Lillard is over 30, a score-first PG and on a massive contract that Boston is able to get him. If he was under 30 and on a lower deal, it would cost Tatum to get him.

These are the guys you get with limited trade assets -- guys with flaws.

I like Lillard because he is a ball-handler and that is something Boston desperately need. He is a shot-creator, an efficient scorer and a highly productive scorer to give Boston 3 high quality scorers. Boston needs those skills. They need his maturity and leadership. They need his never-give-up attitude.

He is not a nutcase like Kyrie who is difficult to play with / coach. He is not a broken down injured mirage of his past self like Kemba. He is not a plus defender but he is fine. He is not a liability to the extent that IT or Kemba were.

This is a guy who has a lot to offer and has a chance to actually be available for the mediocre trade package Boston has to offer outside the Jays. Not many other stars are going to be available for such a ho-hum trade offer.

You're absolutely right. The Celtics need to be looking at a "buy-low"-player with All Star impact. Those are not easy to find. Moreover the skillset that we demand is a superb ball handler with reliable 3-point-range. Now the pond is really getting small.

So Lillard could be a real target for us. But to be honest, VanVleet is so underrated. If they'd cost the same I might prefer VanVleet considering age, contract and defense.