Bucks have figured out the Heat. Celtics weren't able to. Who to blame?

[Moranis]

The Bucks have the best player in the world.  That solves a lot of problems.

Debateable

I still think Luka is better

But wouldnt you say

Brown + Tatum = Giannis impact?

Doesn't work that way.  That last 5 to 10% just matters so much more.  Sometimes adding up an 80 and a 75 just isn't the same as having 1 guy that is a 95.  That 95 is just so much more valuable.  However, even if it did Middleton and Holiday aren't much different than Brown as a player anyway.

[colincb]

MIL got better and changed their offense. MIA got worse. Check out Zack Lowe's (ESPN insider) story for a good analysis:

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/31516350/how-giannis-antetokounmpo-milwaukee-bucks-feasting-miami-heat-comes-next

Also, according to defensive REAL +/- two of the Bucks starters are top 10 at their positions, two more are top 20, and the worst starter is rated 27th at his position. Each rated position includes between 86-116 players. Defensive Raptor has five of nine Bucks rated above +1, three between +1 and -1, and only Forbes as an obvious defensive liability at -3.6.

[RodyTur10]

The Bucks have the best player in the world.  That solves a lot of problems.

Debateable

I still think Luka is better

But wouldnt you say

Brown + Tatum = Giannis impact?

Doesn't work that way.  That last 5 to 10% just matters so much more.  Sometimes adding up an 80 and a 75 just isn't the same as having 1 guy that is a 95.  That 95 is just so much more valuable.  However, even if it did Middleton and Holiday aren't much different than Brown as a player anyway.

TP. That's something I agree with. It's why I said that Holiday has been an underrated player for a long time.
He's in the same tier as a couple of other guys who were lucky enough to get an All Star selection. Defense is just underappreciated in general.

[ozgod]

Here's Miami's "Big 5" in their series against the Bucks last year vs this year. Just not shooting as well this year across the board.

Code: [Select]

Vs the Bucks
Player Last Year Last Year
Buckets 15.3 @ .306 19.8 @ .408
Adebayo 14.0 @ .400 15.0 @ .479
Robinson 12.0 @ .400 12.5 @ .469
Dragic 17.0 @ .429 22.8 @ .480
Herro 7.7 @ .280 16.5 @ 458

[gouki88]

Here's Miami's "Big 5" in their series against the Bucks last year vs this year. Just not shooting as well this year across the board.

Code: [Select]

Vs the Bucks
Player Last Year Last Year
Buckets 15.3 @ .306 19.8 @ .408
Adebayo 14.0 @ .400 15.0 @ .479
Robinson 12.0 @ .400 12.5 @ .469
Dragic 17.0 @ .429 22.8 @ .480
Herro 7.7 @ .280 16.5 @ 458

Love that Herro drop off. Can't get over how smug he was and how much the media were salivating over him. Trying to anoint him the next Tatum, smh

[PhoSita]

The Bucks have a monstrous defensive team. They also have multiple scoring weapons coming off the bench.  And a two time MVP.

It's not complicated.

Other than Giannis and now Holiday

Who do the Bucks have as defensive stoppers

Its the system that makes their D solid

Where is Brad system?? Or have the players tuned him out/not paying attention

Holiday
Middleton
Giannis
Tucker
Lopez


Name me five players on the Celtics who come anywhere near that defensive unit.


The Bucks have a roster designed specifically to be incredibly long and versatile defensively. They've got multiple players who have competed for All NBA and DPOY in multiple seasons.


The Celts have ... Marcus Smart?

[gouki88]

The Bucks have a monstrous defensive team. They also have multiple scoring weapons coming off the bench.  And a two time MVP.

It's not complicated.

Other than Giannis and now Holiday

Who do the Bucks have as defensive stoppers

Its the system that makes their D solid

Where is Brad system?? Or have the players tuned him out/not paying attention

Holiday
Middleton
Giannis
Tucker
Lopez


Name me five players on the Celtics who come anywhere near that defensive unit.


The Bucks have a roster designed specifically to be incredibly long and versatile defensively. They've got multiple players who have competed for All NBA and DPOY in multiple seasons.


The Celts have ... Marcus Smart?

Plus Connaughton and DiVincenzo, both plus defenders. Portis is solid defensively too.

The only real weak defender they have who routinely plays is Forbes

[Tr1boy]

The Bucks have a monstrous defensive team. They also have multiple scoring weapons coming off the bench.  And a two time MVP.

It's not complicated.

Other than Giannis and now Holiday

Who do the Bucks have as defensive stoppers

Its the system that makes their D solid

Where is Brad system?? Or have the players tuned him out/not paying attention

Holiday
Middleton
Giannis
Tucker
Lopez


Name me five players on the Celtics who come anywhere near that defensive unit.


The Bucks have a roster designed specifically to be incredibly long and versatile defensively. They've got multiple players who have competed for All NBA and DPOY in multiple seasons.


The Celts have ... Marcus Smart?

You forget Brown, TL and Tatum has size/length?

[gouki88]

The Bucks have a monstrous defensive team. They also have multiple scoring weapons coming off the bench.  And a two time MVP.

It's not complicated.

Other than Giannis and now Holiday

Who do the Bucks have as defensive stoppers

Its the system that makes their D solid

Where is Brad system?? Or have the players tuned him out/not paying attention

Holiday
Middleton
Giannis
Tucker
Lopez


Name me five players on the Celtics who come anywhere near that defensive unit.


The Bucks have a roster designed specifically to be incredibly long and versatile defensively. They've got multiple players who have competed for All NBA and DPOY in multiple seasons.


The Celts have ... Marcus Smart?

You forget Brown, TL and Tatum has size/length?

None of those guys are as long as Giannis or Lopez though. They have good positional length for the most part, but Giannis is freakish and Lopez is genuinely enormous. Middleton and Brown are very similar measurement-wise, and Holiday is a long point guard capable of defending 1-3

[tenn_smoothie]

Ainge is to blame going with the misfits of the 2019 draft killed us and any depth.  The bucks know the value of veteran role players, almost every team not us knows.   Ainge played with some great ones like Jerry Sichting, Scott Wedman and the like.   He also played with the best front court ever and does not value them.  He was a tall guard as was DJ and he does not value them.  Go figure.

Amen

I know all about the game changing, but you would think a GM who played with the greatest frontcourt in history, pounding the Lakers into dust on the boards while shooting 36% for the series in 1984, would have a clue about the advantage of being strong inside. It's like he has something to prove by going in the complete opposite direction and being stubborn about it. All started with the Perk trade in 2011.

[RPGenerate]

It's almost like they have a top 5 player or something...

[gouki88]

It's almost like they have a top 5 player or something...

Perennial MVP candidate, two fringe All-Stars, and a plethora of good role players like Forbes, Lopez, Portis, DiVincenzo and Connaughton.

[LilRip]

It's almost like they have a top 5 player or something...

Sure he only won 2 MVPs and a DPOY but top 5? Idk. The biggest flaw in his game is that he wears the wrong shade of green

[bopna]

Bucks and Nets are going to be the most entertaining series in these playoffs...

Very matched between offense v defense

But the Bucks have very good offense too.

And tbh honest..if we somehow can force our series to last 6 or 7 games against the Nets...then there is no way the Nets are beating Milwaukee.

[Muzzy66]

Not sure if the Bucks "figured them out" so much as the Bucks are just a much superior team.

Honestly have no idea what happened with the Heat last year.  It feels unfair saying that their finals run was a "fluke" but it kinda feels like that's exactly what it was.  They were a good team, they never really looked like a great one.  It kinda seems like they just happened to click and go on a run at the right time, and as a result massively overachieved relatively to both their talent level and their regular season performance. 

What I'm seeing from them this season is pretty much what I expected to see from them in the Playoffs last season. 

I mean lets be honest, there isn't a true superstar on that Miami roster.  Butler and Adebayo are All-Star calibre players but I wouldn't consider either of them a top 20 player.  In fact I'd argue that Tatum and Brown are both better then those guys in terms of sheer talent.  The difference is that Miami has a championship coach and has one of the greatest on-court leaders in the league (in Butler).  They play as a team and they play hard, so they make the absolute most of the talent they have.