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Congress Is Broken
« on: July 30, 2020, 06:23:15 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I know, the thread title isn’t anything profound. It just seems to me the gridlock and refusal to cooperate on the part of Congress is actively hurting the American people.

This particular problem is not a Trump issue. It seems to me that there are going to be for Big missed opportunities during the last four years, we are Trump would have been willing to sign a bill and Congress couldn’t or wouldn’t deliver him one:

1.  DACA
2.  Transportation spending
3.  Prescription drug reform
4.  Police reform
5.  Additional coronavirus stimulus

In each case, one party or the other decided not to compromise for political purposes. Their consideration seemed to be about electoral politics or not giving credit, rather than doing the right thing.

Of course, the blame falls with voters, because they do not hold their own representatives accountable.
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2020, 06:42:01 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Yeah, its the major problem in our government, and its been broken for a while. It began at least back during Obama's term when the strategy of the Republicans became 'lets fully oppose and block every single thing the democrats propose until we can get our own president in there'.

It just got worse since then. Government doesn't work with this mindset. I think whoever gets voted in should have 4 years to enact their agenda, and if people don't like it, we can vote them out and change it. But you have to give them a chance to enact it.

Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2020, 06:51:32 PM »

Offline chicagoceltic

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I know, the thread title isn’t anything profound. It just seems to me the gridlock and refusal to cooperate on the part of Congress is actively hurting the American people.

This particular problem is not a Trump issue. It seems to me that there are going to be for Big missed opportunities during the last four years, we are Trump would have been willing to sign a bill and Congress couldn’t or wouldn’t deliver him one:

1.  DACA
2.  Transportation spending
3.  Prescription drug reform
4.  Police reform
5.  Additional coronavirus stimulus

In each case, one party or the other decided not to compromise for political purposes. Their consideration seemed to be about electoral politics or not giving credit, rather than doing the right thing.

Of course, the blame falls with voters, because they do not hold their own representatives accountable.
I think more often than not it is not "one party or the other" but both parties at the same time. Take the issue with unemployment in the current issue: I hate that the Dems will not work with the Repubs on a short-term, immediate fix for that because they will lose bargaining power but then again I hate the fact that the Repubs in the Senate waited until we were on the cliff before they put forth a plan. Both are wrong...is one "wronger"?
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2020, 06:52:07 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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I know, the thread title isn’t anything profound. It just seems to me the gridlock and refusal to cooperate on the part of Congress is actively hurting the American people.

This particular problem is not a Trump issue. It seems to me that there are going to be for Big missed opportunities during the last four years, we are Trump would have been willing to sign a bill and Congress couldn’t or wouldn’t deliver him one:

1.  DACA
2.  Transportation spending
3.  Prescription drug reform
4.  Police reform
5.  Additional coronavirus stimulus

In each case, one party or the other decided not to compromise for political purposes. Their consideration seemed to be about electoral politics or not giving credit, rather than doing the right thing.

Of course, the blame falls with voters, because they do not hold their own representatives accountable.

It might help if the voters were more fairly represented by the Senate half of congress.
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2020, 07:50:42 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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The biggest issue is that they stack bills. If it was single thing a voter had to vote on they would get more things done. Instead it's a dozen things all in on a single bill so half can't agree on all of the items.


Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2020, 08:38:11 PM »

Offline TheReaLPuba

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Both sides aren't even addressing the real problems.

That's the virus and those mostly affected by the virus.

Had the government addressed the virus it wouldn't have been that big of an issue to cause the fear and shutdown of businesses and schools.

Now that we are at this point we are in we still don't want to fund testing, hospitals, and schools.

It's a huge tragedy that was 100% preventable (as other countries have responded 1000% better).

Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2020, 08:58:04 AM »

Offline GreenShooter

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The Democrats are the ones who've been railroading this administrations since the start (phony Russian dossier and spying on Trump admin. was a start before he even took office).
They are a despicable bunch. They thwart any effort by the other side and then immediately run in front of tv screens to Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again. and moan about their own agendas.
Also, what Obama did at the funeral yesterday was a disgrace.
They are going to own the country to the point where people will lose rights (some subtle, some not so much) and will be their ****es.
I had a lot more to add but gotta run. Should not have even offered up this much.

Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2020, 11:04:49 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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Via Politico:

Quote
OVER THE CLIFF — It happened. The Senate left town knowing that failed negotiations would ensure the expiration of enhanced jobless benefits for millions of Americans laid off and furloughed amid the coronavirus pandemic. Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer met late into the night Thursday with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, hoping to break the impasse. But they got nowhere and emerged with acrimony and finger-pointing.

Per our colleagues at Playbook: “Meadows made an offer to extend enhanced unemployment at $600 per week for four months as a stand-alone bill. This is a new offer from the White House, and further than Republicans have gone thus far. It’s an extension of current law -- something the GOP has railed against. Pelosi and Schumer rejected the offer, and countered with extending enhanced unemployment insurance at the same rate -- $600 per week -- through the first quarter of 2021.”

This is exactly what I am talking about. In this case, we could have maintain the status quo until a new president is elected. Democrats rejected that for whatever reason, and now tens of millions of people will suffer.

This is insane to me. The Democrats won. They got a four month extension of a program that most Republicans are wary of, and they got it in a stand alone Bill. This was total victory. And instead of taking the win, they threw up their middle finger and said screw you to all of the people who were counting on Congress to work this out.
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2020, 11:19:58 AM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Via Politico:

Quote
OVER THE CLIFF — It happened. The Senate left town knowing that failed negotiations would ensure the expiration of enhanced jobless benefits for millions of Americans laid off and furloughed amid the coronavirus pandemic. Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer met late into the night Thursday with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, hoping to break the impasse. But they got nowhere and emerged with acrimony and finger-pointing.

Per our colleagues at Playbook: “Meadows made an offer to extend enhanced unemployment at $600 per week for four months as a stand-alone bill. This is a new offer from the White House, and further than Republicans have gone thus far. It’s an extension of current law -- something the GOP has railed against. Pelosi and Schumer rejected the offer, and countered with extending enhanced unemployment insurance at the same rate -- $600 per week -- through the first quarter of 2021.”

This is exactly what I am talking about. In this case, we could have maintain the status quo until a new president is elected. Democrats rejected that for whatever reason, and now tens of millions of people will suffer.

This is insane to me. The Democrats won. They got a four month extension of a program that most Republicans are wary of, and they got it in a stand alone Bill. This was total victory. And instead of taking the win, they threw up their middle finger and said screw you to all of the people who were counting on Congress to work this out.

I couldn't agree more.  That said, they are all playing an ugly game.  Dems obviously saw taking the deal as weakness and the Rs offer as a conciliatory gesture -- and countered rather than accepted. Rs got their win-win -- they offered and Dems refused.   They probably calculated that Dems would refuse and they made their chess move.

Dems blew it.  I've never been a fan of either Pelosi or Schumer though I am generally with them ideologically (I thought Reid was even worse than Schumer).  Not sure it's a great compliment but the Rs in this iteration of congress generally seem to play legislative politics far better than the Ds. 

And The People lose.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2020, 12:57:42 PM by Neurotic Guy »

Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2020, 11:32:42 AM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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The Democrats are the ones who've been railroading this administrations since the start (phony Russian dossier and spying on Trump admin. was a start before he even took office).
They are a despicable bunch. They thwart any effort by the other side and then immediately run in front of tv screens to Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again. and moan about their own agendas.
Also, what Obama did at the funeral yesterday was a disgrace.
They are going to own the country to the point where people will lose rights (some subtle, some not so much) and will be their ****es.
I had a lot more to add but gotta run. Should not have even offered up this much.

I disagree with just about every word.  But we have an election coming up and either more Americans will agree with you or they'll agree with me.  Either way --and I say this even if Trump wins -- I hope we can speak more respectfully and less divisively to one another (not you and me, but liberals, conservatives and libertarians generally).  We can't keep doing this.  Pelosi/Schumer, Biden, the dems AND Trump, McConnell, Jordan, Gaetz, and Repubs need to figure out how to speak to America.  If they don't figure this out we are in bigger trouble ahead regardless of the election outcome.

Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #10 on: July 31, 2020, 12:27:21 PM »

Offline chicagoceltic

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Via Politico:

Quote
OVER THE CLIFF — It happened. The Senate left town knowing that failed negotiations would ensure the expiration of enhanced jobless benefits for millions of Americans laid off and furloughed amid the coronavirus pandemic. Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer met late into the night Thursday with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, hoping to break the impasse. But they got nowhere and emerged with acrimony and finger-pointing.

Per our colleagues at Playbook: “Meadows made an offer to extend enhanced unemployment at $600 per week for four months as a stand-alone bill. This is a new offer from the White House, and further than Republicans have gone thus far. It’s an extension of current law -- something the GOP has railed against. Pelosi and Schumer rejected the offer, and countered with extending enhanced unemployment insurance at the same rate -- $600 per week -- through the first quarter of 2021.”

This is exactly what I am talking about. In this case, we could have maintain the status quo until a new president is elected. Democrats rejected that for whatever reason, and now tens of millions of people will suffer.

This is insane to me. The Democrats won. They got a four month extension of a program that most Republicans are wary of, and they got it in a stand alone Bill. This was total victory. And instead of taking the win, they threw up their middle finger and said screw you to all of the people who were counting on Congress to work this out.
Absolutely wrong on the part of the Dems. Also wrong on the Repubs for waiting until the last moment to put up a stimulus plan. Millions of Dems and Repubs will pay because of stupid political games. Somehow these politicians need to remember who and what they work for and it is not votes and getting re-elected.
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #11 on: July 31, 2020, 01:53:58 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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Via Politico:

Quote
OVER THE CLIFF — It happened. The Senate left town knowing that failed negotiations would ensure the expiration of enhanced jobless benefits for millions of Americans laid off and furloughed amid the coronavirus pandemic. Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer met late into the night Thursday with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, hoping to break the impasse. But they got nowhere and emerged with acrimony and finger-pointing.

Per our colleagues at Playbook: “Meadows made an offer to extend enhanced unemployment at $600 per week for four months as a stand-alone bill. This is a new offer from the White House, and further than Republicans have gone thus far. It’s an extension of current law -- something the GOP has railed against. Pelosi and Schumer rejected the offer, and countered with extending enhanced unemployment insurance at the same rate -- $600 per week -- through the first quarter of 2021.”

This is exactly what I am talking about. In this case, we could have maintain the status quo until a new president is elected. Democrats rejected that for whatever reason, and now tens of millions of people will suffer.

This is insane to me. The Democrats won. They got a four month extension of a program that most Republicans are wary of, and they got it in a stand alone Bill. This was total victory. And instead of taking the win, they threw up their middle finger and said screw you to all of the people who were counting on Congress to work this out.
Absolutely wrong on the part of the Dems. Also wrong on the Repubs for waiting until the last moment to put up a stimulus plan. Millions of Dems and Repubs will pay because of stupid political games. Somehow these politicians need to remember who and what they work for and it is not votes and getting re-elected.

Something doesn't jibe with the above "Over the Cliff" version of the story.

Per USA Today, all that Meadows offered was an extension of just one week:

Quote
In dueling press conferences, White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows laid into Democrats for rejecting a short-term deal to continue the bolstered unemployment benefit for one week, while House Speaker Nancy Pelosi railed against Republicans and the Trump administration for attempting to take a piecemeal approach to helping Americans as COVID-19 cases continue to surge nationally.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/31/coronavirus-stimulus-trump-pelosi-cast-blame-unemployment-ends/5554365002/

Politico's main front story on this also indicates it was just one week.

Quote
Republicans offered Thursday to extend the $600 boost for one more week, but Democrats, rejected that offer. Pelosi said Friday the proposal didn’t make sense given how far apart the two sides are on a broader bill. Typically, congressional negotiators will agree to a one-week extension of certain expiring programs to allow time for a larger deal to work its way through both the House and Senate.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/31/white-house-democrats-unemployment-benefits-389540
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #12 on: July 31, 2020, 02:09:13 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Via Politico:

Quote
OVER THE CLIFF — It happened. The Senate left town knowing that failed negotiations would ensure the expiration of enhanced jobless benefits for millions of Americans laid off and furloughed amid the coronavirus pandemic. Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer met late into the night Thursday with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, hoping to break the impasse. But they got nowhere and emerged with acrimony and finger-pointing.

Per our colleagues at Playbook: “Meadows made an offer to extend enhanced unemployment at $600 per week for four months as a stand-alone bill. This is a new offer from the White House, and further than Republicans have gone thus far. It’s an extension of current law -- something the GOP has railed against. Pelosi and Schumer rejected the offer, and countered with extending enhanced unemployment insurance at the same rate -- $600 per week -- through the first quarter of 2021.”

This is exactly what I am talking about. In this case, we could have maintain the status quo until a new president is elected. Democrats rejected that for whatever reason, and now tens of millions of people will suffer.

This is insane to me. The Democrats won. They got a four month extension of a program that most Republicans are wary of, and they got it in a stand alone Bill. This was total victory. And instead of taking the win, they threw up their middle finger and said screw you to all of the people who were counting on Congress to work this out.
Absolutely wrong on the part of the Dems. Also wrong on the Repubs for waiting until the last moment to put up a stimulus plan. Millions of Dems and Repubs will pay because of stupid political games. Somehow these politicians need to remember who and what they work for and it is not votes and getting re-elected.

Something doesn't jibe with the above "Over the Cliff" version of the story.

Per USA Today, all that Meadows offered was an extension of just one week:

Quote
In dueling press conferences, White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows laid into Democrats for rejecting a short-term deal to continue the bolstered unemployment benefit for one week, while House Speaker Nancy Pelosi railed against Republicans and the Trump administration for attempting to take a piecemeal approach to helping Americans as COVID-19 cases continue to surge nationally.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/31/coronavirus-stimulus-trump-pelosi-cast-blame-unemployment-ends/5554365002/

Politico's main front story on this also indicates it was just one week.

Quote
Republicans offered Thursday to extend the $600 boost for one more week, but Democrats, rejected that offer. Pelosi said Friday the proposal didn’t make sense given how far apart the two sides are on a broader bill. Typically, congressional negotiators will agree to a one-week extension of certain expiring programs to allow time for a larger deal to work its way through both the House and Senate.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/31/white-house-democrats-unemployment-benefits-389540

If this is accurate I take back what I said earlier.  Offering 1 week is something Dems should have rejected. 

Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #13 on: July 31, 2020, 02:32:02 PM »

Offline chicagoceltic

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Via Politico:

Quote
OVER THE CLIFF — It happened. The Senate left town knowing that failed negotiations would ensure the expiration of enhanced jobless benefits for millions of Americans laid off and furloughed amid the coronavirus pandemic. Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer met late into the night Thursday with White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin, hoping to break the impasse. But they got nowhere and emerged with acrimony and finger-pointing.

Per our colleagues at Playbook: “Meadows made an offer to extend enhanced unemployment at $600 per week for four months as a stand-alone bill. This is a new offer from the White House, and further than Republicans have gone thus far. It’s an extension of current law -- something the GOP has railed against. Pelosi and Schumer rejected the offer, and countered with extending enhanced unemployment insurance at the same rate -- $600 per week -- through the first quarter of 2021.”

This is exactly what I am talking about. In this case, we could have maintain the status quo until a new president is elected. Democrats rejected that for whatever reason, and now tens of millions of people will suffer.

This is insane to me. The Democrats won. They got a four month extension of a program that most Republicans are wary of, and they got it in a stand alone Bill. This was total victory. And instead of taking the win, they threw up their middle finger and said screw you to all of the people who were counting on Congress to work this out.
Absolutely wrong on the part of the Dems. Also wrong on the Repubs for waiting until the last moment to put up a stimulus plan. Millions of Dems and Repubs will pay because of stupid political games. Somehow these politicians need to remember who and what they work for and it is not votes and getting re-elected.

Something doesn't jibe with the above "Over the Cliff" version of the story.

Per USA Today, all that Meadows offered was an extension of just one week:

Quote
In dueling press conferences, White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows laid into Democrats for rejecting a short-term deal to continue the bolstered unemployment benefit for one week, while House Speaker Nancy Pelosi railed against Republicans and the Trump administration for attempting to take a piecemeal approach to helping Americans as COVID-19 cases continue to surge nationally.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/07/31/coronavirus-stimulus-trump-pelosi-cast-blame-unemployment-ends/5554365002/

Politico's main front story on this also indicates it was just one week.

Quote
Republicans offered Thursday to extend the $600 boost for one more week, but Democrats, rejected that offer. Pelosi said Friday the proposal didn’t make sense given how far apart the two sides are on a broader bill. Typically, congressional negotiators will agree to a one-week extension of certain expiring programs to allow time for a larger deal to work its way through both the House and Senate.
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/07/31/white-house-democrats-unemployment-benefits-389540

If this is accurate I take back what I said earlier.  Offering 1 week is something Dems should have rejected.
I read that originally it was an offer of 1 week and when that was rejected an offer for 4 months was made. Looking at it closer it appears that the 4 month option was a "skinny bill" that would have included 4 months of UI benefits at $400, with $105 billion for schools, liability protections, and some unspecified amount for the Paycheck Protection Program. If that is the case I better understand why the Dems would not allow that to pass...they may never have gotten McConnell to negotiate again if they agreed to that.
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Re: Congress Is Broken
« Reply #14 on: July 31, 2020, 02:38:35 PM »

Offline libermaniac

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The whole political system is broken because of big money and lack of term limits.  It used to be that politicians would consider how they felt about an issue before lending their support to a bill.  Now, they check to see how their party feels about the issue before deciding how they feel.  And because they are concerned about getting re-elected, they don't want to challenge the party line.  So, nothing happens.