Author Topic: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages  (Read 3048 times)

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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #60 on: July 29, 2020, 07:47:38 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

1. obviously they do since people are wearing them. further, simply scan the posts in this thread and you get the same answer - yes, the messages do carry meaning to people.

2. please show your homework on concluding that it is solely, largely, predominately peer pressure that is compelling all these grown men to put messages on their uniforms. and personally i find such messages at this time in the US to be far more palatable than logos/ads for corporations.
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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #61 on: July 29, 2020, 07:57:51 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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This thread is an insufferable reach. Blasting a guy for having “Education Reform” printed across his back (alongside other POC athletes) is insane, and kinda proves his point.


Yet the fact remains that it would've been really easy to avoid this reaction if he'd just put "BLM" on the back of his jersey.  Or even something innocuous like "Freedom" or "Love Us."

That's the definition of cancel culture, PhoSita.  "Just agree with us and we won't condemn your views."

First off, there is no accepted definition of cancel culture, which I think is pretty clear any time that term comes up.

Second, it seems to me that what we as fans want from Hayward is to be a good teammate and help the team win a championship.

I am suggesting that he either made an oblivious or deliberately obstinate choice in selecting what to put on his jersey, when you consider the context of what he's previously put forward publicly about his / his family's views and what the rest of the team chose to put on their jerseys.  Either way, I think it's dumb and it seems likely to distract from the team goal or possibly even create some division with his teammates. 

My biggest concern would be that it's actually demonstrative of an existing rift between him and other teammates about this, but I dont' think we have any reason to think that's the case, as yet.



For me personally, it's also annoying any time that an athlete whose game I really appreciate on a team I love to follow and rep in my personal life does anything to suggest his allegiance with views I find distasteful or repugnant. 

I appreciate that some people might feel that way about athletes who speak out for Black Lives Matter.  A lot of people voiced similar things about Colin Kaepernick.  I'll cop to that bit of cognitive dissonance.  When it comes down to it I appreciate when athletes speak up about racism and systemic oppression.  To the extent athletes I like are Trump supporters or express solidarity with what I personally view as problematic viewpoints, I resent that and wish they'd keep a lid on it. 



Speaking more broadly, I'd love it if being a fan of the Celtics or Patriots were not synonymous to a lot of people with being a racist white guy.  Some people will think that no matter what happens; I get that.  However things like this, it seems to me, incrementally inch the meter in the direction of that perception sticking and growing stronger, instead of fading over time.



In other news, Jaylen Brown continues to speak out very eloquently on subjects of social justice and sounds like a guy who will one day run for public office.  I hope he continues to be a very vocal face / voice of the Celtics for years to come.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2020, 08:03:42 PM by PhoSita »
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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #62 on: July 29, 2020, 08:12:04 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #63 on: July 29, 2020, 08:35:39 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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I think when you're the one white guy on the team and your teammates have a bunch of messages along the lines of "equality," "BLM" etc, it comes across a certain way when you go with "Education Reform."

https://www.opensecrets.org/donor-lookup/results?name=robyn+hayward

Thanks for putting a lid on this...........I dont know why people are so gullible.

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #64 on: July 29, 2020, 08:43:46 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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This just confirms my initial reaction to having messages on jerseys: It's a bad idea.

We've been deprived of basketball for four months, and now that it's back we have to deal with this kind of stuff. "Did you hear what so-and-so picked for a message?" "Oh my goodness, it's scandalous!" "You know what it means, right?"

No, I don't know what it means, because I'm not inside Gordon's head. And I really don't care. Because I'm not interested in these guys for their views on social justice, or their politics; I'm interested in their ability (or lack thereof) to win titles.

It would be great if there were no racism, but it would also be great if people would stop turning anything and everything into an issue of racism, and stop trying to read into everything.
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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #65 on: July 29, 2020, 08:59:42 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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lost in the back and forth here is the departure of two fantastic posters. I do not know who is in charge here, but I would think that some effort should be made to get them back.

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #66 on: July 29, 2020, 09:21:13 PM »

Offline ozgod

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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #67 on: July 29, 2020, 09:29:32 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.
Absolute and utter nonsense. You’re inventing a dog whistle where there is none.

What’s Hayward doing exactly? Sorry, what are Hayward, the Morris twins, DeRozan, McCollum, Bazemore and more doing??

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #68 on: July 29, 2020, 09:30:53 PM »

Offline ozgod

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In addition to McCollom, Kent Bazemore and Garrett Temple both picked Education Reform for their jerseys, I suppose they're racist too

Here's what Garrett had to say. Now close your eyes and pretend that Gordon was the one who said it. If your reaction is different, I suspect the problem is you, not them.



Quote
“I’ve seen a lot of guys say putting stuff on their jerseys is really just window dressing and if that’s what they believe then that’s up to them,” Temple told reporters on a conference call. “There are so many different causes to tackle, unfortunately in our community. We in the Black community have been marginalized so much, there’s so many different things that need to change in order to allow us to get better chances. I think education is something that’s very much needed. It’s fallen by the wayside in most cases. The public school system isn’t nearly where it needs to be in a country as powerful as ours.

https://nothinbutnets.com/2020/07/21/nets-garrett-temple-jersey-education-reform/
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #69 on: July 29, 2020, 10:01:22 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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This^.

Quoted for emphasis.

Can we please bury this imagined, totally-contrived controversy?  Jeezus, there are far more serious issues in the world.
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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #70 on: July 29, 2020, 10:04:44 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.
Absolute and utter nonsense. You’re inventing a dog whistle where there is none.

What’s Hayward doing exactly? Sorry, what are Hayward, the Morris twins, DeRozan, McCollum, Bazemore and more doing??

No, I am not. I have my opinion, you have yours. Hayward is white his minority team mates are fighting for racial justice in America. They need support and solidarity from their white teammate. His failure to express that solidarity speals volumes. And no, printing all the black players that picked education reform does not excuse Hayward's failure to step up to the real issue. Send me a link to anywhere that Hayward as said Black Lives Matter if you can. I bet all those black players you losted believe black lives matter. Do you know where Hayward stands?

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #71 on: July 29, 2020, 10:15:23 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.
Absolute and utter nonsense. You’re inventing a dog whistle where there is none.

What’s Hayward doing exactly? Sorry, what are Hayward, the Morris twins, DeRozan, McCollum, Bazemore and more doing??

No, I am not. I have my opinion, you have yours. Hayward is white his minority team mates are fighting for racial justice in America. They need support and solidarity from their white teammate. His failure to express that solidarity speals volumes. And no, printing all the black players that picked education reform does not excuse Hayward's failure to step up to the real issue. Send me a link to anywhere that Hayward as said Black Lives Matter if you can. I bet all those black players you losted believe black lives matter. Do you know where Hayward stands?

Your opinion is that white + married to a Trump supporter = racist, though.  That’s painting with an overly broad brush.

All of the messages were selected by the PA as being in solidarity with social justice.

I’m curious:  when DeSean Jackson, Stephen Jackson and Nick Cannon were saying terrible things about Jews, your opinion was that nobody should care, because athletes are speaking out of their “lane”.  Yet here, for allegedly not speaking out previously, you’re suggesting Hayward is racist.

It seems like a double standard, no?  Ex using anti-semitism while falsely stereotyping somebody based upon supposition?
« Last Edit: July 29, 2020, 10:20:32 PM by Roy H. »
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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #72 on: July 29, 2020, 10:23:29 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.
Absolute and utter nonsense. You’re inventing a dog whistle where there is none.

What’s Hayward doing exactly? Sorry, what are Hayward, the Morris twins, DeRozan, McCollum, Bazemore and more doing??

No, I am not. I have my opinion, you have yours. Hayward is white his minority team mates are fighting for racial justice in America. They need support and solidarity from their white teammate. His failure to express that solidarity speals volumes. And no, printing all the black players that picked education reform does not excuse Hayward's failure to step up to the real issue. Send me a link to anywhere that Hayward as said Black Lives Matter if you can. I bet all those black players you losted believe black lives matter. Do you know where Hayward stands?

Your opinion is that white + married to a Trump supporter = racist.

All of the messages were selected by the PA as being in solidarity with social justice.

NO, ..you are not racist simply because you are white and married to a Trump supporter. However when given a public platform to express solidarity with your teammates that are involved in a struggle for emancipation and you demur I am not going to act like that did not just happen. He could have done what he did for whatever reason, but it is telling to me that he had a chance to step up, but did not. Again, please link me anywhere that Gordon has expressed solidarity with those fighting for the end to  systemic racism. I am willing to be educated.

I have not labeled Gordon racist.

My position on Desean Jackson and the other Jackson and any other person speaking out of their lane without proper education on the subject remains the same. You can take them seriously. It is just entertainment. I am not losing sleep over Gordon's choice.  I expressed my opinion on his choice just like I expressed my opinion on people going banans over Desean Jackson's ignorance.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2020, 10:31:03 PM by Ogaju »

Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #73 on: July 29, 2020, 10:27:29 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.
Absolute and utter nonsense. You’re inventing a dog whistle where there is none.

What’s Hayward doing exactly? Sorry, what are Hayward, the Morris twins, DeRozan, McCollum, Bazemore and more doing??

No, I am not. I have my opinion, you have yours. Hayward is white his minority team mates are fighting for racial justice in America. They need support and solidarity from their white teammate. His failure to express that solidarity speals volumes. And no, printing all the black players that picked education reform does not excuse Hayward's failure to step up to the real issue. Send me a link to anywhere that Hayward as said Black Lives Matter if you can. I bet all those black players you losted believe black lives matter. Do you know where Hayward stands?

Your opinion is that white + married to a Trump supporter = racist.

All of the messages were selected by the PA as being in solidarity with social justice.

NO, ..you are not racist simply because you are white and married to a Trump supporter. However when given a public platform to express solidarity with your teammates that are involved in a struggle for emancipation and you demur I am not going to act like that did not just happen. He could have done what he did for whatever reason, but it is telling to me that he had a chance to step up, but did not. Again, please link me anywhere that Gordon has expressed solidarity with those fighting for the end to  systemic racism. I am willing to be educated.

Again, you’ve spent hundreds of words previously telling us that celebrity opinions don’t matter, correct?

Quote
After George Floyd was murdered by white police officer Derek Chauvin on May 25 in Minneapolis, Hayward wrote on Twitter that "we cannot grow as a society until we eliminate all forms of racism against any race."

He also joined his Celtics teammates in posting a blackout Twitter profile photo on June 2.

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Re: Celtics Back of the Jersey Messages
« Reply #74 on: July 29, 2020, 10:36:29 PM »

Offline Ogaju

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Stupid.  I wish everybody had followed LeBron’s lead on this. Trite wording on the back of a jersey means nothing. If the players care, they should use their massive platforms and millions of dollars to affect real change.

They can do both.

Do the jersey messages really mean anything to anybody? Particularly when they are a product of peer pressure?

If they did not before, they do now. With Hayward sending a shot across the bow. We are not idiots, we know exactly what he is doing.
Absolute and utter nonsense. You’re inventing a dog whistle where there is none.

What’s Hayward doing exactly? Sorry, what are Hayward, the Morris twins, DeRozan, McCollum, Bazemore and more doing??

No, I am not. I have my opinion, you have yours. Hayward is white his minority team mates are fighting for racial justice in America. They need support and solidarity from their white teammate. His failure to express that solidarity speals volumes. And no, printing all the black players that picked education reform does not excuse Hayward's failure to step up to the real issue. Send me a link to anywhere that Hayward as said Black Lives Matter if you can. I bet all those black players you losted believe black lives matter. Do you know where Hayward stands?

Your opinion is that white + married to a Trump supporter = racist.

All of the messages were selected by the PA as being in solidarity with social justice.

NO, ..you are not racist simply because you are white and married to a Trump supporter. However when given a public platform to express solidarity with your teammates that are involved in a struggle for emancipation and you demur I am not going to act like that did not just happen. He could have done what he did for whatever reason, but it is telling to me that he had a chance to step up, but did not. Again, please link me anywhere that Gordon has expressed solidarity with those fighting for the end to  systemic racism. I am willing to be educated.

Again, you’ve spent hundreds of words previously telling us that celebrity opinions don’t matter, correct?

Quote
After George Floyd was murdered by white police officer Derek Chauvin on May 25 in Minneapolis, Hayward wrote on Twitter that "we cannot grow as a society until we eliminate all forms of racism against any race."

He also joined his Celtics teammates in posting a blackout Twitter profile photo on June 2.


Celebrities do not acquire special knowledge on all topics just because they are celebrities.

Gordon is consistent....... thanks for posting his talking about all races when the issue at hand is the subjugation and police brutality against blacks. Thanks shedding light on the issue.