Author Topic: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots  (Read 2392 times)

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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2020, 09:34:42 AM »

Online KGs Knee

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When a University bans a conservative from making a public speaking engagement because they don't like his message, yes, we are becoming what we fought against in WW2 against the Nazi party and their control of free speech.

Sending federal troops using gestapo tactics into Chicago will result in armed conflict unlike anything we’ve seen in 50+ years.

I think these are both hyperbolic statements, and maybe we should stop comparing things to Nazi methods that clearly fall short.  I get the analogy, but I think it's also possible by continuing to casually use the reference we diminish the seriousness of the terminology, which could be dangerous with the current rise in anti-semitism.

Universities catering to only one ideology and silencing open discussion of ideas is bad.  But it's a far cry from government sponsored silencing of free speech.

Federal agents rounding up protesters is also bad, and IMO much worse than the above, but also not at all the same as murdering political dissenters.

I think we can fairly point out authoritarian actions without invoking references to the Nazis and still make our point.  I'm sure I've been guilty of this as well at some point, but I do think it probably needs to stop.

Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2020, 10:19:22 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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Agreed with KGK.  Public universities suppressing certain viewpoints is potentially a violation of the 14th amendment, but it is still not akin to Nazi Germany.  It’s probably more in common with some of the legal decisions coming down throughout Europe, which are pretty scary in and of themselves. But, that’s a discussion for another thread.
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2020, 10:33:32 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Yeah I reached for a shorthand way of saying secret federal agencies were kidnapping people off the street and taking them to undisclosed locations without due process or jurisdiction at the discretion of our fascist president despite the explicit demands from both the mayor and the governor to stop and leave the city. So I went for the first secret police that kidnapped people in the night I could think of.

And if we really want to label that as hyperbolic, fine. But this is a big deal. This isn't like someone saying you're acting like a nazi because you don't allow them to talk about certain subjects, or comparing you to a nazi because you banned them from a blog or something. This is secret police taking people without identifying themselves, giving the reason for arrest, and taking them to undisclosed locations often without charging them with a crime.

I fail to find a reasonable comparison in actiion from previous executive branches within my lifetime.

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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2020, 10:44:23 AM »

Online KGs Knee

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This is secret police taking people without identifying themselves, giving the reason for arrest, and taking them to undisclosed locations often without charging them with a crime.

I fail to find a reasonable comparison in actiion from previous executive branches within my lifetime.

With this I 100% agree.  Trump is doing things I never thought I'd ever see happen in our country and I don't like it at all.  Everyone, regardless of political affiliation, should be gravely concerned by this.

Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2020, 10:47:34 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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Yeah I reached for a shorthand way of saying secret federal agencies were kidnapping people off the street and taking them to undisclosed locations without due process or jurisdiction at the discretion of our fascist president despite the explicit demands from both the mayor and the governor to stop and leave the city. So I went for the first secret police that kidnapped people in the night I could think of.

And if we really want to label that as hyperbolic, fine. But this is a big deal. This isn't like someone saying you're acting like a nazi because you don't allow them to talk about certain subjects, or comparing you to a nazi because you banned them from a blog or something. This is secret police taking people without identifying themselves, giving the reason for arrest, and taking them to undisclosed locations often without charging them with a crime.

I fail to find a reasonable comparison in actiion from previous executive branches within my lifetime.

“Secret police”?  You mean the guys wearing DHS patches on both arms and large yellow letters on their chest indicating “police”? The DHS agents who have the specific authority to arrest / detain people for crimes against Federal property?  Or the US Marshalls also wearing uniforms?

This is the Nazi oppression?
Quote
The feds haven’t been wearing badges with their names and have been using unmarked cars — for fear of retaliation against the officers involved and mob actions against vehicles. Both are unquestionably legal tactics. According to DHS, the officers are wearing the insignias of their agencies and unique identifiers; they are arresting only people suspected of involvement of attacks on federal property; and they are identifying themselves to arrestees, although not to crowds.

Perhaps these officers should be more clearly identified, but there’s no case whatsoever for calling them, as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has, “stormtroopers” who are “kidnapping protestors.” The arrest of a man named Mark Pettibone has gotten a lot of press attention. He says he did nothing wrong and was arrested by federal agents, who took him to the federal courthouse and read him his Miranda rights, before releasing him.

Quote
Speaking to NPR's All Things Considered on Friday, Homeland Security Acting Deputy Secretary Ken Cuccinelli acknowledged that federal agents had used unmarked vehicles to pick up people in Portland but said it was done to keep officers safe and away from crowds and to move detainees to a "safe location for questioning."

"The one instance I'm familiar with, they were, believed they had identified someone who had assaulted officers or ... the federal building there, the courthouse. Upon questioning, they determined they did not have the right person and that person was released," Cuccinelli said.

"I fully expect that as long as people continue to be violent and to destroy property that we will attempt to identify those folks," he added. "We will pick them up in front of the courthouse. If we spot them elsewhere, we will pick them up elsewhere. And if we have a question about somebody's identity, like the first example I noted to you, after questioning determine it isn't someone of interest, then they get released. And that's standard law enforcement procedure, and it's going to continue as long as the violence continues."

Quote
Customs and Border Protection released a statement Friday about one incident on video, though it did not specify which one. It said its agents approached a person suspected of assaulting federal agents or destroying federal property, but "a large and violent mob moved towards their location" so they moved to a safer place. "The CBP agents identified themselves and were wearing CBP insignia during the encounter. The names of the agents were not displayed due to recent doxing incidents against law enforcement personnel who serve and protect our country."

And again, respectfully, you should probably read up on your history. An alleged 90 minutes in a van with uniformed federal agents and having Miranda read to you in a Federal courthouse isn’t the same as being raped, mass murdered, and having your skin turned into a lampshade.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2020, 11:14:06 AM by Roy H. »
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2020, 10:52:19 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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This is secret police taking people without identifying themselves, giving the reason for arrest, and taking them to undisclosed locations often without charging them with a crime.

I fail to find a reasonable comparison in actiion from previous executive branches within my lifetime.

With this I 100% agree.  Trump is doing things I never thought I'd ever see happen in our country and I don't like it at all.  Everyone, regardless of political affiliation, should be gravely concerned by this.

If I believed this was happening to the degree being stated, I would agree. But, from what I have seen, this is simply federal law enforcement defending federal property. But, to your basic points, I agree:



The above applies even when actions fall well short of Nazism. We should care about all legal rights, not just those of our allies. Inversely, we should all care about the rule of law, and should condemn those who embrace anarchy, rioting, arson and terrorism.

« Last Edit: July 21, 2020, 11:05:22 AM by Roy H. »
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2020, 11:53:33 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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The feds haven’t been wearing badges with their names and have been using unmarked cars — for fear of retaliation against the officers involved and mob actions against vehicles. Both are unquestionably legal tactics. According to DHS, the officers are wearing the insignias of their agencies and unique identifiers; they are arresting only people suspected of involvement of attacks on federal property; and they are identifying themselves to arrestees, although not to crowds.

Perhaps these officers should be more clearly identified, but there’s no case whatsoever for calling them, as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has, “stormtroopers” who are “kidnapping protestors.” The arrest of a man named Mark Pettibone has gotten a lot of press attention. He says he did nothing wrong and was arrested by federal agents, who took him to the federal courthouse and read him his Miranda rights, before releasing him.

All due respect the national review's not really the paper of record here. They're taking everything DHS is saying at face value, and dismissing what the actual governor and mayor and senators are saying from the state, along with dismissing local news and local city employees.Things like this:

Quote
During a video news conference Friday, Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler twice called the federal police in his city President Trump’s “personal army” and said that he is joining a chorus of Oregon’s elected officials in sending a clear message to Washington: “Take your troops out of Portland.”

“This is part of a coordinated strategy out of Trump’s White House to use federal troops to bolster his sagging polling data, and it is an absolute abuse of federal law enforcement officials,” Wheeler said. “As we were starting to see things de-escalate, their actions last Saturday and every night since have actually ratcheted up the tension on our streets.”

Quote
“A peaceful protester in Portland was shot in the head by one of Donald Trump’s secret police,” Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) wrote in a Thursday tweet that also called out acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf. “Now Trump and Chad Wolf are weaponizing the DHS as their own occupying army to provoke violence on the streets of my hometown because they think it plays well with right-wing media.”

I'm sure DHS wants to cast this in a light of legitimacy and the holier than thou shroud of just good ol fashion law enforcement doin' their jobs but I don't see how anyone can take what they or the Trump administration are saying about this with anything besides a boulder of salt.

Quote
(again, from WaPo article above) “I am proud to be among the loud chorus of elected officials calling for the federal troops in Portland’s streets to go home,” Portland Commissioner Jo Ann Hardesty said in a statement shared with The Post on Sunday. “Their presence here has escalated tensions and put countless Portlanders exercising their First Amendment rights in greater danger.”

Quote
Trump has cheered harsh tactics by officers in Portland, and the acting Homeland Security secretary has vowed to keep federal forces in Portland until local leaders “publicly condemn what the violent anarchists are doing.”

“We’ve done a great job in Portland,” Trump said at a news conference on Monday. “Portland was totally out of control, and they went in, and I guess we have many people right now in jail. We very much quelled it, and if it starts again, we’ll quell it again very easily. It’s not hard to do, if you know what you’re doing.”

Yet the scene on Portland’s streets late Thursday reflected a different reality.

Protesters once again filled the streets in downtown, defiantly moving fencing meant to keep the crowd away from the Multnomah County Justice Center. And once again, federal officers launched tear gas into the protest.

As police, both local and federal, have responded to demonstrators with increasing force, the protests have grown more unwieldy and determined. Neither side appears ready to surrender.




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like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #22 on: July 21, 2020, 12:04:16 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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The feds haven’t been wearing badges with their names and have been using unmarked cars — for fear of retaliation against the officers involved and mob actions against vehicles. Both are unquestionably legal tactics. According to DHS, the officers are wearing the insignias of their agencies and unique identifiers; they are arresting only people suspected of involvement of attacks on federal property; and they are identifying themselves to arrestees, although not to crowds.

Perhaps these officers should be more clearly identified, but there’s no case whatsoever for calling them, as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has, “stormtroopers” who are “kidnapping protestors.” The arrest of a man named Mark Pettibone has gotten a lot of press attention. He says he did nothing wrong and was arrested by federal agents, who took him to the federal courthouse and read him his Miranda rights, before releasing him.

All due respect the national review's not really the paper of record here. They're taking everything DHS is saying at face value, and dismissing what the actual governor and mayor and senators are saying from the state, along with dismissing local news and local city employees.Things like this:

Quote
During a video news conference Friday, Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler twice called the federal police in his city President Trump’s “personal army” and said that he is joining a chorus of Oregon’s elected officials in sending a clear message to Washington: “Take your troops out of Portland.”

“This is part of a coordinated strategy out of Trump’s White House to use federal troops to bolster his sagging polling data, and it is an absolute abuse of federal law enforcement officials,” Wheeler said. “As we were starting to see things de-escalate, their actions last Saturday and every night since have actually ratcheted up the tension on our streets.”

Quote
“A peaceful protester in Portland was shot in the head by one of Donald Trump’s secret police,” Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) wrote in a Thursday tweet that also called out acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf. “Now Trump and Chad Wolf are weaponizing the DHS as their own occupying army to provoke violence on the streets of my hometown because they think it plays well with right-wing media.”

I'm sure DHS wants to cast this in a light of legitimacy and the holier than thou shroud of just good ol fashion law enforcement doin' their jobs but I don't see how anyone can take what they or the Trump administration are saying about this with anything besides a boulder of salt.

Quote
(again, from WaPo article above) “I am proud to be among the loud chorus of elected officials calling for the federal troops in Portland’s streets to go home,” Portland Commissioner Jo Ann Hardesty said in a statement shared with The Post on Sunday. “Their presence here has escalated tensions and put countless Portlanders exercising their First Amendment rights in greater danger.”

Quote
Trump has cheered harsh tactics by officers in Portland, and the acting Homeland Security secretary has vowed to keep federal forces in Portland until local leaders “publicly condemn what the violent anarchists are doing.”

“We’ve done a great job in Portland,” Trump said at a news conference on Monday. “Portland was totally out of control, and they went in, and I guess we have many people right now in jail. We very much quelled it, and if it starts again, we’ll quell it again very easily. It’s not hard to do, if you know what you’re doing.”

Yet the scene on Portland’s streets late Thursday reflected a different reality.

Protesters once again filled the streets in downtown, defiantly moving fencing meant to keep the crowd away from the Multnomah County Justice Center. And once again, federal officers launched tear gas into the protest.

As police, both local and federal, have responded to demonstrators with increasing force, the protests have grown more unwieldy and determined. Neither side appears ready to surrender.

If you cannot trust homeland security, then why are you excepting the words of far left politicians without scrutiny?

Portland is probably in the top three of most liberal large cities in the United States. You think they’re city commissioners have no agenda here? Why don’t you consider the words of the place themselves, as stated through their union president?

Quote from: July 8
The executive board of the Portland police rank-and-file union voted “no confidence'' in Portland’s City Council, questioning why city commissioners aren’t condemning the violence, fires and damage to businesses occurring in the city at the hands of some demonstrators.


Officer Daryl Turner, president of the Portland Police Association, on Wednesday repeated a criticism he has made in the last week that “a small number of people have hijacked'' important calls for social justice and racial equity and “used the cover of peaceful protests to burn and loot our City.”

Turner also at a news conference released an eight-point plan with suggestions on how to address changes that many police critics are demanding, though his ideas are called “Fund police reform” -- the opposite of a rallying cry among reformers to redistribute money from police budgets or abolish police departments entirely.


He said he has no confidence the City Council will stop the protest violence or support the sworn officers on the streets and guide the Police Bureau into a new era of policing that prioritizes community safety. Repairs for damage to public buildings is estimated in court documents to approach $300,000 and nearly $5 million in property damage to businesses.


“If City Council won’t stand up for Portland,‘' he said. “We will.”

Quote from: July 19
Hours before what is expected to be the 53rd straight night of protests in the city, the head of the Portland police union said the community has “had enough.”

Portland Police Association President Daryl Turner, surrounded by 20 faith leaders, business owners, police officers and neighborhood residents, held a news conference in front of the union’s offices in North Portland. On Saturday, protesters broke in and lit a fire inside. The building itself was covered with graffiti.


“The elected officials have condoned the destruction and chaos,” said Turner. “They have placed their political agenda ahead safety and welfare of the community. This must stop.”

Demonstrations in Portland began almost two months ago following the police killing of George Floyd, a Black man who died in custody after a police officer pressed his knee on Floyd’s neck for over eight minutes.

The police union has become a focal point for protesters, who see it as one of the power structures that prevents police reform. The union building, a symbol of that resistance, has been previously targeted by protestors.
“This is no longer about George Floyd, racial equity, social justice reform or the evolution of policing,” Turner said. “This is about violence, rioting and destruction. Our city is under siege by rioters.”

His comments echo those from the Trump administration, which has focused on Portland’s demonstration.


Local and state leaders have vocally opposed the presence of federal officers in Portland, Oregon’s attorney general plans to sue several federal law enforcement agencies over their actions, and the state’s U.S. attorney has requested investigation into reported arrests of Portland protesters picked up in unmarked vehicles.

At the press conference Pastor J.J.W. Matt Hennessee of Vancouver Avenue First Baptist Church issued a call for protestors to have “moratorium” on future demonstrations.

“We love you as God’s children, but we don’t like what you are doing,” he said. “Tell us where to meet you so we can have a conversation about to work together for solutions. Take Portland off the front page of newspapers around the world because of violence.”

« Last Edit: July 21, 2020, 12:11:28 PM by Roy H. »
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #23 on: July 21, 2020, 12:41:50 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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If you cannot trust homeland security, then why are you excepting the words of far left politicians without scrutiny?

Portland is probably in the top three of most liberal large cities in the United States. You think they’re city commissioners have no agenda here? Why don’t you consider the words of the place themselves, as stated through their union president?

Well, most likely because despite Portland's reputation as a liberal bastion, they've actually got an extremely complex relationship with white supremacists and racist police tactics, and protecting bad cops, allowing them back on duty, and protecting them again.

Respectfully I'd suggest you do your research here. The Portland PD and the Portland police union are not known as 'keep Portland weird' kind of people. This is a pretty complex city in a pretty complex state that people like to write off as a bunch of uber-liberal coffee snobs and Portlandia sketches but the actual city and state history is pretty grim when it comes to racism and police tactics.

So yeah, I expect the police union and the police department to be pretty negative about the protestors. They've got people running through their streets chanting ACAB every night and they keep on showing up no matter how much tear gas and hopefully non-lethal bullets get thrown their way. On top of that police officers every night have to go out there in full riot gear during a pandemic and beat the living crap out of protestors, and in the dead of summer no less. They probably hate it too. I'm sure everyone hates it.

But there is really no reason to trust the Portland PD or their union reps here. Sure they want to say this is just about violence. It means that the violence they're inflicting on protestors will be seen as retaliatory or deserved. Sure he's saying they're all vandals and rioters. It means when they violate their rights, they're just punishing criminals so it's okay.

It's not okay. The police union president should be smarter than to hitch his wagon to this train.

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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #24 on: July 21, 2020, 12:48:35 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Quote
The feds haven’t been wearing badges with their names and have been using unmarked cars — for fear of retaliation against the officers involved and mob actions against vehicles. Both are unquestionably legal tactics. According to DHS, the officers are wearing the insignias of their agencies and unique identifiers; they are arresting only people suspected of involvement of attacks on federal property; and they are identifying themselves to arrestees, although not to crowds.

Perhaps these officers should be more clearly identified, but there’s no case whatsoever for calling them, as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has, “stormtroopers” who are “kidnapping protestors.” The arrest of a man named Mark Pettibone has gotten a lot of press attention. He says he did nothing wrong and was arrested by federal agents, who took him to the federal courthouse and read him his Miranda rights, before releasing him.

All due respect the national review's not really the paper of record here. They're taking everything DHS is saying at face value, and dismissing what the actual governor and mayor and senators are saying from the state, along with dismissing local news and local city employees.Things like this:

Quote
During a video news conference Friday, Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler twice called the federal police in his city President Trump’s “personal army” and said that he is joining a chorus of Oregon’s elected officials in sending a clear message to Washington: “Take your troops out of Portland.”

“This is part of a coordinated strategy out of Trump’s White House to use federal troops to bolster his sagging polling data, and it is an absolute abuse of federal law enforcement officials,” Wheeler said. “As we were starting to see things de-escalate, their actions last Saturday and every night since have actually ratcheted up the tension on our streets.”

Quote
“A peaceful protester in Portland was shot in the head by one of Donald Trump’s secret police,” Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) wrote in a Thursday tweet that also called out acting DHS secretary Chad Wolf. “Now Trump and Chad Wolf are weaponizing the DHS as their own occupying army to provoke violence on the streets of my hometown because they think it plays well with right-wing media.”

I'm sure DHS wants to cast this in a light of legitimacy and the holier than thou shroud of just good ol fashion law enforcement doin' their jobs but I don't see how anyone can take what they or the Trump administration are saying about this with anything besides a boulder of salt.

Quote
(again, from WaPo article above) “I am proud to be among the loud chorus of elected officials calling for the federal troops in Portland’s streets to go home,” Portland Commissioner Jo Ann Hardesty said in a statement shared with The Post on Sunday. “Their presence here has escalated tensions and put countless Portlanders exercising their First Amendment rights in greater danger.”

Quote
Trump has cheered harsh tactics by officers in Portland, and the acting Homeland Security secretary has vowed to keep federal forces in Portland until local leaders “publicly condemn what the violent anarchists are doing.”

“We’ve done a great job in Portland,” Trump said at a news conference on Monday. “Portland was totally out of control, and they went in, and I guess we have many people right now in jail. We very much quelled it, and if it starts again, we’ll quell it again very easily. It’s not hard to do, if you know what you’re doing.”

Yet the scene on Portland’s streets late Thursday reflected a different reality.

Protesters once again filled the streets in downtown, defiantly moving fencing meant to keep the crowd away from the Multnomah County Justice Center. And once again, federal officers launched tear gas into the protest.

As police, both local and federal, have responded to demonstrators with increasing force, the protests have grown more unwieldy and determined. Neither side appears ready to surrender.

If you cannot trust homeland security, then why are you excepting the words of far left politicians without scrutiny?

Portland is probably in the top three of most liberal large cities in the United States. You think they’re city commissioners have no agenda here? Why don’t you consider the words of the place themselves, as stated through their union president?

Quote from: July 8
The executive board of the Portland police rank-and-file union voted “no confidence'' in Portland’s City Council, questioning why city commissioners aren’t condemning the violence, fires and damage to businesses occurring in the city at the hands of some demonstrators.


Officer Daryl Turner, president of the Portland Police Association, on Wednesday repeated a criticism he has made in the last week that “a small number of people have hijacked'' important calls for social justice and racial equity and “used the cover of peaceful protests to burn and loot our City.”

Turner also at a news conference released an eight-point plan with suggestions on how to address changes that many police critics are demanding, though his ideas are called “Fund police reform” -- the opposite of a rallying cry among reformers to redistribute money from police budgets or abolish police departments entirely.


He said he has no confidence the City Council will stop the protest violence or support the sworn officers on the streets and guide the Police Bureau into a new era of policing that prioritizes community safety. Repairs for damage to public buildings is estimated in court documents to approach $300,000 and nearly $5 million in property damage to businesses.


“If City Council won’t stand up for Portland,‘' he said. “We will.”

Quote from: July 19
Hours before what is expected to be the 53rd straight night of protests in the city, the head of the Portland police union said the community has “had enough.”

Portland Police Association President Daryl Turner, surrounded by 20 faith leaders, business owners, police officers and neighborhood residents, held a news conference in front of the union’s offices in North Portland. On Saturday, protesters broke in and lit a fire inside. The building itself was covered with graffiti.


“The elected officials have condoned the destruction and chaos,” said Turner. “They have placed their political agenda ahead safety and welfare of the community. This must stop.”

Demonstrations in Portland began almost two months ago following the police killing of George Floyd, a Black man who died in custody after a police officer pressed his knee on Floyd’s neck for over eight minutes.

The police union has become a focal point for protesters, who see it as one of the power structures that prevents police reform. The union building, a symbol of that resistance, has been previously targeted by protestors.
“This is no longer about George Floyd, racial equity, social justice reform or the evolution of policing,” Turner said. “This is about violence, rioting and destruction. Our city is under siege by rioters.”

His comments echo those from the Trump administration, which has focused on Portland’s demonstration.


Local and state leaders have vocally opposed the presence of federal officers in Portland, Oregon’s attorney general plans to sue several federal law enforcement agencies over their actions, and the state’s U.S. attorney has requested investigation into reported arrests of Portland protesters picked up in unmarked vehicles.

At the press conference Pastor J.J.W. Matt Hennessee of Vancouver Avenue First Baptist Church issued a call for protestors to have “moratorium” on future demonstrations.

“We love you as God’s children, but we don’t like what you are doing,” he said. “Tell us where to meet you so we can have a conversation about to work together for solutions. Take Portland off the front page of newspapers around the world because of violence.”

I understand the jaundice high towards Trump, and I will except your word on it regarding Portland police.  My issue is more with the uncritical acceptance of the words of local officials.  Apply the same standard to them.
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #25 on: July 21, 2020, 04:41:45 PM »

Offline sgrogan

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Does anybody know the accuracy of this https://www.governing.com/topics/public-justice-safety/tns-portland-ice-wheeler.html
Specifically
Quote
When the protest began, Wheeler announced that he would not allow Portland police officers to be "sucked into a conflict" over the protest and said federal police would be responsible for protecting their own building and property.
This is from 2018

Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #26 on: July 21, 2020, 04:58:04 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Does anybody know the accuracy of this https://www.governing.com/topics/public-justice-safety/tns-portland-ice-wheeler.html
Specifically
Quote
When the protest began, Wheeler announced that he would not allow Portland police officers to be "sucked into a conflict" over the protest and said federal police would be responsible for protecting their own building and property.
This is from 2018

That’s pretty wild.  So he advanced contrary jurisdictional arguments to take the pro-violence, anti-police side on each occasion.
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #27 on: July 21, 2020, 05:01:55 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I split this off. The discussion is thread where the, but is far from the original topic.
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Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #28 on: July 21, 2020, 05:06:18 PM »

Offline sgrogan

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Does anybody know the accuracy of this https://www.governing.com/topics/public-justice-safety/tns-portland-ice-wheeler.html
Specifically
Quote
When the protest began, Wheeler announced that he would not allow Portland police officers to be "sucked into a conflict" over the protest and said federal police would be responsible for protecting their own building and property.
This is from 2018
Not "anti-police" I believe that in Portland the mayor is the police commissioner. It explains why "police" reaction publicly is from the police union. The more I look the more I agree with indeedproceed that Portland, is indeed complicated, from all sides.

Re: Federal law enforcement in US cities / Portland riots
« Reply #29 on: July 21, 2020, 05:13:50 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Does anybody know the accuracy of this https://www.governing.com/topics/public-justice-safety/tns-portland-ice-wheeler.html
Specifically
Quote
When the protest began, Wheeler announced that he would not allow Portland police officers to be "sucked into a conflict" over the protest and said federal police would be responsible for protecting their own building and property.
This is from 2018
Not "anti-police" I believe that in Portland the mayor is the police commissioner. It explains why "police" reaction publicly is from the police union. The more I look the more I agree with indeedproceed that Portland, is indeed complicated, from all sides.

Yes, in this case the mayor is the police commissioner, although he has the right to assign that to another member of the city Council. However, he is not exactly an advocate for the police, and is on board with massively slashing their budget. Meanwhile, there are multiple unions that represent police officers. I believe Portland has a rank and file union, and an officers union.

Another Lair is that Wheeler has in fact requested help from the National Guard, but the Oregon governor has refused it on multiple occasions.
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