Author Topic: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden  (Read 15232 times)

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Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #45 on: May 11, 2020, 08:44:15 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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An intriguing name being floated out recently for Biden's VP is Tammy Duckworth. How do you guys feel about her?

Immediate thought:



Next thought:  Is she eligible, having been born in Thailand? 
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Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #46 on: May 11, 2020, 09:01:52 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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An intriguing name being floated out recently for Biden's VP is Tammy Duckworth. How do you guys feel about her?

I've not been terribly impressed with Duckworth as a speaker.  She certainly has military bona fides and checks a lot of boxes in terms of "identity" -- woman, woman of color, veteran, disabled veteran. Good age (52), good amount of experience in government.  Not much, if anything, in terms of private sector business experience. She's a moderate -- supports sensible gun-control and is a gun owner.  Long history of family military service.   So I think she'd be a decent choice -- not to me an overly great choice despite her inspirational story. One question I think I know the answer to, but she was not born on US soil, though her father was on military (or diplomatic) assignment in Asia.  I assume that is not a disqualifier.  My reticence about her is solely because I haven't been all that impressed with her when I hear her speak, that's all. 

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #47 on: May 11, 2020, 09:05:50 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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An intriguing name being floated out recently for Biden's VP is Tammy Duckworth. How do you guys feel about her?

Immediate thought:



Next thought:  Is she eligible, having been born in Thailand?

Looked it up.  She's eligible.  Was a US citizen -- father's family goes back to Revolutionary War.  He was on assignment of some sort in Thailand.  Unfortunately no relation to Kevin Duckworth.

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #48 on: May 11, 2020, 10:11:34 PM »

Offline blink

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If it is anyone other than Warren or Harris at this point, I would def be surprised.
I have nothing against Duckworth, she always speaks her mind which I like.  I just doubt that she will be Biden's VP.
« Last Edit: May 11, 2020, 10:35:50 PM by blink »

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #49 on: May 11, 2020, 10:29:32 PM »

Offline cons

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Yeah. Duckworth. Works for me. She seems to be a genuine article. I’d vote for her.  Hoping it’s her.

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #50 on: May 12, 2020, 06:36:40 AM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Two dark horse VP candidates:
1. Michele Lujan Grisham
2. Keisha Lance Bottoms

Grisham is gov of New Mexico.  Latinx woman, 61, Attorney, former Heath commissioner in NM, former Congresswoman who chaired Hispanic Caucus, seems to have handled Covid well in NM.  Good vote getter

Bottoms is Mayor of Atlanta, 50, African American, Attorney, has been a big Biden supporter.  An articulate voice during the pandemic. Has spoken out strongly but respectfully in response to Georgia’s potentially premature opening. Is again in news responding to the Atlanta neighborhood shooting.

Bottoms is bigger long shot but wouldn’t rule her out. I think she may be the most smoothly articulate candidate of all with the exception of Warren - who to me is a net negative. 

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #51 on: May 12, 2020, 08:30:02 AM »

Offline slamtheking

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Two dark horse VP candidates:
1. Michele Lujan Grisham
2. Keisha Lance Bottoms

Grisham is gov of New Mexico.  Latinx woman, 61, Attorney, former Heath commissioner in NM, former Congresswoman who chaired Hispanic Caucus, seems to have handled Covid well in NM.  Good vote getter

Bottoms is Mayor of Atlanta, 50, African American, Attorney, has been a big Biden supporter.  An articulate voice during the pandemic. Has spoken out strongly but respectfully in response to Georgia’s potentially premature opening. Is again in news responding to the Atlanta neighborhood shooting.

Bottoms is bigger long shot but wouldn’t rule her out. I think she may be the most smoothly articulate candidate of all with the exception of Warren - who to me is a net negative. 

I'm pretty confident Biden goes with someone who's known nationally that's either a sitting governor or in Congress.  I like Abrams and Bottoms as two people who seem to be pretty smart and to the best of my knowledge, ethical, but they need some higher-level govt experience.

Grisham's gotten a little traction lately.  wouldn't mind her as VP.

Having said that, I can't imagine that Biden's VP pick would stop someone from voting for him (other than Hillary or possibly Warren) since I'd have to imagine people would know at this point if they want another 4 years of Trump or not. 
« Last Edit: May 12, 2020, 08:36:29 AM by slamtheking »

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #52 on: May 12, 2020, 03:34:34 PM »

Online hwangjini_1

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An intriguing name being floated out recently for Biden's VP is Tammy Duckworth. How do you guys feel about her?

I've not been terribly impressed with Duckworth as a speaker.  She certainly has military bona fides and checks a lot of boxes in terms of "identity" -- woman, woman of color, veteran, disabled veteran. Good age (52), good amount of experience in government.  Not much, if anything, in terms of private sector business experience. She's a moderate -- supports sensible gun-control and is a gun owner.  Long history of family military service.   So I think she'd be a decent choice -- not to me an overly great choice despite her inspirational story. One question I think I know the answer to, but she was not born on US soil, though her father was on military (or diplomatic) assignment in Asia.  I assume that is not a disqualifier. My reticence about her is solely because I haven't been all that impressed with her when I hear her speak, that's all.

bing, bing, bing, bing! Give the poster a cigar! you are correct sir. please see below.

Most Americans believe that the term natural born citizen applies only to someone born on American soil. That is incorrect. Citizenship is not based on geography alone; it can also be based on blood. The citizenship status of the parents can determine citizenship of a child in the United States.


The term natural born citizen applies to the child of at least one parent who is an American citizen. Children whose parents are American citizens are not required to be naturalized because they are natural born citizens. Therefore, they are eligible to serve as president, even if they are born in a foreign country.

https://www.thoughtco.com/presidents-not-born-in-the-us-3368103
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Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #53 on: May 12, 2020, 04:29:52 PM »

Offline celts10

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If it is anyone other than Warren or Harris at this point, I would def be surprised.
I have nothing against Duckworth, she always speaks her mind which I like.  I just doubt that she will be Biden's VP.

I think Harris would be much better as AG than VP. Warren is a numbers cruncher and a thorn in the banking industry's side which makes her better suited for Senate work. Besides, if she gets the VP the governor gets to nominate a Senator to replace her which gives the Republicans another senator for free.

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #54 on: May 12, 2020, 04:33:30 PM »

Offline celts10

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Two dark horse VP candidates:
1. Michele Lujan Grisham
2. Keisha Lance Bottoms

Grisham is gov of New Mexico.  Latinx woman, 61, Attorney, former Heath commissioner in NM, former Congresswoman who chaired Hispanic Caucus, seems to have handled Covid well in NM.  Good vote getter

If Biden is confident in his ability to win the midwest, then perhaps Grisham is the answer to his latino problem.


Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #55 on: May 12, 2020, 04:36:44 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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just beat Trump


Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #56 on: May 13, 2020, 11:43:53 AM »

Offline boscel33

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I've read quite a few of the rumors.  Some appear to be very valid candidates, others I think are pipe dreams and if he chooses one of those, could be like McCain/Palin.  I guess I would love Klobachar, she's who I voted for in the primary prior to everyone dropping.  I'd like to see Harris as AG which is why I didn't choose her for VP. 
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Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #57 on: May 13, 2020, 01:43:37 PM »

Online mmmmm

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An intriguing name being floated out recently for Biden's VP is Tammy Duckworth. How do you guys feel about her?

I've not been terribly impressed with Duckworth as a speaker.  She certainly has military bona fides and checks a lot of boxes in terms of "identity" -- woman, woman of color, veteran, disabled veteran. Good age (52), good amount of experience in government.  Not much, if anything, in terms of private sector business experience. She's a moderate -- supports sensible gun-control and is a gun owner.  Long history of family military service.   So I think she'd be a decent choice -- not to me an overly great choice despite her inspirational story. One question I think I know the answer to, but she was not born on US soil, though her father was on military (or diplomatic) assignment in Asia.  I assume that is not a disqualifier. My reticence about her is solely because I haven't been all that impressed with her when I hear her speak, that's all.

bing, bing, bing, bing! Give the poster a cigar! you are correct sir. please see below.

Most Americans believe that the term natural born citizen applies only to someone born on American soil. That is incorrect. Citizenship is not based on geography alone; it can also be based on blood. The citizenship status of the parents can determine citizenship of a child in the United States.


The term natural born citizen applies to the child of at least one parent who is an American citizen. Children whose parents are American citizens are not required to be naturalized because they are natural born citizens. Therefore, they are eligible to serve as president, even if they are born in a foreign country.

https://www.thoughtco.com/presidents-not-born-in-the-us-3368103

You are mostly describing birthright citizenship.

Unfortunately, as far as I know, the exact legal meaning of "natural born Citizen" (in particular as it applies to eligibility for POTUS or VPOTUS) has never been completely and officially codified, either in law or through SCOTUS decision.   The Constitution uses the term, but does not define it.

Most definitions and usage that I am aware of is consistent with the term referring to people born within the boundaries of the United States, it's Territories and Districts.

I believe that most common current usage considers that to also includes US sovereign locations such as on board US flagged vehicles (ships, aircraft), embassies and most military bases.   This would be consistent with both the William Rawle (1825) interpretation combined with Wilson's (1866) exception for children born of foreign embassy personnel (or say, hypothetical hostile soldiers occupying US soil).  The latter point being inverted for US personnel abroad.  If we say that the citizenship of children borne of such foreign operatives on US soil belongs to those foreign nations, then we have to consider the citizenship of children of US operatives abroad to belong to the US.

If Duckworth, for example, were born on a military base hospital ('don't know if that is the case) and/or as a child of a parent who is operating as a US operative abroad (not just a citizen traveling abroad but also one charged by the US to be abroad), that would probably qualifier her in the eyes of most folks who think about this as a "natural born citizen'.

The caveat being:  This definition has not actually ever been completely codified in law or via judicial interpretation.   And there are many who hold with much stricter (or more expansive) interpretations.   Often, of course, for partisan reasons.

Note:  I personally have no strong opinion on Duckworth as a VP choice.   I just find the 'natural born citizen' question interesting.
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Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #58 on: May 13, 2020, 01:55:53 PM »

Offline Amonkey

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An intriguing name being floated out recently for Biden's VP is Tammy Duckworth. How do you guys feel about her?

I've not been terribly impressed with Duckworth as a speaker.  She certainly has military bona fides and checks a lot of boxes in terms of "identity" -- woman, woman of color, veteran, disabled veteran. Good age (52), good amount of experience in government.  Not much, if anything, in terms of private sector business experience. She's a moderate -- supports sensible gun-control and is a gun owner.  Long history of family military service.   So I think she'd be a decent choice -- not to me an overly great choice despite her inspirational story. One question I think I know the answer to, but she was not born on US soil, though her father was on military (or diplomatic) assignment in Asia.  I assume that is not a disqualifier. My reticence about her is solely because I haven't been all that impressed with her when I hear her speak, that's all.

bing, bing, bing, bing! Give the poster a cigar! you are correct sir. please see below.

Most Americans believe that the term natural born citizen applies only to someone born on American soil. That is incorrect. Citizenship is not based on geography alone; it can also be based on blood. The citizenship status of the parents can determine citizenship of a child in the United States.


The term natural born citizen applies to the child of at least one parent who is an American citizen. Children whose parents are American citizens are not required to be naturalized because they are natural born citizens. Therefore, they are eligible to serve as president, even if they are born in a foreign country.

https://www.thoughtco.com/presidents-not-born-in-the-us-3368103

You are mostly describing birthright citizenship.

Unfortunately, as far as I know, the exact legal meaning of "natural born Citizen" (in particular as it applies to eligibility for POTUS or VPOTUS) has never been completely and officially codified, either in law or through SCOTUS decision.   The Constitution uses the term, but does not define it.

Most definitions and usage that I am aware of is consistent with the term referring to people born within the boundaries of the United States, it's Territories and Districts.

I believe that most common current usage considers that to also includes US sovereign locations such as on board US flagged vehicles (ships, aircraft), embassies and most military bases.   This would be consistent with both the William Rawle (1825) interpretation combined with Wilson's (1866) exception for children born of foreign embassy personnel (or say, hypothetical hostile soldiers occupying US soil).  The latter point being inverted for US personnel abroad.  If we say that the citizenship of children borne of such foreign operatives on US soil belongs to those foreign nations, then we have to consider the citizenship of children of US operatives abroad to belong to the US.

If Duckworth, for example, were born on a military base hospital ('don't know if that is the case) and/or as a child of a parent who is operating as a US operative abroad (not just a citizen traveling abroad but also one charged by the US to be abroad), that would probably qualifier her in the eyes of most folks who think about this as a "natural born citizen'.

The caveat being:  This definition has not actually ever been completely codified in law or via judicial interpretation.   And there are many who hold with much stricter (or more expansive) interpretations.   Often, of course, for partisan reasons.

Note:  I personally have no strong opinion on Duckworth as a VP choice.   I just find the 'natural born citizen' question interesting.

I thought it was hilarious how there was the whole 'Obama birth certificate' thing yet, the late John McCain was actually born in Panama and no one batted an eye.
Baby Jesus!

Re: Time to handicap potential VEEP candidates for Biden
« Reply #59 on: May 13, 2020, 02:34:38 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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I think based on current US trends, if Biden wants to win, he should pick either Michelle Obama or Oprah. You need celebrity status, name recognition above all else unfortunately. Those two have it, along with a broad level of respect from the US population. Also, a Biden-Obama ticket would be VERY impactful.